peterni

hola everyone
guess who is a newbie. can i start a thread about eco building and related issues as i have started a reform of cortico with minimal concrete. Am using hemcrete, SIPs, insulation with cellulose & hemp, solar water thermalstor, engineered joists etc.
Spain seems a long way behind UK in ecobuilding so having to import some stuff; need to know like minded expats or spaniards who have or intend to go this route to find well priced spanish sources and bounce ideas around.
located near cuevas del almanzora. not big @ 260m2 single storey
anyone out there?

Rosemary

As Concierge for the Spanish section of BE I would like to say hello and welcome.

BE is a very large expat website, so if you have problems finding your way around we have concierges who will try to direct you. The moderators for the Spanish forums are Mitzyboy and Fred James, moderators are there to ensure that the site runs smoothly within the rules of BE. Problems and complaints should always be addressed to a moderador who will look into the matter and deal with it efficiently and fairly. Our members who post in the Spain Forums are friendly and helpful with a wealth of knowledge of the issues of living in Spain. At the top of the page you will find a quirkily named thread called Free Beer which is full of important and useful information. Hope you enjoy your time participating in the forums.

Please let me know if you need any further help.

Rosemary

Dxf

Hi

Concrete is wonderful stuff; warm in winter and keeps the house cool in summer so why do you not want to use it? The Spanish have lived here for many a long year and build their houses in a way that´s good for the climate.

The problem with building something different is that it is a nightmare for maintenance later - say in 50 years time

Davexf

Dxf

Hi

Concrete is wonderful stuff; warm in winter and keeps the house cool in summer so why do you not want to use it? The Spanish have lived here for many a long year and build their houses in a way that´s good for the climate.

The problem with building something different is that it is a nightmare for maintenance later - say in 50 years time

Oh and it is three times the size of my 90 M2 three bed house

Davexf

jojojojojo

You do have to make sure that the house is structurally very sturdy. I believe they have to adhere to earth quake regulations, and extreme weather conditions , all of which the Spanish have found their traditional methods to be adequate. Apart from that solar panels are frequently used now

Jo xxx

snikpoh

The main reason for NOT wanting to use it is that it is probably the least eco-friendly product around. Masses of energy etc. etc. goes into making the stuff!

I agree about looking at what the Spanish use and not rocking the boat, but then I also agree that Spain is light years behind other countries in terms of eco-buildings.

cricketman

Eco-buildings are just vanity projects for people with big egos

If you really were concerned about the environment then you'd go and live in one of the 1 million empty properties that occupy Spain, not build on 250 square meters of countryside, never mind whether you use concrete or not (btw, I am surprised the OP got permission for that, normally they limit it to about 120 meters per level)

Its like people who buy a brand new Prius every 3 years. Building a new car is equivalent to the energy of around 10 years worth of fuel

Saying that, I'd quite like an eco house because I think it would be cool to live in, but I'd make no pretentions that it were actually helping the environment

Hillybilly

Welcome to BE. I've renovated my own properties inc one that's autonomous (inc solar) and have employed "alternative" roofing systems that don't necessitate tonnes of concrete.

I'm also a chartered civil engineer and building surveyor here with a particular interest in eco building and have lots of contacts and lists of resources so may be able to help if you have any particular problems sourcing stuff etc!

There is a great Spanish magazine called http://www.ecohabitar.org/ that is also full of info, suppliers etc.

peterni

thanks to the oddities for the welcome
eerrrr no, concrete is not wonderful stuff, i can can see there is need for some edification on what eco really means but am not going to bore you with it today, its a drip, drip process. just one fact for now, for every 1 tonne of concrete produced there is 900Kg of CO2 produced so of ALL building materials , hormigon is the worst offender [am i allowed a bit of spanish? trying to learn by usage]
from a philosophical angle eco also means doing it for minimum or even no maintenance.
thanks for your comments though, we have to start somewhere.
pedro

cricketman

Seriously, if you are really worried about releasing CO2 then buy an empty traditional house

1. You wont actually be building a house, it is already there not be uses, so you will use zero CO2
2. The stone houses are the most energy efficient keeping the heat out in the summer and the cold out in the winter

If you have a 250 meter surface area to your roof (1 story) of your property then you will boil in the summer and freeze in the winter unless you fit solar panels (expensive for that much surface) or bury the house in 2 meters of soil

peterni

mmmm i think cricketman likes to play devils advocate but does need to be careful about assuming things. did i say i was building? perhaps you jumped in a bit too quick. does he really believe in his opening line.? Am more interested in guys like hillybilly with a more positive view of life and interaction with world around them.
i think i said reform. its an old farmhouse and will keep its original (single storey) appearance and will not be bigger than the existing footprint (think am allowed another 20% even if i wanted it) it also included a big shed that was a pigsty so its not millionaire stuff.
for hillybilly, will be needing more NHL5 and hemp chiv next year, there is a good source in granada [cannabric] but there must be others, any pointers please.
for jojojo, eco build means building for the environment so tremors are part of the equation, had 3 recently and only 30mins from Lorca, i could rattle on about concrete being the least tremor proof (its brittle) so my "vanity" project is actually flexible and no concrete will fall on me;
BFN
pedro

Hillybilly

If you don't already have it, I can recommend this book
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Finca-Renova.../dp/8489954267
It is full of personal experiences & tips as well as resources. It was published a few years ago and so may be a tad out of date now. There are some errors in it though, so use your own judgement. It's not a green/eco renovation but is still useful.

Hydraulic lime is readily available eg http://www.ibercalmorteros.es/dinami...o=263&menu=262
or you could even make your own...I think the above-mentioned book details how to go about it or there are plenty of online resources too.

Cannabric pretty much have the market sewn up but you could try
http://www.redverde.es/
http://bioklimanature.com/canamo.html

peterni

hi folks and hillybilly already had my cellulosa from bioklima, also the biofib pellets for the floor screed, not put down yet so will let you know how that works, shud be a doddle compared to concrete. taking the reduced labor into account, the cost will be on a par and a U value of 0.1 something
bought the book now, thanks
explored the other links and red verde certainly a good one.
my upcoming issue is i plan to use the 9.8m3 agua deposito as a heatdump for winter [with solar water panel]. it should be able to store 1000Kwh if i get it hot enough but dont know what my heat losses will be through the concrete walls. will be a trial and error job as calcs seem to say we will be well in for free winter heat.
how about i spray foam the inside. would it deteriorate under hydrostatic pressure and heat (hoping for 80 degC @ peak)?

has anyone else tried this as there seems to be several houses around that have unused water deposits

Hillybilly

Not sure about the foam. How about dropping a slightly undersized polycarbonate (or similar) container of some sort into the deposito and insulating the gap between the concrete and the tank/liner?

Dxf

Hi Peterni

OK I´ll bite - so how long will this eco build last - and what is wrong with living in an already built house and letting the reform fall to bits given that there are too many houses for the people in Spain?

Davexf