Re: 11.11.11am
 

The only way they are alike is that there are people marching in uniform... if we take that logic and put it to other things then we could easily say that a coffee and a cup of urine are the same thing, both can be drunk and both are liquid... great logic eh?

Re: 11.11.11am
 

My apologies, I assumed the poem was so known that quoting it further was unnecessary. I remember the first time I read it with full understanding, and it seemed to me incredible that anyone could read it and consider warfare as anything but the last resort.

Read it and weep.

Wilfred Owen
Dulce Et Decorum Est

Bent double, like old beggars under sacks,
Knock-kneed, coughing like hags, we cursed through sludge,
Till on the haunting flares we turned our backs
And towards our distant rest began to trudge.
Men marched asleep. Many had lost their boots
But limped on, blood-shod. All went lame; all blind;
Drunk with fatigue; deaf even to the hoots
Of disappointed shells that dropped behind.

GAS! Gas! Quick, boys!-- An ecstasy of fumbling,
Fitting the clumsy helmets just in time;
But someone still was yelling out and stumbling
And floundering like a man in fire or lime.--
Dim, through the misty panes and thick green light
As under a green sea, I saw him drowning.

In all my dreams, before my helpless sight,
He plunges at me, guttering, choking, drowning.

If in some smothering dreams you too could pace
Behind the wagon that we flung him in,
And watch the white eyes writhing in his face,
His hanging face, like a devil's sick of sin;
If you could hear, at every jolt, the blood
Come gargling from the froth-corrupted lungs,
Obscene as cancer, bitter as the cud
Of vile, incurable sores on innocent tongues,--
My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

I think you come across as a decent, idealistic person, and what disgusts me is when people like you are used and abused by those who have power over you.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

Christ, Bil, I’m shocked beyond words and thank you profusely.

The truth is that most of my working and business life involved a ridiculous amount of violence on a daily basis, for years and years, not something I wished for but couldn’t reverse because of early and unwise choices.

It turned me against that kind of life, but it took me years to escape from it. It’s all I knew to earn enough money to bring up my children as best I could, and the horrors along the way will always be horrors and will give me nightmares for the rest of my life.

I remember a Scottish giant outside a disco I owned in Scotland who had got past my two ex-SAS bouncers and tried to plunge a knife into my chest, which was deflected by a watch I was wearing.

I drove back to England a couple of months later and paused at the border to kiss a much safer soil.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

Hmmm. It's not much safer in the UK. A friend who was a bouncer has some frightening knife scars.

More and more I'm in agreement with DD who says you should write your life story. It should be an interesting read. That watch was a good buy eh?

Re: 11.11.11am
 

I'm embarrassed now, but the deed has already been done, four times. I'm not going to post the link to my website, It would be waste of time commercially, and blow my cover on a site I enjoy posting on anonymously.

It all happened a few years ago now and didn't make me rich, but I still receive cheques on a regular basis. I got one for 250 US Dollars last week from a book published in 1996, which I thought was well out of print. Apparently it's been resurrected as an e-book.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

No doubt you now have many thousands of regular readers in suspenders.:huh:
At least you've given us a few clues from time to time, so it seems like we'll just have to use our imagination to paint the full picture and complete the story. :confused:

Re: 11.11.11am
 

I'm not surprised if you are a writer. The way you describe things has that mark.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

It wouldn't surprise me if there were a few more writers lurking around here:-)
It always surprises and delights me how people with education and emotional intelligence can chat side by side with people they'd ignore in social situations on this forum. It seems a safer environment. I'm a medium-oldie who embraces media like facebook because, far from stifling cultural exchange it increases it. We don't all have to agree but I, at least don't feel threatened by someone who disagrees or wants to have a full on shouting match with me:-) In fact it gives us all space to listen.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

Well said Angie.
There are possibly a few interesting writers lurking, as you say, just as there are others less well mannered, who seem to specialise in shouting and bullying, fortunately very few in numbers, which you no doubt have already noticed. ;)
Anyway it seems you can hold your own quite nicely, so no great worries there.
Best wishes and I hope you continue to enjoy the forum.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

I can only echo what DD said. I hope you continue to find the forum stimulating and enjoying. By the way, I hope you had a good weekend in Madrid, and you didn't find it too cold.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

Thanks guys. It was a great weekend... As I said it was only work. So I didn't notice the weather. I like staying in Madrid and have a good friend who has a lovely 'spare' flat there. This meant we could afford to do the fair without earning the sort of money we used to earn before 'la crisis'. And the real upside is we made contact with someone who might be give my husband a job...(Fingers are very crossed) So we would be spending more time in Madrid...or even Seville if that comes off. More importantly we'd be able to halt the backward slide that trying to live on one small income is causing:thumbup:

Re: 11.11.11am
 

Glad you had a good time, and hope the job for your OH comes off.

If you fancy winding him up re vegetarianism, point out all the fluffy bunnies that were murdered by the nasty farmers so that he could eat his veggies.

He he he he. Yeah, I know, I'm going to hell.......

Re: 11.11.11am
 

You can’t go to hell, Bil, there isn’t one. There’s no heaven either. Unless you’re cremated, you will join the food chain like the rest of us.

Isn’t it lovely how a simple post can attract so much intelligent comment, even when the original subject has long been forgotten.

My daughter is a vegan and looks well on it, whereas I eat anything put in front of me and don’t look that well on it. So far today I’ve had sausages twice, frozen potato skins with cheese, and beans, twice (the beans).

I weigh myself every Wednesday morning and starve myself on Monday and Tuesday to make up for the sausages and potato skins (and chocolate lollies, chocolate chip cookies, fried breakfast etc) I’ve had for the rest of the week.

The time to go back on rabbit food is fast approaching.

Re: 11.11.11am
 

Figure of speach dude, figure of speach.

I don't mind veggos who do it because they just can't bear the thought of something being killed to give them a burger or whatever.

Sadly tho I think many do so as an attention getting trick. 'Oooo, look at me, I'm special.'

Those who eat fish and claim to be veggos are fricking hypocrites, and those who lay claim to doing it on moral grounds are laying themselves open to serious, justified criticism.

After all, the vegetables they eat are only there because someone else killed all the rabbits, birds and other vermin that would have eaten it long before it could have been got to the plate.

Morals are a black and white thing, which is why I despise things done for moral reasons. If it is morally incorrect to kill a cow, then it's morally wrong to swat a fly or kill a rat.

Animals that are to be used as food should be granted the best life possible and killed as humanely as possible. Anything else is wrong, wrong, wrong.