Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Aside from all you experts who have worked with these kids:rolleyes:
Why does someone who has 10 million in the bank and celebrity status get more sympathy than a person from a sink estate who has sunk to gutter level:confused: Drugs seem to be glamourised yet anyone puffing on a fag is demonised WTF is that??

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Its the other side of the same coin as far as I am concerned.... Its an addiction for weak people.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

As I wrote earlier it is immaterial what you do d all that counts is that you are famous. A youngster steals from a shop and is a hard nosed criminal, a celeb does it, oh it must have been an oversight.
You and I fiddle expenses we are lucky if we only get the sack, an MP does it and suddenly it becomes an accounting error.
Makes me very angry and in the end if death is involved it is the family that suffer.

Graham

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I suppose if we look at someone like Amy, she did something with her life (short, I agree), she had talent and she gave a lot of people pleasure. So when she dies, I'm sorry.

The sinkhole estate pikey whose idea of a job is to steal something and whose whole life is dedicated to getting something for nothing....Oddly, I find it hard to dredge up a whole lot of sympathy.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Yes good point. I just find it incredible when I see all these people outside her house weeping and wailing, even to the point of leaving bottles of vodka and cigs with the flowers. Has the world gone mad:blink:

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Damn straight. Surely it should be an empty bottle for a proper tribute?

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by bil
ten times easier to give up heroin than alcohol.
Back to the question tho, why is it that so many sometimes quite talented artists that seem to have that destructive addictive side to them?


Still waiting for the proof......

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Prove it isn't. I'm just going on what I've read over the years. What I've read suggests that if prescribed medical grade heroin in diminishing doses, a large % of addicts can taper off. Giving them methadone creates a much worse addiction problem, especially as unlike heroin that does no physical harm, methadone does.

Using the Marks method was shown to be very effective.

If you are interested, I'd suggest you read up on it. Heroin has been the bogeyman posterchild for the 'Keep prohibition alive', much in the way that 'Reefer Madness. Marijuana - The Killer Weed With Roots In Hell!' was used in an attempt to demonise dope.

To be honest, if your mind is made up on drugs, then no amount of data will change it, and there is no danger that people with closed minds on the subject will ever want a proper debate on the subject, which is a shame.

Were drug addiction treated as a medical problem rather than a criminal one, we would all stand to be a lot better off.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Oh yeah, you still can't 'prove' that smoking causes lung cancer.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I have known quite a few people who having been released from prison had their first heroin fix for some time and it killed them. Cannot say that I know of anyone who has suffered the same fate from smoking one ciggie after a similar time lapse.

I personally feel extremely sorry for the family of Amy as their grief is in the public domain.

Rosemary

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

This thread seems to be heading the same way as one I was reading on another forum, which was closed down. Little to do with AW, just "experts" on drug addiction airing their views. :confused:

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I would say that when you consider that the processing, cleanliness and packing of heroin is in the hands of unaccountable criminals, there's not that many deaths. Imagine if they were the only ones supplying alcohol, diluting it with methanol etc.

You can OD 5 times on Heroin and walk away. Of course people die from it, of course it's a nasty addictive drug, and of course it causes problems.

What I say is that if it were legalised so that users weren't treated as criminals, we would have LESS problems. Not NO problems, but LESS.

See how many people die from paracetamol, and I'm talking accidental, not deliberate.

I think I'm right in saying that the most heroin deaths are caused when people mix it with methadone, alcohol or both.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Short answer yes

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

How disgusting that people should have opinions! Silly old me, I thought that the purpose of these threads was that we were allowed to air our views and opinions.

Do please correct me if I am wrong? Or is it just that you resent those who disagree with you being allowed to speak.

Were the 'experts' you refer to for prohibition or against it?

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I wouldn't think having an opinion/point of view and airing it on an open forum makes anyone an expert. I have to agree with Bil on this one, however accepted that the thread has drifted, but don't most?

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I can never understand why people get upset. If a thread drifts, it's because no-one has anything to add on the original subject.

A drifting thread can unearth something interesting. Serendipity is like that.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Are you the same bil from the vaccination thread ? ;)

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I think you'll find that I was urging someone to speak there.

I think here that it was aggie putting people down who chose to discuss addiction.

Were you going to ask him if he would post like that if I had my mummy here?

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

The problem is when people go on and on and on and on:zzz:
I see that Russell Brand has jumped on the bandwagon, It´s a pity he does not do the same off Blackpool pier.
Graham

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Graham I am with you on that one I can not stand that man

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

He's one of those comedians that I am never quite sure about. I have heard him do some frightful stuff, and then he has come on and made me laugh out loud.

His piece with Johnathon Ross, well, a) the editor on there should never have let it out, and b) worst of all, it just wasn't funny.

The only thing you can say about him is that he just isn't consistant.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I think he is consistant a consistant prat, be in bother now expressing another opinion

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Yeah, but why would that be? Without opinions, the boards would die.

As I say, I find him funny, but only sometimes. That whatsis face from the mighty Boosh. I'm still trying to work out what the hell he's up to.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I wasn't quite sure what would happen when I started the thread, I just wanted to say goodbye to an icon within my lifetime. Mitzy sussed out that it would turn into a drug discussion, which was inevitable.

Bil fired away in his usual style and Bob tried to put him straight. What else can I add?

Poor Amy will be remembered, and the drug discussion will rumble on, elsewhere if not here.

I'm not an expert, and I'm addicted to all sorts of things, even Mars Bars. And Americanos. I was going to add Sex, but, sadly, it's no longer true. Unless thinking about it counts.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

They still aren't any the wiser as to what it was. Could simply have been organ failure after all the excesses.

Given her lifestyle, is it surprising that drugs and excess were discussed?

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Not at all, Bil, not at all. I don't even object to your views about heroin and all the other shit. You just don't know, but it doesn't make your views irrelevant, they're shared by a tiny section of English society living in 'middle' England, and what's wrong with that?

As far as Amy is concerned you are out of the loop. If you lived another100 years, you would still be out of the loop.

A British icon has died and will be remembered by real people. Not you, pal.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

You really don't get it do you?

Don't worry, there won't ever be a sensible debate on drugs, not now not ever, because far too many people like you are incapable of looking at the problem rationally.

Like you, I was raised on the standard anti drug mantra.

Unlike you, when I noticed that certain things didn't add up, I didn't shut my eyes and repeat the mantra. I applied critical reasoning, and refined my hypothesis so that it took into consideration the facts that were coming to light.

Don't worry tho, prohibition will continue, much to the delight of organised crime, and we will as a society pay waaay over the odds to deal with a problem that we created when we first made drugs illegal, and turned a medical problem into a criminal one.

Year on year there are more addicts. Year on year there are more drug related crimes. Year on year it is easier to buy heroin. Year on year it is cheaper and year on year it is better quality.

Only a fool would look at that and say that we should persist with the war against drugs, but there are so many fools who can't or won't see that we lost the war years ago.

No police officer or politician dare say otherwise for fear that the fools will sack them or vote them out of office, so the fools will get their way and the problem will simply get worse.

Revel in your foolishness, and above all don't ever research the field. What a tragedy it would be if ever your cherished beliefs had to suffer.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

We're back to little Johnnie sitting at the back of the class. But this one has an iPad on his desk. He disagrees with everything the teacher says, his hand is constantly in the air because the millionth hit on Google, written by some lunatic in Alaska, tells him that the teacher is wrong.

There has to come a time when the rest of the class take his computer away and stick it up his arse.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Yeah, classic way of dealing with dissent. mock the content, and if that fails, shoot the messenger. You remind me of the eastern european method of doing things. In the end, their world fell down around their ears. Yours will too, if you live that long.


There was a most interesting article on drugs, principally heroin a while back, with pro and con contributors. What really caught my eye were the contributions from a couple of coppers.

Don't worry, I won't bother quoting them because you have already made your mind up. Bit like the crystals and angels.

Anyway, I have to go look at my orchard. I have a problem with the woolly aphids. I was told by my neighbours to use this brown liquid to spray on the trees. I have been spraying for the last ten years, but every year there are more aphids, not less.

Someone did suggest I try another pesticide, but I'm afraid to think outside the box, so instead I'm going the HBG way, and keep spraying the brown stuff. If I keep telling myself it's working, eventually I won't notice the aphids anymore.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Another great loss to our music industry...

Debatable I'm afraid.

I think the 'token of affection' left by one 'fan' of a bottle of vodka and a packet of fags seems to sum up this poor girls life.

The gushing, fawning sentimentality drowns the fact she was an appalling role model for this countries youth.

I don't want to offend but the truth seems to be drowning in crocodile tears.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Yes, so true, another "icon". Whatever talent she had was strangled by drink and drugs. Everyone seems to have lost sight of the fact that she hasn't had any new stuff out for 5 years. Were it not for the drug fuelled antics, walking around bloodied and bruised, punching fans in the face etc. she would have been well on the way to obscurity. Even her acclaimed album only ever reached no.7 in the charts...now she has been turned into this poor "troubled" person:rolleyes:

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

It's sad to see anyone die when you feel they haven't fulfilled their potential, but then again, look at how many musical artists have done the same.

I remember one writer commenting on an anti alcohol review that had criticised Beethoven for the amount he drank. The writer tho pointed out that Beethoven had contributed greatly to the sum of human happiness, and didn't he deserve a drink?

I think your views on this will be divided between those of us that enjoyed her music and those that didn't.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Bil,

No arguements on her music, I thought some was OK but all this hair pulling/wailing is making her out to be a saintly lost soul. I do feel for her father given how he tried to help.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Yeah. My heart went out to him.

I think people need heroes, so they make them out of whatever comes to hand.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

(I can't start another thread, I've started too many of late, but what about Oslo?)

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

I think that he is demonstrably mentally ill. No trial needed, put him into a place where he will never emerge, and deny him trial, glory and the publicity that he craves. I would also erase every trace of his name from the events.

I prefer it when people refer to 'John Lennon's killer'. I don't think the human zit deserves a name check.

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Well I did mention Oslo but 80 clean living teens camping out to discuss social and political issues lacks glamour ;)

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

Hitler was quite good at that.

Graham

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

What, protecting society from someone who was prone to listing political massacres as a hobby?

Re: Bye, Amy.
 

did he ?
really ?