Expats vs Benefits
#1
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Expats vs Benefits
News story today tells of a study that says how Immigrants contribute far more to the economy of Spain than they get in return (http://www.tumbit.com/news/articles/...h-economy.html) - something I'm sure we have all suspected for a while !
#2
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Re: Expats vs Benefits
News story today tells of a study that says how Immigrants contribute far more to the economy of Spain than they get in return (http://www.tumbit.com/news/articles/...h-economy.html) - something I'm sure we have all suspected for a while !
What do they reckon? the average brit who buys a house here and lives here for 10 years will at the end of it shoved about 300K into the Spanish economy?
#3
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Location: Alicante province
Posts: 5,753
Re: Expats vs Benefits
My local, now regional Spanish bank manager answered the question for me. We were in a cafe and he only had a smallish piece of paper to write the numbers on.
I don't remember them, but when he calculated the money brought into Spain by UK immigrants, the zeros went right off the page, a phenomenal account.
I suppose we can work it out for ourselves - a million people bringing an average of something like £20,000 a year into the country, without even counting the initial setting up costs, usually buying a property.
I'm hopeless at arithmetic, and those zeros are too much for me.
I don't remember them, but when he calculated the money brought into Spain by UK immigrants, the zeros went right off the page, a phenomenal account.
I suppose we can work it out for ourselves - a million people bringing an average of something like £20,000 a year into the country, without even counting the initial setting up costs, usually buying a property.
I'm hopeless at arithmetic, and those zeros are too much for me.
#4
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Joined: Feb 2008
Location: Vejer de la Fra., Cadiz
Posts: 7,653
Re: Expats vs Benefits
My local, now regional Spanish bank manager answered the question for me. We were in a cafe and he only had a smallish piece of paper to write the numbers on.
I don't remember them, but when he calculated the money brought into Spain by UK immigrants, the zeros went right off the page, a phenomenal account.
I suppose we can work it out for ourselves - a million people bringing an average of something like £20,000 a year into the country, without even counting the initial setting up costs, usually buying a property.
I'm hopeless at arithmetic, and those zeros are too much for me.
I don't remember them, but when he calculated the money brought into Spain by UK immigrants, the zeros went right off the page, a phenomenal account.
I suppose we can work it out for ourselves - a million people bringing an average of something like £20,000 a year into the country, without even counting the initial setting up costs, usually buying a property.
I'm hopeless at arithmetic, and those zeros are too much for me.
#5
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: May 2009
Location: Alicante province
Posts: 5,753
Re: Expats vs Benefits
I like a decent whisky and my wife is fond of a decent bottle of wine, our two dogs are eating us out of house and home, and we're happy to be able to keep things going.
In paradise. That's what it is for two people from humble backgrounds in the UK. Maybe that should be humblish, but as I expected, it didn't pass the spellcheck.
Being a blabbermouth, if people like us returned to the UK, in numbers, it wouldn't help the Spanish unemployment figures, but might help to restore the country to its former, raw beauty.
#6
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Location: Vejer de la Fra., Cadiz
Posts: 7,653
Re: Expats vs Benefits
Sorry Bil, it's meaningless. I'll have to keep it simple. I spend around 130 Euros a week in Mercadona, 100 a month on electric, a bit less on water and I'm wavering already, perhaps 30 a week on petrol and 400 on a new desktop, 60 a week on meals out, there's no point in going on, it gets too confusing.
I like a decent whisky and my wife is fond of a decent bottle of wine, our two dogs are eating us out of house and home, and we're happy to be able to keep things going.
In paradise. That's what it is for two people from humble backgrounds in the UK. Maybe that should be humblish, but as I expected, it didn't pass the spellcheck.
Being a blabbermouth, if people like us returned to the UK, in numbers, it wouldn't help the Spanish unemployment figures, but might help to restore the country to its former, raw beauty.
I like a decent whisky and my wife is fond of a decent bottle of wine, our two dogs are eating us out of house and home, and we're happy to be able to keep things going.
In paradise. That's what it is for two people from humble backgrounds in the UK. Maybe that should be humblish, but as I expected, it didn't pass the spellcheck.
Being a blabbermouth, if people like us returned to the UK, in numbers, it wouldn't help the Spanish unemployment figures, but might help to restore the country to its former, raw beauty.
#7
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Joined: May 2009
Location: Alicante province
Posts: 5,753
Re: Expats vs Benefits
Not a chance mate. Raw Beauty? If we all pissed off back to the UK, selling our homes and emptying our bank accounts, the country would really have problems. Imagine, all that cash draining out and a tsunami of vacated property that would make the current state of the housing market look wonderful.
Years later I returned to Benalmadena and found a monstrosity, there's no other way to describe it. The raw beauty has gone forever, it's a soulless concrete jungle that really doesn't belong to Spain.
#8
Re: Expats vs Benefits
Well somehow I can't see them moving the bulldozers in to wipe out all those tens of thousands of hotel blocks messing up al the Costas.
After all they were the ones who were so keen to knock them up in the first place and make a swift buck or million or two while the sun shines.
Only pity is it wasn't spread about a bit more evenly especially in these hard times, instead of mostly ending up in the hidden bank accounts of bent property developers,townhall mayors and such.
As for the rest of the raw beauty,the Spanish are spoilt for choice throughout the rest of their land, but could possibly also take better care of that also, as the dumping of rubbish here, there and everywhere is worse than in almost any country I've seen.
As you say Bil the withdrawal of all N.Europeans would most likely be the last straw that breaks the camels back and turn crisis into disaster.
After all they were the ones who were so keen to knock them up in the first place and make a swift buck or million or two while the sun shines.
Only pity is it wasn't spread about a bit more evenly especially in these hard times, instead of mostly ending up in the hidden bank accounts of bent property developers,townhall mayors and such.
As for the rest of the raw beauty,the Spanish are spoilt for choice throughout the rest of their land, but could possibly also take better care of that also, as the dumping of rubbish here, there and everywhere is worse than in almost any country I've seen.
As you say Bil the withdrawal of all N.Europeans would most likely be the last straw that breaks the camels back and turn crisis into disaster.
#9
Re: Expats vs Benefits
It was a long time ago, but I flew out to Spain in a funny coloured aeroplane and landed in Malaga with my family for a holiday. We stayed in Benalmadena, a small, pleasant, cheap holiday resort.
Years later I returned to Benalmadena and found a monstrosity, there's no other way to describe it. The raw beauty has gone forever, it's a soulless concrete jungle that really doesn't belong to Spain.
Years later I returned to Benalmadena and found a monstrosity, there's no other way to describe it. The raw beauty has gone forever, it's a soulless concrete jungle that really doesn't belong to Spain.
#10
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Joined: Feb 2008
Location: Vejer de la Fra., Cadiz
Posts: 7,653
Re: Expats vs Benefits
Well somehow I can't see them moving the bulldozers in to wipe out all those tens of thousands of hotel blocks messing up al the Costas.
After all they were the ones who were so keen to knock them up in the first place and make a swift buck or million or two while the sun shines.
Only pity is it wasn't spread about a bit more evenly especially in these hard times, instead of mostly ending up in the hidden bank accounts of bent property developers,townhall mayors and such.
As for the rest of the raw beauty,the Spanish are spoilt for choice throughout the rest of their land, but could possibly also take better care of that also, as the dumping of rubbish here, there and everywhere is worse than in almost any country I've seen.
As you say Bil the withdrawal of all N.Europeans would most likely be the last straw that breaks the camels back and turn crisis into disaster.
After all they were the ones who were so keen to knock them up in the first place and make a swift buck or million or two while the sun shines.
Only pity is it wasn't spread about a bit more evenly especially in these hard times, instead of mostly ending up in the hidden bank accounts of bent property developers,townhall mayors and such.
As for the rest of the raw beauty,the Spanish are spoilt for choice throughout the rest of their land, but could possibly also take better care of that also, as the dumping of rubbish here, there and everywhere is worse than in almost any country I've seen.
As you say Bil the withdrawal of all N.Europeans would most likely be the last straw that breaks the camels back and turn crisis into disaster.
As for the straw that would break the camel's back, I suspect it would be more like a tree trunk than a straw.
#11
Re: Expats vs Benefits
I'm not so sure either that the report is looking at the effect of Brits buying housing - which you could argue has been detrimental to the country's economy, causing the unsustainable housing boom. It's looking at the effects of migrants working and providing services, against whatever they take from the state. Obviously there are plenty of Brits working (or even just buying in the local economy), but as I said there are larger groups of migrants from other countries.
Here's the breakdown of the official resident population (2009 figures, so will have changed a bit since then)
The top ten by nationalities, with the change over last year is as follows:
1. Rumania 829,715 +30,823
2. Morocco 746,760 +28,705
3. Ecuador 395,069 -26,357
4. United Kingdom 387,226 +11,523
5. Colombia 289,296 -7,378
6. Bolivia 210,624 -20,079
7. Germany 195,579 +4,577
8. Italy 183,999 +8,683
9. Bulgaria 169,195 +4,478
10. China 156,607 +9,128
Read more: http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news...#ixzz1LYb1BL5i
1. Rumania 829,715 +30,823
2. Morocco 746,760 +28,705
3. Ecuador 395,069 -26,357
4. United Kingdom 387,226 +11,523
5. Colombia 289,296 -7,378
6. Bolivia 210,624 -20,079
7. Germany 195,579 +4,577
8. Italy 183,999 +8,683
9. Bulgaria 169,195 +4,478
10. China 156,607 +9,128
Read more: http://www.typicallyspanish.com/news...#ixzz1LYb1BL5i
Last edited by steviedeluxe; May 6th 2011 at 7:58 am.
#12
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 5,008
Re: Expats vs Benefits
That is one of the perks in attracting a large number of early retired and foreign pensioners, not just Brits, but Scananavians and such.
They worked in their own country, but are spending their own governments money in a different country (Spain). Nett profit for Spain.
Also the people who "export disabilty benefits" are also giving a nett proffit to Spain.
Certain parts of the country would cease to exist without them...
#13
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 5,008
Re: Expats vs Benefits
The original report (commissioned in Spanish) will have looked at the effect of immigrants overall - and Brits are not the biggest group. Nationalities like Rumanians and Ecuadorians are. I know there are (probably) greater numbers of Brits who holiday here and aren't officially registered, but the report isn't looking at that.
I'm not so sure either that the report is looking at the effect of Brits buying housing - which you could argue has been detrimental to the country's economy, causing the unsustainable housing boom. It's looking at the effects of migrants working and providing services, against whatever they take from the state. Obviously there are plenty of Brits working (or even just buying in the local economy), but as I said there are larger groups of migrants from other countries.
I'm not so sure either that the report is looking at the effect of Brits buying housing - which you could argue has been detrimental to the country's economy, causing the unsustainable housing boom. It's looking at the effects of migrants working and providing services, against whatever they take from the state. Obviously there are plenty of Brits working (or even just buying in the local economy), but as I said there are larger groups of migrants from other countries.
So no benefits are being claimed, as for bringing other less able, or older members of the family over to live here, that is not possible untill they have been working for a considerable length of time and they canshow that they are able to financially support their relatives.
#14
Re: Expats vs Benefits
I know quite a few immigrants to Spain from other countries, mainly South America, they do not seem to be a drain on Spain, as they are working "most" of the time, and even when they are not working for the odd week or 2, they do not claim any benfits, as it is not worth the hassle.
So no benefits are being claimed, as for bringing other less able, or older members of the family over to live here, that is not possible untill they have been working for a considerable length of time and they canshow that they are able to financially support their relatives.
So no benefits are being claimed, as for bringing other less able, or older members of the family over to live here, that is not possible untill they have been working for a considerable length of time and they canshow that they are able to financially support their relatives.
#15
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 5,008
Re: Expats vs Benefits
For every job they take, it could be aregued that s Spanish worker is now on the dole and claiming benefits, untill it runs out of course.