Corona virus
 

https://www.theolivepress.es/spain-news/2020/03/12/breaking-spains-andalucia-closes-all-schools-and-universities-amid-coronavirus-pandemic/

Friends with kids at school sent me this. So even here in the fresh air, low population density and warm climate we are subject to these controls.

The local Ayamonte footy match is closed to spectators on Sunday.

My friend a PT police officer had an official briefing with his colleagues from the health ministry last week. They were told that the virus is stopped at temperatures of 28C +. I haven't heard that corroborated elsewhere however.

But we have 28C+ in the sun and it won't be long till we get it in the shade.

Being positive, this could be one of the best places to be!

Jon

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I wouldn't believe all the myths.

COVID-19 virus can be transmitted in areas with hot and humid climates

From the evidence so far, the COVID-19 virus can be transmitted in ALL AREAS, including areas with hot and humid weather. Regardless of climate, adopt protective measures if you live in, or travel to an area reporting COVID-19. The best way to protect yourself against COVID-19 is by frequently cleaning your hands. By doing this you eliminate viruses that may be on your hands and avoid infection that could occur by then touching your eyes, mouth, and nose.

https://www.who.int/emergencies/dise...c/myth-busters

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Hi Moses2013.

As I said I hadn't seen it corroborated. But it was after all, an official health ministry briefing to the police. It wasn't a 'myth'

However you are right to say that we should all take prevention measures wherever we are, now that the WHO has officially declared it as a Pandemic. Hand washing, self isolation to avoid contact with others ... especially the elderly or those with existing medical conditions. Etc etc. I personally am very happy with the plans being made in the UK, generally in this difficult time.

I remain positive for myself, and even if I get it, I am luckily not in the highest risk group. I hope therefore to recover fully. (Famous last words ;) )

However if you have elderly family or friends with existing medical conditions, of course you should be very concerned.

A danger in these remarkable times, with all sorts of info coming in from ALL the media etc, is that panic ensures. Your article is great, and serves as a good reminder. However it feels it must also answer questions eg around UV lamps, hot baths, chlorine etc etc

As a politician said recently, the biggest fear could be fear itself.

Jon

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As you say, we can only stay positive and this is only what the WHO say, so I would assume they know best:-) There is a lot of panic out there and also a lot of false information (social media etc.)

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Thx for the info, guys !!!!

Since lots of us are planning to come over in the next few weeks, I would very much appreciate it if you keep us posted what is going on in the community. Overhere in CH, everybody is going nuts. Restaurants are getting closed, trains are getting cancelled, even borders get closed.
Keep us posted what is going on so we can make our decicion on coming over based on some local information. Thx and enjoy your stay

Mav,

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Starting to hit here now, a couple of restaurants have shut till further notice, closed the beaches.
Just back from Mercadona, there for 9 o clock opening, large queue waiting for shutters going up, no fresh milk or of course toilet roll, security guard at the tills, when I came out at 9.30 car park full.

Derek.

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Hi Everyone, I'm risking a post here so please don't jump on me for anything I say... We are in Ayamonte and yesterday we went to the Market - no evidence of anything different but it was very busy and very well stocked with fruit, vegetables, fish, meat and bread. No evidence of any shortages. We went to Portugal to visit a friend in the afternoon and again, the Algarve was busy as usual and no evidence of anything unusual and no activity at the Border. However, our friend had been to Lidl in VRSA and said there was evidence of 'stocking up' shopping with no meat on the Fridges as all and lots of low stock. We returned to Ayamonte late afternoon and shopped at Lidl where again there was very low stock of many fresh items. Fresh meat, fish, fruit and vegetables, milk and juices were all very low. However, we have no idea if this is a supply issue, a staffing issue or customers stocking up. The above I have seen for myself.

Friends on Facebook have said they observed that Ayamonte was very busy yesterday and there is some 'chatter' that Madrid-based holiday homers have headed for Ayamonte because they can 'work from home' and their kids are not at school. Remember, I'm just reporting ... There is also a 'rumour' that Portugal are contemplating 'closing the border' on Monday but I can find no evidence of this online and find it very difficult to believe this is a realistic possibility as so many people travel back and forth for work and other everyday activities.

If I get any further information from our friends in Portugal I'll post it here.

Stay safe and healthy.

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Hi Mav

Let me begin by saying that I am resigned to this - but feel we could be bordering on the verge of panic. However, I can also be cool about this - as I am luckily not in the high risk group. I am a handgel user for many years and follow a good regime as recommended by the governments.

Let me try and be as factual as I can.... without resorting to rumours.

We are in a sort of ' lock-down' on both sides of the border - starting this weekend.. Public gatherings stopped, schools, unis etc closed. Restos / bars closed totally like e.g El Paradise Beach club even the Vintage in town. More on the list. So are some beaches which seems weird to me. In PT there are either resto closures or limited numbers allowed. The Golf Club has handgel on the bar and the staff all in gloves. Yesterday there was a scare that the bridge would also be closed (from a good source) .... it wasn't, we went there to check, but there are rumours that they will close it soon. I stress rumours. I will see a PT police officer friend today and ask him. Note I think it is more than a rumour that many Madrid residents will come here to escape the big city in lock-down - so this may be the cause of increased protection.

I sent a message to a friend today that I attach below to save retyping..

If I were you I would watch this space closely and consider flying into Seville vs Faro regarding rental car return AND access to CE. The bridge closure (a possibility) is my biggest concern actually, see below:

Jon

We had a discussion recently. Is it better to stay here, where infection rates are small (CURRENTLY) and there are some beds available at the hospitals (CURRENTLY). Low population density, lots of fresh air etc.

Or fly back as planned, upping the risk of catching it on the plane. Some are bound to have it. And then going to the big densely packed city, Brussels, full of foreign nationals, like myself, eg Italians in the nearby EU. Many of whom fly a lot.

The BH feels better being in locked-down in Belgium (vs locked-down in ES/PT) where the BE medical facilities (CURRENTLY) are better, even though she agrees that the chances of getting it due to travel and location are greater.

But no-one has enough intensive care beds should the numbers continue to explode and people need specialist respiratory treatment.

Also I wonder if there is a Spanish person needing care vs a visitor from another country, who will get the priority when (IF) things get rough?

The flights are changeable, but if they close the bridge we will not be able to get out of Spain and the car rental co's are notorious for huge excess charges for late return. So we are considering options. Perhaps dumping the car early and paying taxis to/from the airport.

We are not in the high risk group, even if we get it 80% of us low-riskers will only get mild symptoms.


Santé !! ����

Re: Corona virus
 

Portugal Resident - This publication might provide information as it becomes available and is published in English: https://www.portugalresident.com/aut...ugal-resident/
There is an article beginning, "Portugal is prepared to close its frontiers... " published 9th March 2020
https://www.portugalresident.com/cov...ugal-round-up/

Re: Corona virus
 

Just heard GC just closed.... Good source.....

Also on s personal front.... lookingl like our flights to Brussels may be cancelled!!

Jon

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Hi Jon, Thanks for all the very valuable information. Looks as if our holiday home is not going to be used too much this year.
Hope you get home alright, keep safe.

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[img]blob:https://britishexpats.com/73ef3277-e299-4e91-be4a-1da3adc65ed2[/img]

Re: Corona virus
 

Thank you all for the interesting and useful points. However may I make a plea for careful use of special abbreviations. For example what does PT mean? Portugal, Platinum, Physical training? And GC, golf club, Guadiana Crossing? And CH, Switzerland, Cats Home? I'm sure that the correspondents will claim that in the context all is clear, but maybe my context is not yours.
Anyway, good luck and KBO.

Re: Corona virus
 

Hi Avila

As a newbie on the forum I can understand that the abbreviations may be confusing. Of course us 'old *arts' that have been posting for years use abbreviations, as you would do after posting many times.

I ask you to understand that and then try and use your knowledge in context of the post.

In fact its clear that you already know this. Every example you gave was correct... you guessed it. There is no other translation - in context - than

PT = Portugal. You got it right. No way PT = Platinum..... or the rest of the idea you worked out.
CH cant be anything else than Switzerland - you got that as well. No way CH = cats home.

GC.. you got a good one there....:thumbup: yes it could be Guardiana Crossing.

How much time did you spend looking for other explanations for the acronyms, when its clear that you have already sussed most of it.

This is the first time in years that I have seen this feedback. People that post do it to help and advise people and ..... ask questions for help and advice.. They put some effort into it - and it seems that you are also prepared to do the same. But I ask you to use your experience to figure out new stuff ... As you have done really well already.

Sorry that you are disappointed. I look forward to seeing your helpful and informative posts, now that you have joined the forum

Jon

From CE = Creative Experience :) :)

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We went for lunch today in Portugal, the bridge was empty. In fact we can see the bridge from our place, and we didn't see any traffic and thought that the bridge might have been closed.

We got over really quickly - especially considering it is half closed for works.

No real traffic in PT, once there. And when we ate, sadly the resto was pretty empty but we had great service... and a huge Dourada for 2 for 18Eur!

Its really tough for the businesses - its not their fault - but if we aren't self isolating for health reasons.... we can have great service!

Jon

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Thx Jon,

Things are changing every minute now and they are not getting better. The latest news is that everything in Spain goes on a " Chinese Lockdown". I think Portugal will follow soon . We will cancel our trip , will miss the food , sun and see and hope it will get better soon . Hope you get out there in time.
Greetz,

Mav

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Looks like we are here for a bit...

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...50544e8bdd.jpg
pretty Draconian stuff!

I'm digging a tunnel to the nearest Wetherspoons!!!

Jon

Re: Corona virus
 

Went over to Monte G this morning for my physio no probs. Called at Pingo on the way no probs quick in an out. Called at Corvo on the way back had to wait outside with numbered ticket for a few mins then about 12 of us were allowed in collected rest of shopping then home again very quick not much traffic. Lots of walkers on the east course.
Bill went over later this afternoon and a GNR roadblock had been imposed at the customs area he was stopped told them he was going shopping and they waved him through no stops on his return. Movement is possible within the rules posted by Michael earlier.

Do not forget your PASSPORT and DRIVING LICENCE if stopped they will ask and woe betide you if you have left them at home.

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Recent information:
Restrictions to Come Into Force Monday 16th March

Re: Corona virus
 

We are going to try and go to PT today, they have more shops open on Sundays. To buy some of the basics. We are happy to go to the smaller corner shops/Spar etc to give the local owners some revenue, even if it costs a few Bob more. Maybe saving queuing time too. Maybe a nice lunch, as it could be a while before we eat out.

I am speculating here, but I would fully understand the PT government closing the border for day trippers. With us virtually under 'house arrest' here, they have every right IMO to stop the 'bored' neighbours across the border just popping across to use the bars, restos, shops etc.

Holland has recently had this problem when Belgium 'locked down' and neighbours just nipped across the border to try and continue a 'normal' lifestyle... Whilst the locals were under increased threat as a result. So after tomorrow I think we might see some controls, that I would fully understand.

In the case of border controls, if we can leave on a Faro-flight I hope that (and expect) the PT authorities will allow us through on presentation of a boarding pass. I am on the case to extend the car rental period without the huge penalties they can charge for late return.

Not expecting flight delays I didn't bring much backup of my medications, so will chat with my doc to see if there's a way to get prescription medicine abroad. Luckily Spain is more flexible than Belgium.
​​​​
To be 'safe' I'm keeping some utility bills in the car in case we return from PT and need to explain why we are going into ES. Just in case.

Let's hope for good weather, so we can at least sit out on the terrace. With Netflix, I expect a period of couch-potato mode! My STAR is already 'in the Ascension' ( Star Trek Absorption Rate) :)

Jon

PS Make sure that you always carry national ID or passport when leaving home. Even popping down to the shops.

Re: Corona virus
 

Hello,
Just popping in from the Portugal group.
Re Post 17 ( no 3). Returning to place of habitual residence. How are you reading this? Will I be able to cross into and drive through Spain to get home to UK or do you think we will be turned back(are they checking at border crossings). Also the problem of the UK govt advising against all travel to Spain.

Re: Corona virus
 

IMO you will be able to travel across border to return to your home country - driving or flying.

Re: Corona virus
 

Good question these are unusual times, no-one really has experience of all thess worldwide strategies to combat this virus.

It makes sense to me that if you have a good reason and can back it up, they will let you through.... Its implied in the rules I posted at least, but cant guarantee 100%. The rules start tomorrow for Spain, and I haven't seen checks, personally yet, having had trouble-free travel to/from PT yesterday. And hoping again today.

I also support (and expect) that PT will respond to this, to stop unlimited day trips in as a result of this Spanish initiative. But again I am not 100% sure of that.

I don't have a whole bunch of concerns for myself with all this, but I do have close friends that are in the high risk group - and that is troubling.

Jon

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With all the shortages in the shops, the ingenious Spanish have come up with a novel way of rationing

See attached for a bit of fun


:rofl:

Re: Corona virus
 

HI its now 18:45 in CE.

We went to PT today for lunch.... no problems on the border.

However before crossing the border, we were curious to see the shop. It was open but the terrace was clear.. no chairs. So they were following the new law. Only for food.

Then after lunch (another story) we went to the supermarket CORVO in Castro Marim to pick up stuff for the 'lock down'. BTW that's another story in itself. Fantastic. With all that they are doing to protect their staff and customers. But something Ive never seen. If you haven't been in yet, and can go.... try it..... see it for yourselves.

Coming back there were many police officers on the PT side stopping all traffic.... I suspect border closure isn't far away.

We returned ... then realised we forgot fresh bread. We live in ME... and decided to pick up bread at the shop.

We were stopped by the police on the road... with no other person there.... telling us to go home. I explained that we were going for food (100% honest - AND acceptable with the new rules) but they told us it was closed and we had to return. I actually posted the new rules, thinking it started at 8am tomorrow. But....Its already in place.

We immediately obeyed, of course, they carried on and went the wrong way around the roundabout, towards Encinas... Busy to get us off the road.....

Weird... NO CRITICISM for the young officers, they were doing their job.

We're OK we have beans on toast, washed down with some Alentejo wine :)

Jon

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The Esuri Shop is open from 11am to 3pm

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The same two local police ,Stopped and fined a Spanish jogger outside gate four Vista Esurie. They told him to return to his home, He gave them a bit of lip so they fined him.

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The border is closing tomorrow.

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It is closed to all but trade vehicles, people who can prove they are working on the PT side or going to the airport.

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A very well informed site that I follow BF Enthusiasts posted today that the Pont Avon has now entered lockdown and seems only to take freight if it sails at all. The rest of the BF fleet also seems to be taking freight only. Spain and France seem not to be connected to U.K. by car ferry after this weekend. Search BF site for further info.

Dont know if the Channel Tunnel will still take cars.

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Hope not.I booked my return crossing with Britt ferries yesterday pm(originally on Pont Aven)

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Thanks for all the updates. Been in Esuri since Saturday and, up to now, not had much difficulty getting supplies in Portugal and Spain. Just hope they don't cancel my flight next Saturday back to Liverpool.

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Hi all,
I apologize for the somewhat harsh message, but necessary in this situation.

Maybe I misunderstood something, but it was with amazement that I read the comments in posts (#15, #20, and #25)) in this thread, where it was written

We are going to try and go to PT today, they have more shops open on Sundays. To buy some of the basics. We are happy to go to the smaller corner shops/Spar etc to give the local owners some revenue, even if it costs a few Bob more. Maybe saving queuing time too. Maybe a nice lunch, as it could be a while before we eat out.

I am speculating here, but I would fully understand the PT government closing the border for day trippers. With us virtually under 'house arrest' here, they have every right IMO to stop the 'bored' neighbours across the border just popping across to use the bars, restos, shops etc.

Holland has recently had this problem when Belgium 'locked down' and neighbours just nipped across the border to try and continue a 'normal' lifestyle... Whilst the locals were under increased threat as a result. So after tomorrow I think we might see some controls, that I would fully understand.

I want to apologize to Jon for using his posts as an example as I know other people who have done the same and for same reasons, but I do not understand nor accept those reasoning’s; which are
- Knowing that the border will be closed to restrict the virus to spread and taking that as an excuse/possibility to still visit the other side before the closure; and more for convenience and pleasure more than necessity.
- Being well aware of the current virus situation and admitting to understand the upcoming restrictions, but still going over.
- Admitting that it might put the locals (as the Belgium example) on the other side “under increased threat as a result”.
- Thinking that, as they themselves are not in the “risk group”, no harm is done.
- Thinking that as we do not yet have confirmed cases here that we would be somehow isolated from the virus.

It only takes one to take it over to the other side; and it only takes one to take it back from there to this side. There are quite a lot of people there too.
Maybe some of us are not in the risk group, but we might have friends or meet people who are?

As an extra “spice” there is the rumor of Madrid/Seville people escaping/coming to work from home here.
We are NOT isolated or safe and only by taking this very seriously and showing good example we have a chance to minimize the consequences.

So let´s show a good example and follow the instructions, recommendations and avoid all unnecessary actions that might have a negative impact.

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We use it regularly and get updates. As of this evening Monday it is business as usual. However Macron is expected to make an announcement tonight imposing 5 week total lockdown from Wednesday. Andrew Neil has tweeted 'Best get going early Wednesday' He lives in France.

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Hi has anyone tried going into town, mercadona etc. Wondering what the drill is.

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I went yesterday to the bank and Lidl. No issue

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My Daughter-in-law has just been to the Mercadona. Shelves were well stocked no problems.

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That’s my planned trip for tomorrow!

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Firstly Tervetuloa, Thomas and Tarja to Esuri and eventually Isla Canela and our community, welcome. There are wonderful people on this site always willing to help, as you found regarding your need for car servicing. In fact we are so active as a group that the moderators gave us our own local sub forum, the Ayamonte Club, the only one on the whole Spain section, I think.

Secondly thank you for your feedback, we all have a right to question others opinions and actions, and I appreciate the courtesy you showed in your post. It's not always the case that we have civilised debate on the forum!

I totally understand that you feel it is 'necessary' to state your concerns about this global problem. Everyone should be concerned, but some are in fear and some in panic. There is a huge mix of reaction and emotion to this problem.

However I would, respectfully, disagree with you.

My comments were supportive of the people who were annoyed about cross border travel from lockdown countries, as you noted. However I spoke to two business owners who were annoyed that the custom had significantly dropped. A different reaction, in the mix.

The restaurant we ate at was empty - normally heaving at the weekends. There was another couple and a table of four. We were well isolated. The supermarket had only a side door open, here we were given gloves and all the fresh food isles were taped off. The staff all in special clothing, masks and gloves. We had to ask for the fresh food, they handled it, and passed it over at arm's length, to me also at arm's length. We had to leave by another side door. They are intelligent people, they were prepared.

We flew in a month ago, at a time where there was no infection in the area. We feel airports and flights are riskier places to be. However, In that time (well over 14 days) we have shown no symptoms whatsoever. The comments about Madrid were confirmed by good sources, including a government official, a 3 generation Ayamonte family and others. And why not, if they have a holiday home here in the fresh air away from the cloying city come here to quarantine!

We are not trained virologists, so what do we do? We follow government advice. They have fully trained professionals advising them. At the time the advice was that travel to Portugal was OK. So we went. We spend more time in PT than ES normally anyway. For sure the business owners appreciated that we came. With the exception of the restaurant we were food shopping, allowable in Spain even now.

Sorry to disagree, but I would do the same again even after your feedback... Certainly as the lock down was coming and we would be quarantined at home anyway. The only people at risk were ourselves.

So how should we 'normal people' respond with so much advice out there. Yes one option is to take the lowest common denominator. I don't.

In Spain, Italy and (today) Belgium we have total lockdown. I accept that.

In the UK, my country, you can go out, walk in the parks etc, meet socially - but are advised to take caution. I accept that.

In the USA where they have an enviable organisation, the CDC, you are asked to restrict social gatherings to 10 people. BTW In Finland, your country, PM Sanna Marin recently adopted the same 10 person rule on Monday, and the restrictions are not as severe as in ES/PT. I accept that. You can walk in the parks, sauna together, eat a Makkara cooked on the stones, and if no police are looking, wash it down with Kilju!! ( After splashing a little on the stones) :)

I don't think I was selfish to go to Portugal when I was freely and legally allowed to. And welcomed by the businesses. If my return flight is not cancelled, is it selfish that I return? Going to Portugal, mixing with people at the airports and the flight.. means I am doing it at a time when it is now legally not acceptable to go out and mix with people. By your argument I should stay here.

Thank you again for your feedback, we all have to decide how we act in these times, in our own way. With the mix of reaction out there, there is more than one way. As long as it is allowable and we are cautious and respectful of the rules and advice and follow the law. I will accept that I am not so strict as some people, as I personally am not in fear for myself and my partner. I would never want to infect other people, and last weekend, out of respect we all cancelled 2 social events, with friends 7-9 people, each, none of us had symptoms.

However, I am very concerned for the people I know in the high risk group.

Kiitos and Santé

Jon

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Thank you for your concern John...