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Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Old Jun 8th 2023, 2:41 am
  #16  
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by Penpact
Please note Spain has been ordered to make changes to 2 of its tax related laws already
I assume you mean EU ruling that non-residents pay same level of succession tax as residents?
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 2:42 am
  #17  
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by Penpact
people say
There is no DTA with Spain when it comes to inheritance tax.
I think that is misguided..it is still in force and mentions 'other'taxes

The dta takes precedence over other laws with things like residence, who is classed as a fiscal resident. According to this I am a British fiscal and maybe Spain too! In which case nationality decides!!!

Also none of these comments people have made are answering my questions. I am not asking for advice. Some rules are clear and others not .

👍🏿[/QUOTE]

What is still in force?
Which rules are not clear?
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 2:44 am
  #18  
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by Penpact
Many laws have been changed due to unfairness... And if you read carefully I also talk about different interpretations of this tax law or Dta...it does exist for inheritance.. it talks about 'other' taxes. Once again I do not need your advice, however helpful you are trying to be.
What is it then you want?
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 3:10 am
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by Penpact
Please note Spain has been ordered to make changes to 2 of its tax related laws already
The EU as you say have told Spain to modify certain taxes yes. These are the taxes that the EU has some control over. I don't think that the EU has the control over Spanish taxes on succession to enforce them to have a blanket rate over all Spain's autonomous regions. For instance automomous regions set varying rates for annual car tax that's up to Spain and it's regions. The EU can't force all eu countries to have one type of rate for inheritance tax because individual countries tax it differently some as succession as in Spain some on the inheritance of the estate from a deceased as in the UK. Spain has made concessions already, in that with wills for residents who aren't citizens with signed wills can state they want say British inheritance rules to apply rather than Spanish succession rules, the will must expressly state this. This link explains difference between say UK and Spanish inheritance rules. I have searched on line and everything I read states that the UK double tax treaty does not apply re inheritance tax in Spain . I have to agree with Ronnyone I don't really know what you want for an answer as I was lost with your opening post. You are clearly angry over something to do with this tax but don't really say what? Are you just looking for others to join you petitioning the EU to force Spain to change its inheritance tax? You say you don't want advise yet argue against those that present information re double tax . I have provided a link that explains succession tax and difference to inheritance tax . I have no personal experience of this tax to be fair.
https://www.blacktowerfm.com/news/sp...%20or%20other.

Last edited by bobd22; Jun 8th 2023 at 3:14 am.
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 3:22 am
  #20  
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by Penpact
people say
There is no DTA with Spain when it comes to inheritance tax.
I think that is misguided..it is still in force and mentions 'other'taxes

The dta takes precedence over other laws with things like residence, who is classed as a fiscal resident. According to this I am a British fiscal and maybe Spain too! In which case nationality decides!!!

Also none of these comments people have made are answering my questions. I am not asking for advice. Some rules are clear and others not .

👍🏿[/QUOTE]


I answered and it was clear.

Just declare everything everywhere, stop trying to look for a loop hole or a way to not pay....

As said, I pay twice the amount of tax here than I would in the UK and if I was still taxed in the Uk (Im not as Ive put in a tax return here and got the fiscal form to say Spain is the only place I want to be taxed) then BOTH countries in this instance would take money off me as Spain has a higher tax burden that the UK.
Id pay Uk tax and then you would claim that tax paid off the tax demand here... Its so simple I think my goldfish could understand (well maybe not with his 3 second memory).....

That in a nutshell is ALL the DTA is.

When my dad finally snuffs it I will have half of his house to sell. In the UK if there is tax to pay he (or the estate) will have to pay it. Then if there is tax to pay here in Spain I will as I am the beneficiary..
The DTA has no standing here as the two types of tax are different. Dead people here dont owe taxes (they do in the UK).

I cant see what your issue is to be honest..
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 3:45 am
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Obviously nothing short of a "oo yes isn't it awful, shouldn't be allowed" response will satisfy the OP so we are all wasting our time.
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 4:59 am
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

I am sorry you feel no one has answered your question. Your opening post only has one question mark.
even though several said 'no' or 'not property' according to the DTA, that there is the tax law of 1987?,
What caught my attention in your post was.
Also, unfairness, in the regional variations,
In response I gave you some links about the system of taxation here in Spain.
I appreciate that the UK is no longer in the EU. But when it was and until now do you realise there are differing tax regimes, in the various countries that make up the UK? That is the same as here in Spain. I cannot recall anyone who went to the EU (when it was possible) to complain about that.
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 5:22 pm
  #23  
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

This situation for me arose in 2020 with an inheritance from my aunt. Unfortunately what I did not realise is that the tax authorities must be informed of the inheritance within six months from the date of death even if the money has not been received. The notification must be renewed every six months until the money is received. The tax rates depend on the degree of relationship between the deceased and the beneficiary, in my case it was a third degree of separation so not much in the way of mitigating the tax payable. In Spain the beneficiary is taxed not the estate.

Had I sought advice rather than wait for the funds to arrive and then enquire about how to declare this I would have saved a bit of money by not paying a late notification fine. I engaged a lawyer to sort this situation out, they calculated the IHT payable and liaised with the Tributaria and subsequently transferred the funds to resolve the matter.

I was told that if the inheritance was not declared then tax would not be payable after a period of time, 5 years I think had elapsed. I am too old to be trying this sort of thing on so for peace of mind I paid what was owed. It was a bit painful but it is the law and I can sleep peacefully at night.

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Old Jun 8th 2023, 7:44 pm
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by Ronnyone
What is it then you want?
They were looking for personal experience and possibly someone to join in with the fruitless complaint. I have no experience with this either but I'll add something just for fun.

When the awful day arrives I'll try to complete the correct form with guidance here:
Instrucciones_mod650_en_gb.pdf (agenciatributaria.es)
Then accept that there's a very good reason why I pay an accountant a few Euros per month and hand it over to him. What I won't do is ask a bloke in the pub about the law, start looking for a new car and book a holiday before the liabilities are taken care of.

The Agencia Tributaria portal is actually very user friendly but I don't trust myself with these matters so it's easier to let a professional deal with it.
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 8:40 pm
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by SanNico
They were looking for personal experience and possibly someone to join in with the fruitless complaint. I have no experience with this either but I'll add something just for fun.

When the awful day arrives I'll try to complete the correct form with guidance here:
Instrucciones_mod650_en_gb.pdf (agenciatributaria.es)
Then accept that there's a very good reason why I pay an accountant a few Euros per month and hand it over to him. What I won't do is ask a bloke in the pub about the law, start looking for a new car and book a holiday before the liabilities are taken care of.

The Agencia Tributaria portal is actually very user friendly but I don't trust myself with these matters so it's easier to let a professional deal with it.
I have had experience of this about 10 years ago but it involved my wife inheriting and due to a lack of a will we just waited it out 4 years - so not much of an experience. Recently I have had to get information about it due to being made a POA. I am pretty much up to date on it vis a vis Valencia. I can assure people that if you are inheriting a fairly sizeable amount from uk you will need a Spanish lawyer and should expect a bill of around 1000-2000 €. The paperwork involved is complex as is the use of unilateral relief which is a separate process.
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 10:12 pm
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by NABman
This situation for me arose in 2020 with an inheritance from my aunt. Unfortunately what I did not realise is that the tax authorities must be informed of the inheritance within six months from the date of death even if the money has not been received. The notification must be renewed every six months until the money is received. The tax rates depend on the degree of relationship between the deceased and the beneficiary, in my case it was a third degree of separation so not much in the way of mitigating the tax payable. In Spain the beneficiary is taxed not the estate.

Had I sought advice rather than wait for the funds to arrive and then enquire about how to declare this I would have saved a bit of money by not paying a late notification fine. I engaged a lawyer to sort this situation out, they calculated the IHT payable and liaised with the Tributaria and subsequently transferred the funds to resolve the matter.

I was told that if the inheritance was not declared then tax would not be payable after a period of time, 5 years I think had elapsed. I am too old to be trying this sort of thing on so for peace of mind I paid what was owed. It was a bit painful but it is the law and I can sleep peacefully at night.
That is interesting. But how can you put any value on anything until you know what you may inherit?
Then there is a situation as shown on Heir Hunters, the television programme, you receive a contact about a distant relative months or years after a death?



Whilst we are on the subject of inheritance.
I do hope that all members who are resident in Spain have made a Spanish will. It makes things so much easier. However, there may still be complications. As we found out after a death of a friend last year who was Dutch.
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 11:10 pm
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by Casa Santo Estevo
That is interesting. But how can you put any value on anything until you know what you may inherit?
Then there is a situation as shown on Heir Hunters, the television programme, you receive a contact about a distant relative months or years after a death?



Whilst we are on the subject of inheritance.
I do hope that all members who are resident in Spain have made a Spanish will. It makes things so much easier. However, there may still be complications. As we found out after a death of a friend last year who was Dutch.
We may (will) be in a position at some point to inherit a small property owned by a distant relative in the UK.
I have already contacted the relative and the future executors of her will and have asked for an approximate value of the place to be sent to me now.
Once I have this I will let my solicitor and the accountant have this to work out how much approx I would be liable for here (wont be any tax due in the Uk as its a small cottage).
If it turns out I will have to pay a sizeable sum then I will revoke my claim and ask for it to be passed to my children, one of whom is still a UK resident..

We will have a similar situation with the wife's father as he signed everything over to his second wife to stop his son claiming anything. If we are in the will here I expect a huge bill as they are not related except through her dads remarriage.
We will refuse the villa and it can rot as his second wife has no family...

Ive already done the same with my Dad's house and the tax to pay here will be zero...(nor in the UK)
Id suggest others do the same as it saves a little time and the expense (€100 in my case) was worth it.

Dont have a Spanish (or Uk will) as yet as we only own the flat here. My pension in the UK automatically becomes a trust for the kids as a pension and the wife gets her % as a pension...
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Old Jun 8th 2023, 11:19 pm
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

Originally Posted by NABman

I was told that if the inheritance was not declared then tax would not be payable after a period of time, 5 years I think had elapsed. I am too old to be trying this sort of thing on so for peace of mind I paid what was owed. It was a bit painful but it is the law and I can sleep peacefully at night.
This is one of those that could only be tested case by case, and should not be considered an absolute rule. You are right that cases prescribe under the statute of limitations at either 4 or 5 years in different parts of tax law. However, the gotcha could be that if you knowingly did not declare something for five years, then even in the last year, you have still committed a fraud which you have renewed each year in your tax declaration because you always have a liability to correct previous errors. The four or five years could be argued to keep on renewing. Whether Hacienda would find it worthwhile to go to court would depend on the case. Some of the recent celebrity cases have had major problems using the statute of limitations to prescribe debts, but I guess most of us are not in that income bracket.........

I agree with Barriej declare, pay, live in peace.
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Old Jun 9th 2023, 5:08 pm
  #29  
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Default Re: Inheritance from UK. Users experience please not guidance.

As I didn’t notify the authorities I cannot say for sure what has to be initially declared. I suspect it’s more of a notification and this is kept on file. My lawyer had to submit a copy of the death certificate, the will and the final estate value as calculated by my aunts lawyer all translated.
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