Dick Dasterdly

I've just watched a Spanish report on Spanish TV regarding dog problems, so before anyone says this is Spain get used to it, I believe it is at least every bit of a serious concern amongst the Spanish people themselves.

Many urbanisations outside the major cities have a good proportion of properties guarded by what appear to be large aggressive dogs.
Occasionally they get loose and attack people, many owners simply open their gates for an hour or so and let them run free to go to the toilet rather than be troubled to walk them out on a lead.
Other dogs are left unattended from one weekend to the next in the case of weekend homes, normally leaving them enough food and water of course.

Some of the injuries to Spanish people shown on the programme were horrendous. They also demonstrated just how difficult it often is for Spanish people in some areas to go about their normal business, in particular postmen for whom the job is a nightmare.
I have experienced problems myself with my small dog on a leash being attacked on occasions by much bigger aggressive out of control dogs, but generally it is not such a major problem for me as elsewhere.

Apart from the obvious dangers, the pleasure of living in such typical urbanisations is to a large degree spoilt by the incessant nighttime barking and likewise dogs howling aggressively at gateways whilst walking by.
It is said that the Spanish don't mind noise, but I've come across numerous complaints from them regarding barking dogs, though generally most of them just grin and bear it rather than getting involved in disputes.

We are repeatedly told that Spain is as safe as the UK and I'm not intending getting into that argument as obviously many other factors are concerned, but I only wonder why so many Spanish families still consider it so necessary to go to such extremes with regard to aggressive guard dogs protecting their properties in addition to all the Fort Knox style window, door and outer perimeter steelwork and rejas ?

An Englishmans home may well be his castle, but I can never quite figure why so Spanish guys seem to look upon their homes as a fortress under siege.

jimenato

Get some pepper spray DD. I used to carry it in Spain and it's legal.

Tadd1966

DD you may want to try and walk around some estates in UK, (and many other places in the world) especially council run estates - not a Spanish only problem it is the high proportion of irresponsible and dis-respectful dog owners of all nationalities and the fact that we (joe public) and the authorities ignore these problems caused by these irresponsible dog owners

Longlegpete

From my time spent in both UK and Spain my problems with dogs are mainly in the UK, it may be the case in Spain I'm not sure but in the UK dog's are often seen as some kind extension to one's private parts with no consideration for others and I live in a relatively affluent part of Surrey so it's not just exclusively local authority housing

Dick Dasterdly

I've had some on hand for many years and some other "stuff"as well, though I'm not unduly concerned for myself and it is not such a major problem for me.

I was hoping to discuss the bigger picture that obviously affects so many Spanish urbanisations in a number of ways.
Is such a siege mentality really essential in view of the danger, hassle and disturbance it causes ?

I don't want to get involved in the proverbial pissing contest and realise there are some problems in the UK mainly with one particular sector of society.
In that respect it is probably as well that Brits are not so tolerant as Spaniards with regard to this and usually the issue can be dealt with back in the UK.

I imagine most expats outside the main Spanish tourist areas live in urbanisations and communes where a much greater degree of control is the norm, however although I much prefer it up here enjoying a more typical Spanish lifestyle, this issue is one of the few negatives and mainly affects Spanish people themselves.
They sometimes mention it to me in passing, yet rarely if ever do they actually approach the source of the problem.
Maybe typical Spanish tolerance is not always a virtue.

bobd22

Dick in my experience it is not just as you say"bigger aggressive dogs" that get out of control. Many years ago I had a very placid and we'll trained Doberman. When other people's dogs would either go for him or start yapping at him often they were off the lead, owners would eventually put their dog on the lead saying" come away they are nasty dogs!" I often pointed out my dog was in control and on a lead and it was actually their little dog that was acting aggressively off a lead and not properly controlled! One time a little Jack Russell bit my dog causing a gash on his leg the owner seemed quite amused that a big Doberman just backed off, that was till I told her to get her mutt under control and any vets bill would be going her way, luckily it did not require a vet. All dogs can be aggressive and most well trained and controlled dogs don't cause a problem, owners ! Well that is often the issue not the dog. I have found good and bad dog owners in UK and Spain. I also saw a large increase in abandoned dogs around our area when expats started leaving spain during the crisis! May be down to coincidence but I fear not.

jimenato

Certainly around our village it is the Spanish who chain up, mistreat and abandon dogs and expats who collect them, patch them up them and find them homes.

That's a huge generalisation - obviously not ALL Spanish mistreat dogs and SOME Spanish are involved in the rescue effort.

But it sums up the situation.

jimenato

In the small village we lived in in Spain the numbers of dogs abandoned and mistreated ran to hundreds per year. The problem is nowhere near as bad in the UK.

Also the norm was for the family dog to be pushed out into the road to roam the streets causing the obvious problems with dog crap. This does not happen in the UK. Dog crap in the streets and parks is far less a problem than in Spain.

bobd22

Certainly many caring expats are involved in homeless animal charities and when I say expats leaving I didn't just mean British. It was just an observation over the period of 2010 to last year. Abandoned dogs increased yes it may be down to Spaniards finding times hard as well. One abandoned dog was a lovely and expensive breed it was very timid of men and had a large open hole/puncture wound on its neck, my guess was given the breed it had been chipped and someone had cut the chip out to prevent being identified? It was a local restaurant owner who had been feeding it that got the dog collected. No matter who or what race people are if they can no longer afford or keep a family pet then either get it re homed or put to sleep rather than abandon it to who knows what. I am off the belief in all things including pet ownership their are good and bad everywhere including Spain and the UK.

bobd22

Yes I agree certainly over the last 10 or 15 years owners cleaning up after their dog has improved in the UK and generally owners in the UK don't let their dogs roam as much as in Spain. However it does still depend on the area that you live certainly on many large less desirable inner city estates in the UK this is not the case. Not that long ago certainly when I was brought up it was quite common to see people just let the dog out and see the piles of white dog muck (which you never see these days ? Maybe they are better fed lol) , maybe Spain is just catching up although many Spaniards pamper their pets just like we do some see them as just a working animal even if just as a guard, which does happen in the UK as well. We live in the North East in the UK which has the highest levels of animal cruelty in the UK. We don't see that but certain people and areas are very cruel dog fighting badger baiting etc also breeders puppy farms etc. So yes it may not be so obvious in UK but it does happen.

jimenato

Good points especially the one about white dog poo - whatever happened to that?

bobd22

Not sure but you never see it any more? Maybe it was aliens!

olivefarmer

Fortress mentality? I think this is a throwback to lawless times in Spain. Old habits die hard. In a hot country read make sense for feeling safe when asleep. I have seen older properties with really really heavy door chain that allows the door to be open a fraction at night.

Dog noise. My view is that SpAin is recognised as being right up there as a noisy country and for along time people just accepted it. Remember theehaust less scooters at night? Now I think more Spanishfolk are coming round to excess noise is unnaceptable. Trouble is it takes time. I think it is worse in hard core rural areas where folk cling to tradition. When you still make your own soap and regard electricity as a novelty, a bit of noise from yet another dog chained up in an uninhabited property is quite normal. As an aside we have a quite respectable Spanish family in the village. They always have an abundance of adorable puppies but never any adult dogs. They just vanish.

White dog poo? I always thought that the cause was a diet of white bread and bones.

bxpuser24710519

I don't live on an Urb., the problem here was firstly a German with arrogant, ignorant ideas which seem to have changed since he got neighbours with dogs that do the same as his but up on his street not down here where he used to let his foul and thought it funny. What goes around comes around ! They have since gone and now it is the odd dog walker that leaves its dogs pile for others. Must be hellish living on an Urb with unattended dogs in or out of properties.
You do hear more about expats of various nationalities leaving their rescued dogs behind when they leave, double disaster for the dogs poor things. It does take that much organisation to take them with you unless of course you not really adopted them with that entails or you are doing moonlighter !
White poo ? plenty around here, lord knows what some poor dogs eat judging by the poo here.

bobd22

Per the interweb the culprit for white dog poo was indeed they ate more bones than fed today