Buying a bar
 

Lots of people on here have a massive downer on people doing this. Where are they seeing all these bars that are failing?

Having been to Spain many time over the last 8 years I've seen plenty of Spanish run bars that have remained the same in that time. So most are doing ok.

Is it, as I suspect, in the tourist resorts such as Benidorm? Having been to there and other resorts, I'm not surprised, most of the British bars there are shocking and a bad advert for the British.

Anyway, I'm planning to leave for Spain soon to buy a bar. Do it with savings and rent out the house in the UK. Will be getting advice from my Spanish girlfriend in Spain, and a friend who speaks fluent Spanish will help run the place. I think we can do it correctly, although we if we can't, I'm not coming back to nothing.

Re: Buying a bar
 

Just have a look in the papers and ask yourself, why are all these bars for sale ?

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Hi. You're right regarding Spanish-run bars. The majority remain under the same ownership/management for many years. That's because they know what they're doing, are dedicated to it and are good at it.
However, the "typical" (if there is such a thing) Brit-run bar changes hands or opens/closes with alarming regularity. In the towns/villages near to where I live there are a number of these bars. They are certainly not in tourist areas and so have to rely on "local" year round trade. Unfortunately they are all trying to attract the same customers (Brit expats) by means of Sunday lunches, pub grub, karaoke, quiz nights, bingo, the odd live band or drag act etc (which is what they think the "typical" Brit expat wants) and there simply aren't enough customers to go round.
Also, with a few exceptions, most of those who take on a bar here have had no previous meaningful experience in the pub or catering trade and so have completely unrealistic expectations of the hours, stress, sheer hard work and profitability of the bar trade. Many have never even run any sort of business or had to employ people before. So disillusionment (and/or divorce/poverty/ill health) soon sets in and the bar changes hands...and so it goes on.

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Yes Hillybilly thats what happens. Another reason why the Spanish bars survive is that the bar has usually belonged to the same family for years and they own the property and don't have to find around 1000 euros a month out of the profits to pay rent.

Barrer you have made your mind up anyway so it is fortunate you will have something to return to in the UK.

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Hello mate,welcome to the forum:)
Possibly the best thing to do would be to contact (surreptiously),some of the Spanish bar owners,and find out what makes them such a success:)
Are you going to aim specifically at the expat community,IMO,it would be best to aim at both markets:)

PS,Have to completely agree with the comments about Brit bars in Benidorm,they are completely uninviting,depressing to look at and be in!:)

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I live in 'inland Spain' not one of the coastal resorts and the same applies here. Bars runs by the Brits seem to fail and change hands frequently.

I suspect, as suggested, that it's because they're rented and not owned but also I think it's because expectations are too high. Salries (profits) are very low and hours very long.

I also see (here anyway), that Brit bars don't attract too many Spanish and that's got to be the 'bread-and-butter' trade, surely.

Anyway, best of luck to you, as I'd like to see someone beat the trend.

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Hi everyone. Thanks for the replies.

We will not be aiming at the ex-pat market, but at the local market, mainly because we intend not be in an ex-pat area.

My friend lived in the centre of Valencia for 6 years, so has very good experience of the Spanish bar scene.

Re: Buying a bar
 

here in our small village (permanent residents about 400), there is only one Brit Bar and she has been there for a number of years.

However, she does speak Spanish and has a Spanish boyfriend, so does get Spaniards in as well as Brits.

There is a Brit restaurant down the road, the person who runs that has run a restaurant for years in Portugal. She also has Spanish and Brit clientèle.

Both own their premises.

TheBrit Bar in the next village which is rented and only caters for Brits is always changing hands.

Most of the Spanish bar owners here have other ways of making a living as well as the bar, such as building or selling the produce from their land.

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What about other expats, i mean there are many swedish, german, dutch, etc expats in the coastal area, dont these "brit" pubs get visits from them, or do they have there "own" bars that open and close as frequently?

Where i live in Panama, there are just a couple of "brit style pubs" like 2 actually. They get a good trade from the local men, since the bar is usually frequented by blond european or amercian girls.But you seldom see a panamanian couple there. I guess its the taste of music, food etc, that doesnt fit with the locals.

n

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Probably the prices too, if you want to go in a Brit owned bar be prepared to pay double for your drinks etc.

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Hmmm whi is that? If there were a brit and a spanish bar on either side of the street, what would be the brits argument for hiking up the prices?

n

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In areas where there are lots of Brit bars, Fuengirola and Benalmadena the Brit bars a cheaper than the Spanish. It is rare to see any Spanish in foreign bars, only place I have seen Spanish in is the Manila bar in Fuengirola.

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sorry to bump this but i just have to say that many brit bars in fuengirola are frequented by the spanish generally on the sea front and it may be to rob your customers,or you,if you are not a bar owner,you can generally tell as they pay up front(unusual for the spanish) so they can make a quick exit,seen it a few times
cheers
the real frog

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To put it politely, what a load of crap.
Do you have proof, or did you hear off a friend of a friend ?

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Because they are relying on their fellow Brits to never go into a Spanish bar. In Spain the Brit bar is rarely run with the intention of attracting Spanish customers. The people running the Brit bars cannot understand the Spanish (indeed Mediterranean) life style of family first and not material goods. All the expat can relate to is making money to fund his lifestyle. And some of them must be right. There are plenty of "British supermarkets" selling unbranded cola at many times the price of the local product (in this case Coke)!

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some one selling there bar that why and at an unreal inflat price
my loacl the beer is 1.30 for a glass beer and up the english place up the road its 2.50 euros , was up there last day and the food was bad aswell
you wont feed the dog it what i got and porchion wich was small
that why i dont go there a lot , if not at all (freinds had to go )

just looking at few price off bars on the net , ha i but lot off cars for some prices and ha rent a Crowd get the place packed where there few buyers around

1 alwas go back again day time and night time , see what the pub/bar doing where you not expacked back ,
2 book can alwas be docked to show place down well
ask for delivery dockets you see what stock there ture over
3 staff wages book will show you how many staff are working
4 all paper work with town hall
5 ask few loacls about the place

and asking price can be hight as there room to move price

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Some bars work. As i've said before, we came over here very niave, not speaking spanish, and now a year and a half later we make a living. We'll never be rich but the bills are paid.
We are dearer than the spanish bars in our area, only by cents though, maybe 20 cents more for a beer, but as someone else said we have high rent and most of the spanish bars dont as they own the building.
If you are realistic, know what your doing beforehand and are prepared to work hard hard hard then i say good luck to those who try, better to have tried and failed than never tried at all!! I believe that if its something you really want to do then try it or you'll always wonder what if, just keep a bolt hole in the uk for a year so if it does turn out different than you expect then you havent burnt all your bridges.
Good luck to you x

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very good point you made if never try you never know
spanish pub are small not big like the uk

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The point cajam makes should not be overlooked, it is echoed by a lot of those 'place in the sun' progs.

If you listen carefully when they talk to those that have worked there and made it work, the average one, while saying it's a better quality of life or life/work balance, they all say how hard they have to work.

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rember working in a big nite club years ago and we used to head to the cold room to cool down :rofl:, long hours and poor wages but was fun and njoyed it but wont go back to it again done my time in the pub/club trade
jurdy
unless i got a good pub with a good team

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well mr jdr,thanks for your constructive response,i have seen it happen twice in my own bar in the early years,i have sold it now,and at least on 3 or 4 other occasions,i was only pointing out that you may have to be careful of some spanish customers who pay up front in english bars

on all of the occasions i witnessed,they were well dressed

i hope that answers my load of crap

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You have to be careful of anybody, not just well dressed Spanish people if you leave your till available to access, what else they may want to steal in an English bar I don`t know.

PS, are you typing on an advent laptop ?

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:lol:

In the end of the day you need experience and the ability to speak Spanish to be able to hit the road running so to speak when it comes to running a bar in Spain and a very small percentage of the Brit expatriates who do this venture don't.

The only other alternative is to have 2-3 years worth of running capital in the bank and learn as you go, but that's a hell of a lot of money to lose per year.

Having said that friends of mine moved to Ibiza about 8 years ago and had only ever worked in a bar as an bar 'person' and they have made a great success of their business and didn't speak a word of Spanish when they left for Ibiza.

Gutting really as I was asked to invest in the project and thought "not on your life!" hehe.

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"The only other alternative is to have 2-3 years worth of running capital "

Dead right ,Ive only just started making money in the third year,my advise would be keep your money in your pocket and work/live here for at least a year and watch how many go bust ,if you still want a bar get yourself certified insane,:rofl:

Rgds

Rotor

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Even in our tiny village, the 'Brit bar' doesn't give the tapas out that the Spanish ones do. You might get some peanuts if you're lucky.

The price and measures are the same though.

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I think you hit the nail on the head first time Scampicat. A lot of Spanish run bars are not the principal business and income of the owner. Foreigners coming in and buying up the property first (or renting), then putting all business expenses down to the bar have a hard job to make the business work. In Aznalcollar village there used to be the highest number of bars per head of village population anywhere in Spain. Most were tiny converted front rooms with a chill cabinet for stock and basically would never return a proper business profit, they were part of village life as people hopped around the village meeting up with each other throughout the night.

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I had a bar for a number of years, that worked well with locals, tourists and expats. The majority of the customers were locals (the previous owners were Spanish) and we were fortunate to keep them- however both myself and my friend who worked with me spoke Spanish, and we were both experienced as we had worked in bars in the town for a number of years.

There was another bar directly over the street, just five metres away, that for some reason was a big white elephant and just never worked. The owners (Spanish) tried to run it themselves for a few seasons, but eventually gave up, but since then have rented it out to the first taker. There is always someone who comes along to rent it!

They probably as much money renting it out to naive people than most bar owners make working 14 hours a day.

Every year different people take it on and leave at the end of the year dejected and broke. There have been Belgiums, Spanish (many), Germans, Argentinians and Italians- strangely enough no Brits as far as I remember!

The current people are Italian. Its a shame, it has nice decor, is a decent size and other bars in the area make a living, but this one just doesn't, regardless of who runs it. :confused:

I guess my advice is before you take anything on, find out a little bit of it's history. There is of course a chance you will make a better go of it than the previous people but some places just don't work- period.

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I gotta tell you that there is a bar / restaurant about 10 mins walk from us. Its the only one around here. It was owned by French people but they couldn't make it work and they leased it to a couple of Germans.

That was about 5 months ago.

On Saturday night I went down there and there were 120 ish people at the restaurant each paying €17 for an International cuisine night.

He does special menus every month and varies it a lot, his wife is part Greek so they specialise in Greek food as well.

Both of them are really outgoing and will do absolutely anything (well, almost) to keep their customers happy.

It can work!

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Yes, it is certainly true some people can make a place work where others have failed.

I gave it up about 5 years ago, I was just burnt out after 20 years of working 80 hour weeks, and quite simply just didn't enjoy it anymore.

However when I was younger I thought it a great way to make a living.

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sorry dont know what an advent laptop is,i think you misunderstood me,i was not robbed it was womens(customers) handbags,as i said it was allways well dressed spanish customers in an english bar who commited the crime,i was just giving a warning out,obviously it is a minority,just be careful of people who pay up front if you own a bar as it is not the custom here unlike the uk

anyway,to get back to the thread,if you buy a bar and you have no xp then you are likely to fail,in fuengirola port you can buy a bar now for 5000 euros which people snap up,then they have to pay off the debts,get no customers and a year later are gone

its a shame but people actually for some reason believe every thing that the estate agents tell them which they,i am sure would not do in the uk

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Surely the fact that the bar is in debt is a giant warning sign that it isn't working? Might as well flush your money down the toilet. :(

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the problem is you as a new buyer will not be told about any debt and your lawyer will be useless,the agent will plead ignorance and your landlord will expect you to pay as he wont and will provide the lease that you signed to prove it
just to say i had a bar in fuengirola for 7 years,it was good and i just had the problems that running a business involves,but after i sold it and got out more i hear all the horror stories more often,maybe because its quieter now,i sold the bar 3 years ago,if you want to buy a bar be very careful

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You assume too much frog.
If you employ a useless lawyer, expect him/her to be useless.
Employ a good one and he/she will not be useless.
Whilst there are indeed many useless lawyers out there, you can also find some gooduns. Just like any other group of people really in that respect.

Re: Buying a bar
 

Why on earth does everybody want to buy a bar ? You will spend all day stuck indoors, washing other people's dirty glasses, and mopping up sick ! Why not be a gardener, or some such thing, then you are out in the fresh air all day, and getting a lovely tan at the same time! Anyway, good luck with whatever you decide to do... (and of course, what would we do without people like you... ) |Have seen a few come and go as well.... :confused:

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read this ,,,,, Coca cola has admitted that while sales are holding steady in the supermarkets, they have seen a 6% reduction in sales in bars and restaurants. The reduction is put down to the current economic climate, where people are said to be going out less.

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I left Spain 13 years ago so I'm not familiar with things any more... However, my guess is that, because the cost of living is so high nowadays and everything is getting so expensive all at once (petrol, food, properties/mortgages), people have to cut down on unnecessary things such as drinking...

Disclaimer: I haven't read the thread and I have no idea what has been said...

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Anabella..................what time do you call this....now get to your room :mad:

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I live in Colorado now, it's only 10:30 pm :o... you are the one that should be ashamed!! :p... or are you a very early raiser? :unsure:

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Posh kicks him out of bed to make her an early morning cup of tea.

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We make a better living running a bar than we would being a gardener, plus its what we know.
Oh and after a year and a half here i've never once mopped up sick.......