Fredbargate

Michael74

Always a good year to 'Splice the Mainbrace' as I did for the 150th in 1955 on HMS Kenya.

agoreira

Reading in a Spanish Facebook page, they were saying the only reason they lost was because the French ran away and left them outnumbered 4 to 1!

Domino

probably lost on nearly everyone

just don't expect the Spanish Navy to express any sorrow, although they should be holding their own memorial commemoration.
they were let down by their friends the French and had a high loss rate of men and ships, so bad they never had an effective navy after that.

but nowadays they have more vessels than the Royal Navy, even if they don't have the same firepower.

had a splice the mainbrace at lunchtime and loyal toast in my wardroom in the evening.

Domino

Fred, this thread led me to try to ascertain exactly how many died or injured. It is recorded the British casualties were 1,587. But the French and Spanish casualties were never revealed but are thought to have been around 16,000.

Do you have any sources that would be more accurate ?
It would appear the Spanish fleet had about 35% taken as prize but they were never in fit state to do much after that.

Domino

For anyone out there who wishes to look up a relative who was present at Trafalgar on the British side the following link may prove interesting

http://http://www.nationalarchives.g...rs/default.asp

And they werent just English, there were the usual Irish, Scots, Welsh, but also Dutch and a number of other nationalities in the ships.

Fredbargate

No I don't Domino.
The Photos were taken at the Trafalgar Cemetery in Gib where some of the victims were buried.

I have visited Trafalgar on many occasions but I have never seen anything that looks like a memorial.

Although there is a small memorial on the sea front at La Linea commemorating the Glorious Italian Frogmen who attacked the British shipping in WW2

Fredbargate

The above link does not work, try this one

http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/t...rs/default.asp

There are 15 people with my not too common surname.

Domino

sri about the failed link, thanks for correcting so quickly.

perhaps memorials are only common when you are the winning side.
although I believe there are memorials to Spanish sailors who were washed ashore in Ireland from the foundering Armada.

Relampago

If you're talking about Trafalgar, that was not directed by spanish admirals, was led by an incompetent called Villeneuve, who ignored the warnings of spanish admirals like Churruca or Gravina

Nelson arrived alive to Trafalgar because his life was forgiven in Tenerife. You don't talk about defeats, because the difference between you and us, is that we don't hide the defeats. Yes, like the incredible defeat of 1741 in Cartagena de Indias. You can inform yourself, you will check like in your country you didn't find nothing about this date

Relampago

By the way, I told you that when you want, you can write me in spanish (in private), to check until where is certain when you told me (derisively, of course) that you would understand me better in my language that speaking in english

Michael74

In a recent TV programme 'The British' it was stated that the French/Spanish lost 18 ships and the British none. No figures re actual losses of men on either side. Regarding the prizes taken I believe many were lost due to a storm after the battle.

A fiction based on fact 'Trafalgar' by David Howarth is a good read, available from Amazon for £4

agoreira

A good article here, and it gives the number of casualties as quite low, although as it says, many were to die afterwards as a consequence of injuries sustained.
http://www.todoababor.es/articulos/tras_labatalla.htm

dmu

Hi from the France forum!
Apparently, if Villeneuve had obeyed Napoleon's orders, he would sailed to Boulogne instead of remaining off Spain, and taken part in Nap's planned invasion of England. It's thanks to Villeneuve that that green and pleasant land didn't become a French Département by 1806...

Domino

You don't talk about defeats because the winner writes the history.

Villeneuve heard that he was about to be replaced by Napoleon so took the initiative to prove he could still fight the British. He should have realised that when it took 2 days for his fleet to get out of Cadiz and gather that he was on a sticky wicket. However, he was eventually captured, lived in the UK for about a year and died by "suicide" on his way to Paris. That he commited suicide with a kitchen knife with about 14 stab wounds makes me think he may have been murdered, but you can't argue with a doctors reason for death.

I suppose the Spanish had a choice - sail or stay at home. But their bravery in following a man who was possible a little unstable displays a certain amount of courage. Over the years I haven't read a disparaging report of the Spanish seamen during Trafalgar. Many people don't know about the Spanish involvement at Trafalgar letalone the number of men and ships lost.
But I have never understood why they later allowed a Frenchman to become King of Spain, even if only for 5 years.

and if you are talking about the war of "Jenkins Ear" then perhaps you may like to read
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_...gena_de_Indias
which wasnt just a single battle but was part of a conflict that lasted for 9 years

British ships and regiments display proudly Cartegena on their battle honours, even though it was a defeat.