Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Hi all.. found this site after searching the net for info...

this may have been asked before but I have searched to no avail...


I am looking at a parcel of land in Granada, I have had a local architect make enquiries at the townhall regarding appropriate licences etc and he has answered a few questions... the land will be licenced for 65m build.

Is there anyone who can answer a list of questions I have regarding the building licence rules Sewerage etc etc etc

I'd prefer to take this off line as I guess that many questions may have been answered before, so if there is someone who could email me I'll send them the questions so as not to bore everyone....

Many thanks

Pete

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Is the plot in the town or in the country?

If it is country land then the 65m2 sounds suspiciously like an "agricultural" building. If that is the case you can build it but you will never get a licence of first occupation so you will not be able to use it for anything other that agricultural purposes.

Country land requires at least 30000m2 of land to build on and even then you have to be a registered farmer to get a licence.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

been all through this I am aware of these rules and have been assured by the townhall that the property will be granted a licence to build a residential property, and these conditions are being incorporated into the contracts of sale.

Didn't want to write an essay about the land.. as i have spent a while asking these questions with the townhall and local architect.

My questions were more to do with the building that can be build and its design etc

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Surely your architect is the best person to advise you on this?

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Paying an architect reccomended by a local estate agent wasn't my prefered choice, just conveniant.... so I would like an opinion on a few things that the Architect didn't seem to answer or just didn't want to as it would have ment a bit of extra work and I think he just wanted an easy job.....

I will be going over again soon so it would be nice to be pre armed when I have my next meeting.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Using an architect recomended by an estate agent would not be a good idea.

You will have to find an architect to present your application for a building licence - you cannot do it without one.

We built a new house on a piece of land and the architect was the most important person involved.

I would thoroughly recommend that you find a good one before you proceed any further.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

No offence but...
As Stated I AM AWARE OF THE MAIN RULES AND REGULATIONS!
I am not the typical British numpty that buys a feild thinking they can pay a local builder to build their dream house without any problems....

I undderstand building licences, and do not need an architect for anything other than dealing with the initial local matters which are different to the UK. I have developed many properties in the UK so building a house in Spain from plans presents little problem to me, it is what and what cannot be done within the confines of the planning rules that I wish to clarrify without having to continually pay some 2nd rate Spanish Architect just because he thinks he can extract money for answering every question.......

Understanding what can and cannot be done within the Spansh rules is a learning curve, I know of many rules and regulations within the uk that can be utilised to allow other things to be done......
In the UK I have an architect who knows every rule/regulation and how they can be exploited, Spain is no different I just need someone who is fluent in the rules, it is not s easy to find such an architect in Spain whilst in the UK.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

No offence but....
Obviously you know nothing about Spanish paperwork.
You are ready to go on the project with the assurance everything is going to be ok on the word of Architect of the guy selling the land.
You have disregarded Fred James`s post about legal requirements for land size.
Why do you think the Architect has not answered some of your questions.

I think following this approach you are soon going to be (using your own words) .... "the typical British numpty that buys a field thinking they can pay a local builder to build their dream house without any problems...."

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

What do you need to know?
You will need a geotechnical survey carried out to determine the ground conditions in order for the foundations, drainage etc to be designed. This is compulsory (unless it's already been done by the current land owner) and forms part of the proyecto that your architect submits.
You must connect to mains sewerage system if it's within reach. If not, you need an approved septic tank system of the right capacity. These proposals also form part of the proyecto.
Unfortunately, in Spain, you do need an Architect right the way through the whole process. And of course, this professional service will have to be paid for...free advice from a forum is no substitute.
If you think your architect is 2nd rate..well, get yourself a 1st rate one and accept it will cost! Approach the Colegio in Granada.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

I believe it depends on the area really.

Last year we segregated a plot of approximately 37,000 m2 suelo rustico (rustic land) into two plots in Benissa (Costa Blanca North). Each plot can have a Riu Rau built on it 2% footprint of total plot size(we have already got building license for the first plot). In this instance, you do not have to be a farmer.

In this area, you can build on a minimum of 10,000 m2 suelo rustico.

Rules differ from area to area as well as Town Hall to Town Hall. The OP's best bet is to definitely contact the College of Architects in his area and ask for written advice. This will obviously have a cost, but it will be money well spent.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

And afterwards the local town hall will say, you don't have the proper building licence, but that can be sorted out by payment of a fine of 5,000 euros. then after that has been sorted, you will STILL get told that you haven't got proper planning and building permission, and will have to pay for it to be demolished. All these things have happened to ex pats who thought they knew best. Follow ALL the rules, use an approved architect, make sure he gets all the required licences or you WILL be one of those people complaining about the problems with beaurocracy.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

I find it interesting that I have stated nothing other than the size of build and a few general coments about the land... Yet it seems that almost everone seems to know what knowledge I have of Spanish paperwork and what licences have or have not already been granted or what discussions via my half English/Spanish legal translator have taken place....

I don't see myself running hand in pocket clutching a wadge of cash to someone waving a few bits of paper in Spanish.. I haven't developed properties in the uk and made sufficient not to have to work now... simply by taking what anyone including architects and solictors say at face value.. I have infact sued a solicitor and won.

In all cases I often get a second or third opinion and often more opinions... select an architect etc who knows what they are doing... I get free legal advice by taking advantage of the free 30mins with most solicitors then going armed with that information to the next for 30mins free and so on....
Why would I pay money for free advice.....

I have not asked for specifically do do with this property just wanted some knowledge on some of the finer points of rules and regulations...

HillyBilly can I email you a few questions please?

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Hi, post your queries on here. I live in Sevilla province and there are likely be people more knowledgeable than me about rules specific to Granada. Plus, your queries and any answers you receive may help others in your situation. I recommend a book, "Aspectos Legales en la Construcción".

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Perfectly true but the originasl poster is talking about Granada province. In Andalucia it is 30000m2 minimum for Suelo Rustico, as I said.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

In Spain?

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Can I just say that I know nothing at all about rules and regulations regarding building regs etc but I do know people and how they react. So I think it may be helpful to you to know that parts of your posts sound arrogant and dismissive whilst other parts appear to be asking for help.

People like Fred James and Hilly Billy and many others have a great deal of experience and knowledge and they are the people who initially will be a god send to you. Others will willingly give you the benefit of their experiences with Spanish legislation provided that you do noy react negatively and arrogantly to their comments.

Spanish legislation is unique and a minefield to the uninitiated so be willing to take advice and not bat it away.

Rosemary

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Very nicely put Rosemary!
Tim

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Camperman, you state that you have developed a lot of properties in the UK, well I would suggest that you forget ALL you have learnt from them, and start thinking about the fact that you are in a different country, different rules, regulations, laws etc, and also, unfortunately, in many places, corrupt local authorities. You need to get INDEPENDENT advice from a trustworthy lawyer and architect, and I'm not saying that the ones you have been doing business with are not trustworthy, but ask around for personal recommendations from people in your area. You only have to look at some of the horror stories that have been on UK TV where people have bought land with a house already on it, thinking that that would make it easy to get the relevant permissions, only to find that the house already there is illegal, and that that piece of land will NEVER be legally licensed for construction.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

Hello Camperman,

As a general guide.

I think it's very important that you get a written document from the local ayuntamiento precisely outlining what can be built on your plot of land. It's not enough to say a 65m2 build without specifying what type of building can be constructed.

In general most ayuntamientos will let you build a small nave (store house) so long as you have the minimum requirement of land.

You need to know if the land is classified as rustico or urbano. Once you have this basic but crucial information you can then go on to think about developing.

In Spain building work that involves structural work or new build usually requires an architect who will have to be named on the building licence application, you may also require a technical architect to supervise the construction.

Re: Clarrification on building permissions etc
 

And if you do build a "legal" nave you will find that you will not be able to get a licence to live in it. You will not be able to get electricity or (town) water connected.