agoreira

There are loads of councils in Spain which are effectively broke, bankrupt, can't pay their bills, supposedly 75% of those in Andalucia, but life goes on.

El sindicato UGT-A ha cifrado este martes en un 75 por ciento los ayuntamientos andaluces que se encuentran en situación en quiebra
El Ayuntamiento de Sitges (Barcelona) se ha convertido en el tercer municipio de Cataluña en declararse en quiebra tras Creixell (Tarragona) y Cunit (Tarragona).
El pueblo catalán de Moia no tiene dinero ni para enterrar a los muertos "No se pagarán las nóminas de los trabajadores públicos.

agoreira

Yes, and I don't think we can even hazard a wild guesstimate as to where the €/£ will be in 12 months. Over two years ago we had people here predicting with much certainty, "give it 12 months at most, it'll be back up the where it was" The "real experts" fared no better, probably a crystal ball would be about as accurate, or the fortune teller at the fair.

steviedeluxe

Funny that Aggy's here. I was just thinking that events on a Welsh coastline yesterday seem to illustrate the current situation.



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-s...wales-15550978

Or maybe not - those caravan owners just escaped the drop. We don't know yet the full fall-out of what's happening in Greece.

jackytoo

Ahhh! I wondered how long this thread would take to get back to the UK. I keep forgetting this is a forum about Spain

Back to Spain....One province, maybe La mancha has had it's bonds downgraded to junk status.

agoreira

Not my part of Wales, I wouldn't even wish you a holiday there! Just reading a link from yesterday's paper as well, this is my part. The accolades continue to pour in, from Lonely Planets's top ten regions for 2012, to National Geographics's second best walk in the world.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/travel/ar...pite-rain.html
As the man says here with Russel Crowe, "one of the most beautiful spots I've ever filmed in", http://blog.visitwales.co.uk/2740/ru...lsh-interview/

I should work for the tourist board! Don't bother coming though, you sound like a city boy, you'd hate all the fresh air, all the water sports, wildlife, miles upon miles of coast with not a building in sight! Do I sound as if I love it here?

steviedeluxe

(It's Siesta folder - and this affects all of us). I enjoyed your post last night Jacky, but the writing style didn't seem yours at all. Go on, admit it. It wasn't you (or it was a cut and paste)! Good post about countries exposed to the Greek crisis though. Here's a link of banks exposed (although as the article was written in june, it may be out-of-date). As I thought RBS is the biggest British exposure, but banks in Germany France and Holland have far greater exposure.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datab...s-bank-exposed

steviedeluxe

Partly, yet you choose to holiday in Spain and frequent a Spain talkboard. Most odd!

jackytoo

Of course it was cut and paste why shouldn't I admit it. I know I am very intelligent but I don't carry those figures around in my head

steviedeluxe

Without a link it looked like you were passing the words off as your own.

The next graphic is definitely not my work. But it leaves me a lot less confident about the near future. It seems we're all in the sticky smelly stuff.

jackytoo

Yes we are all in it together Though as I understand it the main indicators are the ability and future prospects of being able to pay it back. One of the main reasons that Spain was downgraded recently was because of the high unemployment rate.

steviedeluxe

Heh. I'm sure when they write books about this period, that will be a title of one.
It's the domino effect I fear. If countries aren't buying your exports because they've defaulted on their debt, it doesn't matter if your debt is regarded as manageable by the ratings agencies. Perhaps we will all go back to the barter system?

cricketman

Yes and there is one very key stat about Spain...

In 2007 50% of all government income came through property sales tax

Clearly not sustainable. And in 2011 with house sales at a record low...

However, the figures clearly show that in terms of absolute debt the other major countries are in a much worse situation

I actually think there is a lot of bullying going on by the American ratings agencies (pressured by Obama) on the Southern European countries. I lost all respect for Obama when I heard him say on the news that part of the reason why the US has such a large debt and budget deficit is because the Eurozone is in such a mess. Talk about passing the buck!

cricketman

One funny stat I saw yesterday is that there are more Porsche Cayennes in Greece than there are people declaring 50k euros per year in income

Clearly the Germans were the ones benefitting from the Greek black economy!

JLFS

And the point is, coz so do you and you live in London?

Whats the difference?

steviedeluxe

I love Madrid and Spain (and have worked/lived there), therefore I contribute to a forum about the place.
Doesn't take much intelligence to work that one out! Keep up JLFS!
I'm still baffled by someone who constantly knocks a place, who spends so much time on a talkboard about the place.