Hollande has told Cameron that EU membership is for life, not just for the easy bits. I actually believe him, just that the model isnt being run the way we signed up for.

When advocating the taxation status and ownership of Gib perhaps you ought to be also looking at Spain's retention of Mellila, Cueta and Canaries - who have exceedingly good taxation terms IIRC.

No one will make the first move, give up a little bit, primarily because the "locals" insist they want to remain part of the holding country.
Perhaps it would be nice to have everything in neat little pockets, boundaries formed by straight lines irrespective of what the people think.

So what status will Catalunia have with Spain if it should ceede from the union ? Bet that will be full of ifs, buts, wherefores, and maybes to give them an advantage. Just the same way as Scotland ceeding from UK, they will have a big shock once they have to pay for things from their taxation instead of the majority UK taxation, where they are given more per head than England.

Well in the last week we have had visits from HMS Blyth, HMS Sutherland and HMS Diamond is in port at the moment. Perhaps they are practicing for the evacuation.

Then again RR you seem keen to burn your bridges.

Or could be the troops getting cheap booze and pressies, as if that would happen!

Personally I think the spanish can have it and Argentina can have the Falklands while we're at it. Oh and lets reunite Ireland at the same time. Then Little Britain can pull out of europe and continue its transition into nowheresville.[/QUOTE]

Ignoring of course the many brave troops that made the ultimate sacrifice protecting the will of the people of these countries.

Not so sure they are that keen to be British, just that they are happy with the status quo, and what they have made crystal clear is that no way do they want anything to do with being Spanish. I can't think of any of Spain's ex possessions that couldn't wait to get to get rid of them, given the chance, the Basques and the Catalans would be long gone as well.

ur talking to civvies who have no idea about sacrifice beyond missing Morrisons and complaining about Ryanscare breaching their Human Rights to something or other

having to pay 5c for a bolsa when out shopping would cause more of a fuss

So how come that's acceptable given all the current fuss about tax avoidance in the UK?

It's acceptable because they are not in the UK, they are compliant with the laws of the country they are operating in.

Sorry Fred but I chose to live in Spain and I don't consider any bridges necessary.

I can't believe some of the sabre rattling I'm reading on this forum recently. Did you all take an overdose of testosterone or are you all trying to get jobs with the Daily Mail.

Lets have a list:

1)The euro is going to collapse and expats will need rescuing. Why?
2) Spain and the UK are going to war and expats will need rescuing. Highly unlikely.
3)Catalunya will declare independence and Spain will have civil war. A few weeks ago I might have considered this a remote possibility but now I think its much less so. Why? Because the EU have recently given Alex Salmond a definitive answer regarding Scotlands status in the EU if she gained independence. He has been told that they would not retain membership and would have to get to the back of the queue to apply for re-entry. The rest of the UK would get to stay in (unless UKIP get their way of course). This ruling would also apply to Catalunya. Alec Salmond is trying to negotiate but he is unlikely to be successful as Spain would certainly block any changes to the rules. So sorry all you Scots haters, looks like you won't need to rebuild Hadrians wall after all.

What else, oh yes lets not forget the sacrifice our troops made to hang onto the Falklands etc. Is it not possible to divide respect for the armed forces (who do a fantastic job) from disagreeing with what the politicians ask them to do? If the UK had to defend the Falklands now, could she?

I can understand that those who live in the UK surrounded by all the hype still think that Britain is the centre of the universe and has enormous power and influence in the world that needs to be preserved at all costs against nasty Johnny Foreigner. What disappoints me is that people who have chosen to live in another country don't seem able to shake off all that BS and get a better perspective. Of course if you are still watching UK TV and buying UK papers nothing will have changed for you. When we got here we took out a TV contract with Canal +. We get loads of foreign news channels, a lot of them in english. Guess what? News items about the UK are few and far between. Those there are often feature the Royal family. The UK looks like what it is - just another overcrowded country in europe with a hugh national debt. Remember when Obama criticised Romney for his comments about the Olympics? He criticised him for 'upsetting one of our closest allies'. Not 'our closest' or 'our most important' just 'one of' many.
All those things the EU gets criticised for - corruption, gravy trains, jobs for the boys, unnecessary bureacracy - all going on in Westminster at the same time, in case you hadn't noticed.
So having lived up to my name, I'm off to make mince pies. Seasons greatings to you all. I've enjoyed sparring with you but you can have your sandpit back for a while.

And so are the companies being criticised in the UK. They are being criticised on moral grounds not on the rules.

What else, oh yes lets not forget the sacrifice our troops made to hang onto the Falklands etc. Is it not possible to divide respect for the armed forces (who do a fantastic job) from disagreeing with what the politicians ask them to do? If the UK had to defend the Falklands now, could she?

Yes it is but the point is that it it was the will of those people and that of the Loyalists in Ireland to remain British or does that not count. As for defending the Falklands now, well personally I doubt it without the assistance of others. I fully accept that you are entitled to your views on Gibraltar but for me it is down to what the people there want that counts. I do not see why you needed to bring the Falklands Ireland and the little Britain comment into the discussion. As for the talk of the Euro collapse and evacuating etc who knows if that will happen or if the UK will go under uncertain times, however should it happen then I am sure the government will have to have some sort of contingency plan in case the worst should happen. If they didn't then there would be an outcry.

One persons view http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dTKvFLEN1c

The companies you are referring to Starbucks / Amazon etc. are non UK companies who are operating in the UK without paying much tax.

I cannot tell you the situation of the Gib companies and their UK tax arrangements, but I can tell you the situation with Spain.
They have license agreements with Spain costing multi million euros per year, On top of that Spain receives a percentage of every bet placed. This is an agreement that Spain has come to with each of the Gib companies operating in Spain. I am not even sure that each company is operating on the same numbers.
Every country in Europe were Gib gambling companies operate have different agreements, so I imagine does the UK, however you can be sure these companies are operating within those agreements.

Also at this moment in time the UK is trying to attract these companies back to the UK.
They will try by changing the tax regulations relevant to gambling, is that fair on companies in other areas of commerce? Is that fair on Gib? Is it fair on other EU countries?

Fred, weren't they driven out of the UK by taxation and restrictive operational laws ??

As happens with every success the original country wants them back and everyone else wants them to go to their country.

Although there are some boiler plating businesses we would like to see the back of.

`

Some left UK because of the excessive taxes on gambling which have now been reduced, in particular the ones with little or no High Street shops.
Others have never had a UK presence and possibly some do not operate there even online.
One company I am more familiar with came out of Israel via I believe Antigua to Gib. The only presence of them I have seen in the UK is their major advertising by supporting various clubs,events and individuals.
If one watches sport on UK TV you will not be able to avoid adverts paid for by these Gib companies.
Even Spanish clubs are sponsored from Gib, take a look at Real Madrids Shirts

http://www.realmadrid.com/cs/Satellite/en/Home.htm


The first to set up in Gib was Victor Chandler, the only one to return to the UK was William Hill who of course have a lot of on street shops. However they still are present in Gib.
One must also remember that none of them in Gib are UK companies they are Gib companies although they may carry original UK names.

Mind you I would not like to be in the position of accusing any of them of tax avoidance or even unethical practices without some substantial evidence, you never know who reads this forum.

Gaming companies could lose millions with UK tax bid


http://www.chronicle.gi/headlines_details.php?id=27262