Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back.
Jul 19th 2008 | 12:52 am
#46
I don't give a damn
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,980
From: In the arms of my family. Heaven...
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
Jul 19th 2008 | 1:10 am
#47
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 4,395
From: England
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
London dull and depressing? All I can say about those Aussie types who thought that of London is that they obviously have a very, very, very limited outlook on life and an immense lack of interests and must be as boring as they sound. Samuel Johnson said many years ago that anyone who is tired of London must be tired of life.
There is absolutely NO comparison between London and Sydney, Australia. No way on this earth does Sydney have all the scope that London has, nothing like as many places of interest of all kinds, be it theatres, a whole range of entertainent, clubs, top rate shopping, museums, parks, historical site and buildings, activities of all kinds to suit all kinds, architecture, pomp and ceremony, great events of all kinds, huge transportation system and so much going on all around you all the year round. You name it, London has it. London caters for all tastes and all kinds of people. There is always something going on in London, good as well as not so good, but it is a massively big city after all. It's also a massively diverse city, with parts of it entirely different in nature from others. Hampstead is entirely different from Camberwell but both have charms and attractions of their own. So do Harrow and Croydon, Kensington and Tottenham, and so on. What Sydney has, London most probably has the same two, three or four times over with quite a bit to spare.
Hop onto any train at one of the many London railway terminals and you can be out into glorious countryside of England within half an hour at the most, at the seaside on the south coast of England in just over an hour at most, and on one of those trains you can be in an entirely different country on an actual Continental land mass in less than an hour and three quarters station to station.
Those Aussies who found London "dull and depressing" must, therefore, be nothing more than dull depressives themselves, and judging by many of the posts in this forum they are probably well suited to their own homeland.
There is absolutely NO comparison between London and Sydney, Australia. No way on this earth does Sydney have all the scope that London has, nothing like as many places of interest of all kinds, be it theatres, a whole range of entertainent, clubs, top rate shopping, museums, parks, historical site and buildings, activities of all kinds to suit all kinds, architecture, pomp and ceremony, great events of all kinds, huge transportation system and so much going on all around you all the year round. You name it, London has it. London caters for all tastes and all kinds of people. There is always something going on in London, good as well as not so good, but it is a massively big city after all. It's also a massively diverse city, with parts of it entirely different in nature from others. Hampstead is entirely different from Camberwell but both have charms and attractions of their own. So do Harrow and Croydon, Kensington and Tottenham, and so on. What Sydney has, London most probably has the same two, three or four times over with quite a bit to spare.
Hop onto any train at one of the many London railway terminals and you can be out into glorious countryside of England within half an hour at the most, at the seaside on the south coast of England in just over an hour at most, and on one of those trains you can be in an entirely different country on an actual Continental land mass in less than an hour and three quarters station to station.
Those Aussies who found London "dull and depressing" must, therefore, be nothing more than dull depressives themselves, and judging by many of the posts in this forum they are probably well suited to their own homeland.
Aug 6th 2008 | 2:23 am
#48
Just Joined
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
hmmm, interesting. But I don't think you gave Oz a chance. I'm gay, from England, but have settled in Australia. There are many things I miss about England, but homophobia is not one of them. I'm proud of the wit of my home nation, but with this wit come many other traits. The English often pride themselves on their ability to put people down, the more cutting the remark you can make the more respect you seem to get from your peers. Aussies rarely have us falling over in fits of laughter, but on the other hand, they are less likely to put people down than the English. Now I'm saying the English as opposed to the Brits, because I believe that in a certain respect the English differ from the Aussies in the same way that the English differ from the countrymen of the other British countries. I get the feeling that the English have a bit of superiority complex, and the Aussies a bit of inferiority complex. Now I'm English, I'm proud to be English and will always be English, but after reading a thread like this, I feel obliged to stick up for Australia, and the Australians who have made me, a gay guy from the England, welcome in their country.
Aug 6th 2008 | 11:52 am
#49
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,043
From: My happy place
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
London dull and depressing? All I can say about those Aussie types who thought that of London is that they obviously have a very, very, very limited outlook on life and an immense lack of interests and must be as boring as they sound. Samuel Johnson said many years ago that anyone who is tired of London must be tired of life.
There is absolutely NO comparison between London and Sydney, Australia. No way on this earth does Sydney have all the scope that London has, nothing like as many places of interest of all kinds, be it theatres, a whole range of entertainent, clubs, top rate shopping, museums, parks, historical site and buildings, activities of all kinds to suit all kinds, architecture, pomp and ceremony, great events of all kinds, huge transportation system and so much going on all around you all the year round. You name it, London has it. London caters for all tastes and all kinds of people. There is always something going on in London, good as well as not so good, but it is a massively big city after all. It's also a massively diverse city, with parts of it entirely different in nature from others. Hampstead is entirely different from Camberwell but both have charms and attractions of their own. So do Harrow and Croydon, Kensington and Tottenham, and so on. What Sydney has, London most probably has the same two, three or four times over with quite a bit to spare.
Hop onto any train at one of the many London railway terminals and you can be out into glorious countryside of England within half an hour at the most, at the seaside on the south coast of England in just over an hour at most, and on one of those trains you can be in an entirely different country on an actual Continental land mass in less than an hour and three quarters station to station.
Those Aussies who found London "dull and depressing" must, therefore, be nothing more than dull depressives themselves, and judging by many of the posts in this forum they are probably well suited to their own homeland.
There is absolutely NO comparison between London and Sydney, Australia. No way on this earth does Sydney have all the scope that London has, nothing like as many places of interest of all kinds, be it theatres, a whole range of entertainent, clubs, top rate shopping, museums, parks, historical site and buildings, activities of all kinds to suit all kinds, architecture, pomp and ceremony, great events of all kinds, huge transportation system and so much going on all around you all the year round. You name it, London has it. London caters for all tastes and all kinds of people. There is always something going on in London, good as well as not so good, but it is a massively big city after all. It's also a massively diverse city, with parts of it entirely different in nature from others. Hampstead is entirely different from Camberwell but both have charms and attractions of their own. So do Harrow and Croydon, Kensington and Tottenham, and so on. What Sydney has, London most probably has the same two, three or four times over with quite a bit to spare.
Hop onto any train at one of the many London railway terminals and you can be out into glorious countryside of England within half an hour at the most, at the seaside on the south coast of England in just over an hour at most, and on one of those trains you can be in an entirely different country on an actual Continental land mass in less than an hour and three quarters station to station.
Those Aussies who found London "dull and depressing" must, therefore, be nothing more than dull depressives themselves, and judging by many of the posts in this forum they are probably well suited to their own homeland.
I've lived in Sydney for 19yrs and thankfully will reclaim a sense of living next year when we move back to UK. But I've never understood why people even begin to compare Sydney to London! London has what 11mil people? Sydney has 3.8mil people. You earn less money in Sydney, there is way less to do, it's less exciting, crime may be possibly lower in Sydney, but two thirds lower? I don't think so. We were burgled last week (garage only) and we live in a so called 'nice suburb' (Lane Cove).
Given Sydney is so much smaller in population, it shouldn't have anywhere near the amount of issues than it does. For that reason alone, Sydney as a city, and a display of forward thinking is an abject failure. Its focus on everything being in the one CBD and the mentality of it's inhabitants scuttling off each night to far flung suburban blandness, is its biggest weakness.
Sydney could be great, but it isn't. It could be world class, but it isn't (well it is a short term tourist destination, but even they get bored after a few days). The reason it isn't is it has aspirations to become a global 'player' but is ran with a corner shop mentality. Band aid after band aid solutions, constant 'tefloning' of blame for a rapidly increasing failure of infrastructure between state and fed govs means nothing gets done, and broken promise after broken promise from yet another set of politicians with anarchic ideas of progression and a penchant for corruption and nepotism.
I've never been to Manchester (made it to Warrinton once to see Radiohead
) but why aren't more comparisons done between Manchester and Sydney? Similar sizes aren't they?For me, comparing Sydney to London is ludicrous, why not compare Canberra to London if we're comparing Capital cities? Sydney wants to be something it isn't, and all the posturing, self promotion and fireworks in the world won't change that. The only thing Sydney has in common with London is infrastructure and expense problems. But London has an excuse with a high population and high wages, which is balanced by a vibrant culture, (yes there are places you wouldn't go in London, but Sydney is hardly immune to that either is it?) and plenty to do for the resident (rather than tourist). Sydney has no excuse for it's failings, just reasons for them.
Tough decisions were made in London a few years ago re Congestion Charge, private vehicles, lorries etc. They weren't popular, but at least they were insightful and at least someone was thinking ahead. Sydney's mentality is completely reactive rather than proactive, and even then very bad decisions are made (Cross City Tunnel anyone?). Sydney wants to be a 'player' but it wants to have a quiet life as well and that ain't possible. You're a friend of public transport users or you're a friend of the motorist, you can't be both, but Sydney has had that mentality for years and is now paying for it.
Geographically Sydney is big, but it's mentality is small, it's impact on the world stage exaggerated, it's 'attractions' are tired and shabby, (rather than old and steeped in history), it's a city run and inhabited by suburbanites. It has disproportionate commuting times compared to it's population and in every measure against London, fails, miserably.
Oh, except in one, the variety of international eateries in Sydney does put London to shame. But hey if that's all, forget about it. By a Thai cookbook
Aug 6th 2008 | 11:54 pm
#50
I don't give a damn
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 4,980
From: In the arms of my family. Heaven...
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
Capital post that
I've lived in Sydney for 19yrs and thankfully will reclaim a sense of living next year when we move back to UK. But I've never understood why people even begin to compare Sydney to London! London has what 11mil people? Sydney has 3.8mil people. You earn less money in Sydney, there is way less to do, it's less exciting, crime may be possibly lower in Sydney, but two thirds lower? I don't think so. We were burgled last week (garage only) and we live in a so called 'nice suburb' (Lane Cove).
Given Sydney is so much smaller in population, it shouldn't have anywhere near the amount of issues than it does. For that reason alone, Sydney as a city, and a display of forward thinking is an abject failure. Its focus on everything being in the one CBD and the mentality of it's inhabitants scuttling off each night to far flung suburban blandness, is its biggest weakness.
Sydney could be great, but it isn't. It could be world class, but it isn't (well it is a short term tourist destination, but even they get bored after a few days). The reason it isn't is it has aspirations to become a global 'player' but is ran with a corner shop mentality. Band aid after band aid solutions, constant 'tefloning' of blame for a rapidly increasing failure of infrastructure between state and fed govs means nothing gets done, and broken promise after broken promise from yet another set of politicians with anarchic ideas of progression and a penchant for corruption and nepotism.
I've never been to Manchester (made it to Warrinton once to see Radiohead) but why aren't more comparisons done between Manchester and Sydney? Similar sizes aren't they?
For me, comparing Sydney to London is ludicrous, why not compare Canberra to London if we're comparing Capital cities? Sydney wants to be something it isn't, and all the posturing, self promotion and fireworks in the world won't change that. The only thing Sydney has in common with London is infrastructure and expense problems. But London has an excuse with a high population and high wages, which is balanced by a vibrant culture, (yes there are places you wouldn't go in London, but Sydney is hardly immune to that either is it?) and plenty to do for the resident (rather than tourist). Sydney has no excuse for it's failings, just reasons for them.
Tough decisions were made in London a few years ago re Congestion Charge, private vehicles, lorries etc. They weren't popular, but at least they were insightful and at least someone was thinking ahead. Sydney's mentality is completely reactive rather than proactive, and even then very bad decisions are made (Cross City Tunnel anyone?). Sydney wants to be a 'player' but it wants to have a quiet life as well and that ain't possible. You're a friend of public transport users or you're a friend of the motorist, you can't be both, but Sydney has had that mentality for years and is now paying for it.
Geographically Sydney is big, but it's mentality is small, it's impact on the world stage exaggerated, it's 'attractions' are tired and shabby, (rather than old and steeped in history), it's a city run and inhabited by suburbanites. It has disproportionate commuting times compared to it's population and in every measure against London, fails, miserably.
Oh, except in one, the variety of international eateries in Sydney does put London to shame. But hey if that's all, forget about it. By a Thai cookbook
I've lived in Sydney for 19yrs and thankfully will reclaim a sense of living next year when we move back to UK. But I've never understood why people even begin to compare Sydney to London! London has what 11mil people? Sydney has 3.8mil people. You earn less money in Sydney, there is way less to do, it's less exciting, crime may be possibly lower in Sydney, but two thirds lower? I don't think so. We were burgled last week (garage only) and we live in a so called 'nice suburb' (Lane Cove).
Given Sydney is so much smaller in population, it shouldn't have anywhere near the amount of issues than it does. For that reason alone, Sydney as a city, and a display of forward thinking is an abject failure. Its focus on everything being in the one CBD and the mentality of it's inhabitants scuttling off each night to far flung suburban blandness, is its biggest weakness.
Sydney could be great, but it isn't. It could be world class, but it isn't (well it is a short term tourist destination, but even they get bored after a few days). The reason it isn't is it has aspirations to become a global 'player' but is ran with a corner shop mentality. Band aid after band aid solutions, constant 'tefloning' of blame for a rapidly increasing failure of infrastructure between state and fed govs means nothing gets done, and broken promise after broken promise from yet another set of politicians with anarchic ideas of progression and a penchant for corruption and nepotism.
I've never been to Manchester (made it to Warrinton once to see Radiohead
) but why aren't more comparisons done between Manchester and Sydney? Similar sizes aren't they?For me, comparing Sydney to London is ludicrous, why not compare Canberra to London if we're comparing Capital cities? Sydney wants to be something it isn't, and all the posturing, self promotion and fireworks in the world won't change that. The only thing Sydney has in common with London is infrastructure and expense problems. But London has an excuse with a high population and high wages, which is balanced by a vibrant culture, (yes there are places you wouldn't go in London, but Sydney is hardly immune to that either is it?) and plenty to do for the resident (rather than tourist). Sydney has no excuse for it's failings, just reasons for them.
Tough decisions were made in London a few years ago re Congestion Charge, private vehicles, lorries etc. They weren't popular, but at least they were insightful and at least someone was thinking ahead. Sydney's mentality is completely reactive rather than proactive, and even then very bad decisions are made (Cross City Tunnel anyone?). Sydney wants to be a 'player' but it wants to have a quiet life as well and that ain't possible. You're a friend of public transport users or you're a friend of the motorist, you can't be both, but Sydney has had that mentality for years and is now paying for it.
Geographically Sydney is big, but it's mentality is small, it's impact on the world stage exaggerated, it's 'attractions' are tired and shabby, (rather than old and steeped in history), it's a city run and inhabited by suburbanites. It has disproportionate commuting times compared to it's population and in every measure against London, fails, miserably.
Oh, except in one, the variety of international eateries in Sydney does put London to shame. But hey if that's all, forget about it. By a Thai cookbook
That is one of the best descriptions of Sydney I have ever read!
Totally agree on every point. Having been back in blighty since June I do miss the eateries in Sydney. I keep getting this urge to open up a Sydney style eatery but i know damn well i could not bare to run it..lol
Aug 10th 2008 | 3:21 pm
#51
Just Joined
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 6
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
That is one of the best descriptions of Sydney I have ever read!
Totally agree on every point. Having been back in blighty since June I do miss the eateries in Sydney. I keep getting this urge to open up a Sydney style eatery but i know damn well i could not bare to run it..lol
Totally agree on every point. Having been back in blighty since June I do miss the eateries in Sydney. I keep getting this urge to open up a Sydney style eatery but i know damn well i could not bare to run it..lol
Aug 10th 2008 | 11:36 pm
#52
Thread Starter
Just Joined
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 18
From: Brighton
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
Its been very interesting reading this thread, Australia is very homophobic with maybe the exception of Sydney city but one you get out even to the burbs of sydney its scary...my partner and I (gay guys) were heckeld in Queensland on many occasions and no we wernt in drag or in pink for that matter....BUT thats why we chose to live in Auckland New Zealand where I have to say is so liberel in comparison its a different world. Kiwis are so different form aussies thank god. Still miss home though,been here 14 years and finally thinking seriously about moving back to the UK.
Jesus i think i would of cracked up by now after 14 year. 3 month was ample. I can honestly say i nearly kissed the floor when we arrived at Heathrow, even though we were only away the best part of 5 month. I think its a case of you dont know what you got till its gone. I used to slag England off all the time before i left, but now i realise how liberal and head of the times it is compared to other countries.
Aug 12th 2008 | 1:25 am
#53
Forum Regular
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 178
From: Back in Scotland after two dreadful years in Brisbane.
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
Capital post that
I've lived in Sydney for 19yrs and thankfully will reclaim a sense of living next year when we move back to UK. But I've never understood why people even begin to compare Sydney to London! London has what 11mil people? Sydney has 3.8mil people. You earn less money in Sydney, there is way less to do, it's less exciting, crime may be possibly lower in Sydney, but two thirds lower? I don't think so. We were burgled last week (garage only) and we live in a so called 'nice suburb' (Lane Cove).
Given Sydney is so much smaller in population, it shouldn't have anywhere near the amount of issues than it does. For that reason alone, Sydney as a city, and a display of forward thinking is an abject failure. Its focus on everything being in the one CBD and the mentality of it's inhabitants scuttling off each night to far flung suburban blandness, is its biggest weakness.
Sydney could be great, but it isn't. It could be world class, but it isn't (well it is a short term tourist destination, but even they get bored after a few days). The reason it isn't is it has aspirations to become a global 'player' but is ran with a corner shop mentality. Band aid after band aid solutions, constant 'tefloning' of blame for a rapidly increasing failure of infrastructure between state and fed govs means nothing gets done, and broken promise after broken promise from yet another set of politicians with anarchic ideas of progression and a penchant for corruption and nepotism.
I've never been to Manchester (made it to Warrinton once to see Radiohead) but why aren't more comparisons done between Manchester and Sydney? Similar sizes aren't they?
For me, comparing Sydney to London is ludicrous, why not compare Canberra to London if we're comparing Capital cities? Sydney wants to be something it isn't, and all the posturing, self promotion and fireworks in the world won't change that. The only thing Sydney has in common with London is infrastructure and expense problems. But London has an excuse with a high population and high wages, which is balanced by a vibrant culture, (yes there are places you wouldn't go in London, but Sydney is hardly immune to that either is it?) and plenty to do for the resident (rather than tourist). Sydney has no excuse for it's failings, just reasons for them.
Tough decisions were made in London a few years ago re Congestion Charge, private vehicles, lorries etc. They weren't popular, but at least they were insightful and at least someone was thinking ahead. Sydney's mentality is completely reactive rather than proactive, and even then very bad decisions are made (Cross City Tunnel anyone?). Sydney wants to be a 'player' but it wants to have a quiet life as well and that ain't possible. You're a friend of public transport users or you're a friend of the motorist, you can't be both, but Sydney has had that mentality for years and is now paying for it.
Geographically Sydney is big, but it's mentality is small, it's impact on the world stage exaggerated, it's 'attractions' are tired and shabby, (rather than old and steeped in history), it's a city run and inhabited by suburbanites. It has disproportionate commuting times compared to it's population and in every measure against London, fails, miserably.
Oh, except in one, the variety of international eateries in Sydney does put London to shame. But hey if that's all, forget about it. By a Thai cookbook
I've lived in Sydney for 19yrs and thankfully will reclaim a sense of living next year when we move back to UK. But I've never understood why people even begin to compare Sydney to London! London has what 11mil people? Sydney has 3.8mil people. You earn less money in Sydney, there is way less to do, it's less exciting, crime may be possibly lower in Sydney, but two thirds lower? I don't think so. We were burgled last week (garage only) and we live in a so called 'nice suburb' (Lane Cove).
Given Sydney is so much smaller in population, it shouldn't have anywhere near the amount of issues than it does. For that reason alone, Sydney as a city, and a display of forward thinking is an abject failure. Its focus on everything being in the one CBD and the mentality of it's inhabitants scuttling off each night to far flung suburban blandness, is its biggest weakness.
Sydney could be great, but it isn't. It could be world class, but it isn't (well it is a short term tourist destination, but even they get bored after a few days). The reason it isn't is it has aspirations to become a global 'player' but is ran with a corner shop mentality. Band aid after band aid solutions, constant 'tefloning' of blame for a rapidly increasing failure of infrastructure between state and fed govs means nothing gets done, and broken promise after broken promise from yet another set of politicians with anarchic ideas of progression and a penchant for corruption and nepotism.
I've never been to Manchester (made it to Warrinton once to see Radiohead
) but why aren't more comparisons done between Manchester and Sydney? Similar sizes aren't they?For me, comparing Sydney to London is ludicrous, why not compare Canberra to London if we're comparing Capital cities? Sydney wants to be something it isn't, and all the posturing, self promotion and fireworks in the world won't change that. The only thing Sydney has in common with London is infrastructure and expense problems. But London has an excuse with a high population and high wages, which is balanced by a vibrant culture, (yes there are places you wouldn't go in London, but Sydney is hardly immune to that either is it?) and plenty to do for the resident (rather than tourist). Sydney has no excuse for it's failings, just reasons for them.
Tough decisions were made in London a few years ago re Congestion Charge, private vehicles, lorries etc. They weren't popular, but at least they were insightful and at least someone was thinking ahead. Sydney's mentality is completely reactive rather than proactive, and even then very bad decisions are made (Cross City Tunnel anyone?). Sydney wants to be a 'player' but it wants to have a quiet life as well and that ain't possible. You're a friend of public transport users or you're a friend of the motorist, you can't be both, but Sydney has had that mentality for years and is now paying for it.
Geographically Sydney is big, but it's mentality is small, it's impact on the world stage exaggerated, it's 'attractions' are tired and shabby, (rather than old and steeped in history), it's a city run and inhabited by suburbanites. It has disproportionate commuting times compared to it's population and in every measure against London, fails, miserably.
Oh, except in one, the variety of international eateries in Sydney does put London to shame. But hey if that's all, forget about it. By a Thai cookbook
I spent a weekend there and it felt quite over hyped to me.
I think it is just Australia in general,when you look at it on the map of the world then It's position speaks volumes! The End of the Earth for crying out loud......................
But no one would hear you.
Aug 12th 2008 | 2:16 am
#54
itchy feet again!
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,013
From: Ex-Canada: now rural West Sussex.
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
Capital post that
I've lived in Sydney for 19yrs and thankfully will reclaim a sense of living next year when we move back to UK. But I've never understood why people even begin to compare Sydney to London! London has what 11mil people? Sydney has 3.8mil people. You earn less money in Sydney, there is way less to do, it's less exciting, crime may be possibly lower in Sydney, but two thirds lower? I don't think so. We were burgled last week (garage only) and we live in a so called 'nice suburb' (Lane Cove).
Given Sydney is so much smaller in population, it shouldn't have anywhere near the amount of issues than it does. For that reason alone, Sydney as a city, and a display of forward thinking is an abject failure. Its focus on everything being in the one CBD and the mentality of it's inhabitants scuttling off each night to far flung suburban blandness, is its biggest weakness.
Sydney could be great, but it isn't. It could be world class, but it isn't (well it is a short term tourist destination, but even they get bored after a few days). The reason it isn't is it has aspirations to become a global 'player' but is ran with a corner shop mentality. Band aid after band aid solutions, constant 'tefloning' of blame for a rapidly increasing failure of infrastructure between state and fed govs means nothing gets done, and broken promise after broken promise from yet another set of politicians with anarchic ideas of progression and a penchant for corruption and nepotism.
I've never been to Manchester (made it to Warrinton once to see Radiohead) but why aren't more comparisons done between Manchester and Sydney? Similar sizes aren't they?
For me, comparing Sydney to London is ludicrous, why not compare Canberra to London if we're comparing Capital cities? Sydney wants to be something it isn't, and all the posturing, self promotion and fireworks in the world won't change that. The only thing Sydney has in common with London is infrastructure and expense problems. But London has an excuse with a high population and high wages, which is balanced by a vibrant culture, (yes there are places you wouldn't go in London, but Sydney is hardly immune to that either is it?) and plenty to do for the resident (rather than tourist). Sydney has no excuse for it's failings, just reasons for them.
Tough decisions were made in London a few years ago re Congestion Charge, private vehicles, lorries etc. They weren't popular, but at least they were insightful and at least someone was thinking ahead. Sydney's mentality is completely reactive rather than proactive, and even then very bad decisions are made (Cross City Tunnel anyone?). Sydney wants to be a 'player' but it wants to have a quiet life as well and that ain't possible. You're a friend of public transport users or you're a friend of the motorist, you can't be both, but Sydney has had that mentality for years and is now paying for it.
Geographically Sydney is big, but it's mentality is small, it's impact on the world stage exaggerated, it's 'attractions' are tired and shabby, (rather than old and steeped in history), it's a city run and inhabited by suburbanites. It has disproportionate commuting times compared to it's population and in every measure against London, fails, miserably.
Oh, except in one, the variety of international eateries in Sydney does put London to shame. But hey if that's all, forget about it. By a Thai cookbook
I've lived in Sydney for 19yrs and thankfully will reclaim a sense of living next year when we move back to UK. But I've never understood why people even begin to compare Sydney to London! London has what 11mil people? Sydney has 3.8mil people. You earn less money in Sydney, there is way less to do, it's less exciting, crime may be possibly lower in Sydney, but two thirds lower? I don't think so. We were burgled last week (garage only) and we live in a so called 'nice suburb' (Lane Cove).
Given Sydney is so much smaller in population, it shouldn't have anywhere near the amount of issues than it does. For that reason alone, Sydney as a city, and a display of forward thinking is an abject failure. Its focus on everything being in the one CBD and the mentality of it's inhabitants scuttling off each night to far flung suburban blandness, is its biggest weakness.
Sydney could be great, but it isn't. It could be world class, but it isn't (well it is a short term tourist destination, but even they get bored after a few days). The reason it isn't is it has aspirations to become a global 'player' but is ran with a corner shop mentality. Band aid after band aid solutions, constant 'tefloning' of blame for a rapidly increasing failure of infrastructure between state and fed govs means nothing gets done, and broken promise after broken promise from yet another set of politicians with anarchic ideas of progression and a penchant for corruption and nepotism.
I've never been to Manchester (made it to Warrinton once to see Radiohead
) but why aren't more comparisons done between Manchester and Sydney? Similar sizes aren't they?For me, comparing Sydney to London is ludicrous, why not compare Canberra to London if we're comparing Capital cities? Sydney wants to be something it isn't, and all the posturing, self promotion and fireworks in the world won't change that. The only thing Sydney has in common with London is infrastructure and expense problems. But London has an excuse with a high population and high wages, which is balanced by a vibrant culture, (yes there are places you wouldn't go in London, but Sydney is hardly immune to that either is it?) and plenty to do for the resident (rather than tourist). Sydney has no excuse for it's failings, just reasons for them.
Tough decisions were made in London a few years ago re Congestion Charge, private vehicles, lorries etc. They weren't popular, but at least they were insightful and at least someone was thinking ahead. Sydney's mentality is completely reactive rather than proactive, and even then very bad decisions are made (Cross City Tunnel anyone?). Sydney wants to be a 'player' but it wants to have a quiet life as well and that ain't possible. You're a friend of public transport users or you're a friend of the motorist, you can't be both, but Sydney has had that mentality for years and is now paying for it.
Geographically Sydney is big, but it's mentality is small, it's impact on the world stage exaggerated, it's 'attractions' are tired and shabby, (rather than old and steeped in history), it's a city run and inhabited by suburbanites. It has disproportionate commuting times compared to it's population and in every measure against London, fails, miserably.
Oh, except in one, the variety of international eateries in Sydney does put London to shame. But hey if that's all, forget about it. By a Thai cookbook
Oct 22nd 2008 | 8:32 pm
#55
Forum Regular
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 141
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
Did anyone feel that australia wasn't for them? We managed 3 months and couldnt wait to leave, we travelled up the east coast from Melbourne to Brisbane. What a dissapointment, nowhere stood out, very beige I would say.
We thought we would make this thread for anyone thinking of moving, of course you might have a totally different experience, but this is from a gay couples point of view.
We went travelling there at the beginning of april and planned to settle after finding a place we liked the most..... we didnt. All i harped on about for the past 5 year was moving to oz. And am pleased to say i have got it out of my system and will be in the UK tomorrow, as we are currently touring asia and are at our final stop (Hong Kong)
:curse:=======================RANT WARNING====================:curse:
Here are some points we thought needed to be voiced:
a) Patriotism is almost sickening (what is there to be so proud of?)
b) Racism - We heard of a man in his 20's up north petrol bombing a Indian familys house and going about braggin about it.
c) Its impossible to make friend with aussies.... If you dont have an aussie accent dont bother looking for a decent conversation or making a friend.
d) Sh!!te food shopping
e) Even sh!!ter T.V
f) Its like living in the 80's. Even the mobile phones are behind the times.
g) Having a "perfect" body is a be all or end all.
h) Sexism- If you or are not a white hetrosexual male your automatically a 2nd class citizen.
I) THEE Worst banking system in the world! Again it feels like stepping into a time-warp to the 80s just going into a bank. No chip and pin, and just all magnetic strips and ridiculous charges for the most simple things. Almost anything important has to be done in a branch, making phone helpline a waste of time. All you ever hear is "you need to visit the branch to do that)
J) Being asked for I.D For absolutly EVERYTHING!!! in the bank while trying to withdraw money over the counter we had to enter our pin number(anywhere else that would be it) then produce not only our passports but our driving licenses before they would hand money over....After all that we had to sign our signature not once but twice to cross check on the system as the first time they said it wasnt my signature!
Also we were BOTH asked for id whilst buying a bottle of wine, we are both 22 and look our age, my partner had his id but woudnt let him buy it coz he was stood next to me!
k) Homophobia - I actaully am gay and from the first day of arriving in oz i and my partner felt almost uncomfortable. It all came to a head when we were in Brisbane. We shot on some clothes not thinking as you do and went into town unfortunate for us our choice of t-shirts happened to be pastel pink..... we must of been heckled and called puff and fag 10 times just on a 15 min walk into town, People in cars shouting and passers by in the street laughing. We felt bullied and i was never even bullied in school! Im sorry but pink is what 99% of straight guys wear back home!
l) We personally can't wait for Australia to become a Republic. Then finally the Union Jack will be removed from there flag. They do not deserve to be associated with such a great symbol (now who's being patriotic? well at least we have something to be patriotic about)
We thought we would make this thread for anyone thinking of moving, of course you might have a totally different experience, but this is from a gay couples point of view.
We went travelling there at the beginning of april and planned to settle after finding a place we liked the most..... we didnt. All i harped on about for the past 5 year was moving to oz. And am pleased to say i have got it out of my system and will be in the UK tomorrow, as we are currently touring asia and are at our final stop (Hong Kong)
:curse:=======================RANT WARNING====================:curse:
Here are some points we thought needed to be voiced:
a) Patriotism is almost sickening (what is there to be so proud of?)
b) Racism - We heard of a man in his 20's up north petrol bombing a Indian familys house and going about braggin about it.
c) Its impossible to make friend with aussies.... If you dont have an aussie accent dont bother looking for a decent conversation or making a friend.
d) Sh!!te food shopping
e) Even sh!!ter T.V
f) Its like living in the 80's. Even the mobile phones are behind the times.
g) Having a "perfect" body is a be all or end all.
h) Sexism- If you or are not a white hetrosexual male your automatically a 2nd class citizen.
I) THEE Worst banking system in the world! Again it feels like stepping into a time-warp to the 80s just going into a bank. No chip and pin, and just all magnetic strips and ridiculous charges for the most simple things. Almost anything important has to be done in a branch, making phone helpline a waste of time. All you ever hear is "you need to visit the branch to do that)
J) Being asked for I.D For absolutly EVERYTHING!!! in the bank while trying to withdraw money over the counter we had to enter our pin number(anywhere else that would be it) then produce not only our passports but our driving licenses before they would hand money over....After all that we had to sign our signature not once but twice to cross check on the system as the first time they said it wasnt my signature!
Also we were BOTH asked for id whilst buying a bottle of wine, we are both 22 and look our age, my partner had his id but woudnt let him buy it coz he was stood next to me!
k) Homophobia - I actaully am gay and from the first day of arriving in oz i and my partner felt almost uncomfortable. It all came to a head when we were in Brisbane. We shot on some clothes not thinking as you do and went into town unfortunate for us our choice of t-shirts happened to be pastel pink..... we must of been heckled and called puff and fag 10 times just on a 15 min walk into town, People in cars shouting and passers by in the street laughing. We felt bullied and i was never even bullied in school! Im sorry but pink is what 99% of straight guys wear back home!
l) We personally can't wait for Australia to become a Republic. Then finally the Union Jack will be removed from there flag. They do not deserve to be associated with such a great symbol (now who's being patriotic? well at least we have something to be patriotic about)
Interesting message about the gay thing in Australia. I have lived here since 2002 and it does take ALONG TIME to get used to the insularity of the gay world here and the ABSOLOUTE obsession (to the point of saturation) of the guys being sooooo self-absorbed about who they are with and how they look!. It is monocultured on the gay scene, even in Sydney!. Oxford Street is a scruffy looking place these days and getting quite violent on a night!. Not nice!. Yes, I think there are nice gay Aussie guys and girls out there, but their insecurity and lack of worldly knowledge, even in Sydney at times is quite astounding.
Strangely enough and actually who knows why??? ... I ended up in Alice Springs working in my profession for 3 years!. It was SIMPLY THE BEST TIME!. A sizeable GLBTI community in amongst 27,000 people and all very eccentric!. Very nice people, very broad minded, and actually very well-travelled indeed!. Have met many nicer and open people there than any other place in Australia and that is the TRUTH of it!. Weird hu!. The media would have us all believe that Sydney is some sort of gay mecca!. Well, I don't think so!. Like give me London, Amsterdam, Berlin or Manchester any day of the week.
Like being in Sydney, but will return to the mothership one day soon!. Proper beer, conversation and the people are for all our faults, not whingers (we have views, depth and think about things) ... Australians whine about everything, and have a clue about little!. I always think secretly that they wished they lived somewhere else on a Kontiki tour bus or something really tacky!.
Cheers boys
Stroll on UK gay scenes ... fact is we may bitch about them sometimes, but when all said and done, they ARE THE BEST! Yosh! xoxoxoxo
Oct 23rd 2008 | 1:49 am
#56
BE Enthusiast
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 377
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
if u think they r anti gay in aus ....never come to abu dhabi...its illegal here !!!
last year the police crashed a gay wedding and sent them all to prison for 6/10 yrs where they will receive hormone treatment to turn them back to real men LOL xxxx
last year the police crashed a gay wedding and sent them all to prison for 6/10 yrs where they will receive hormone treatment to turn them back to real men LOL xxxx
Oct 23rd 2008 | 10:39 am
#57
Greetings Traveller
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 278
From: Sydney
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
You only have to look at the Sydney Time Out to know that there is lots more going on in London (oops- nearly said "heaps more" ) Last year it was a monthly publication then changed to weekly but is now fortnightly and it's very small in comparison to London's because there's hardly any content in it (& what content there is is pants). None of the Aussies we know even know of Time Out's existence cos in general people don't go out & about & do stuff. Fair enough there is the odd good thing on now & then but in terms of range & variety & consistency of attractions, entertainment, etc London wins it.
) Last year it was a monthly publication then changed to weekly but is now fortnightly and it's very small in comparison to London's because there's hardly any content in it (& what content there is is pants). None of the Aussies we know even know of Time Out's existence cos in general people don't go out & about & do stuff. Fair enough there is the odd good thing on now & then but in terms of range & variety & consistency of attractions, entertainment, etc London wins it.
Oct 29th 2008 | 12:30 am
#58
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,830
From: Perth
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
You only have to look at the Sydney Time Out to know that there is lots more going on in London (oops- nearly said "heaps more" ) Last year it was a monthly publication then changed to weekly but is now fortnightly and it's very small in comparison to London's because there's hardly any content in it (& what content there is is pants). None of the Aussies we know even know of Time Out's existence cos in general people don't go out & about & do stuff. Fair enough there is the odd good thing on now & then but in terms of range & variety & consistency of attractions, entertainment, etc London wins it.
) Last year it was a monthly publication then changed to weekly but is now fortnightly and it's very small in comparison to London's because there's hardly any content in it (& what content there is is pants). None of the Aussies we know even know of Time Out's existence cos in general people don't go out & about & do stuff. Fair enough there is the odd good thing on now & then but in terms of range & variety & consistency of attractions, entertainment, etc London wins it.
Oct 29th 2008 | 12:51 am
#59
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 6,830
From: Perth
Re: Moving to Oz from a gay point of view. Dislikes of Australia and why we came back
Hi
Interesting message about the gay thing in Australia. I have lived here since 2002 and it does take ALONG TIME to get used to the insularity of the gay world here and the ABSOLOUTE obsession (to the point of saturation) of the guys being sooooo self-absorbed about who they are with and how they look!. It is monocultured on the gay scene, even in Sydney!. Oxford Street is a scruffy looking place these days and getting quite violent on a night!. Not nice!. Yes, I think there are nice gay Aussie guys and girls out there, but their insecurity and lack of worldly knowledge, even in Sydney at times is quite astounding.
Strangely enough and actually who knows why??? ... I ended up in Alice Springs working in my profession for 3 years!. It was SIMPLY THE BEST TIME!. A sizeable GLBTI community in amongst 27,000 people and all very eccentric!. Very nice people, very broad minded, and actually very well-travelled indeed!. Have met many nicer and open people there than any other place in Australia and that is the TRUTH of it!. Weird hu!. The media would have us all believe that Sydney is some sort of gay mecca!. Well, I don't think so!. Like give me London, Amsterdam, Berlin or Manchester any day of the week.
Like being in Sydney, but will return to the mothership one day soon!. Proper beer, conversation and the people are for all our faults, not whingers (we have views, depth and think about things) ... Australians whine about everything, and have a clue about little!. I always think secretly that they wished they lived somewhere else on a Kontiki tour bus or something really tacky!.
Cheers boys
Stroll on UK gay scenes ... fact is we may bitch about them sometimes, but when all said and done, they ARE THE BEST! Yosh! xoxoxoxo
Interesting message about the gay thing in Australia. I have lived here since 2002 and it does take ALONG TIME to get used to the insularity of the gay world here and the ABSOLOUTE obsession (to the point of saturation) of the guys being sooooo self-absorbed about who they are with and how they look!. It is monocultured on the gay scene, even in Sydney!. Oxford Street is a scruffy looking place these days and getting quite violent on a night!. Not nice!. Yes, I think there are nice gay Aussie guys and girls out there, but their insecurity and lack of worldly knowledge, even in Sydney at times is quite astounding.
Strangely enough and actually who knows why??? ... I ended up in Alice Springs working in my profession for 3 years!. It was SIMPLY THE BEST TIME!. A sizeable GLBTI community in amongst 27,000 people and all very eccentric!. Very nice people, very broad minded, and actually very well-travelled indeed!. Have met many nicer and open people there than any other place in Australia and that is the TRUTH of it!. Weird hu!. The media would have us all believe that Sydney is some sort of gay mecca!. Well, I don't think so!. Like give me London, Amsterdam, Berlin or Manchester any day of the week.
Like being in Sydney, but will return to the mothership one day soon!. Proper beer, conversation and the people are for all our faults, not whingers (we have views, depth and think about things) ... Australians whine about everything, and have a clue about little!. I always think secretly that they wished they lived somewhere else on a Kontiki tour bus or something really tacky!.
Cheers boys
Stroll on UK gay scenes ... fact is we may bitch about them sometimes, but when all said and done, they ARE THE BEST! Yosh! xoxoxoxo
All i can add is last Saturday night twenty two of us [most of us not gay]went to NorthBridge here in Perth to watch the local gay mardi gras.
Total duration of event was 15 minutes being about half as long as when last seen two years prior.to my way of thinking if unable to stage something a little more spectacular and becoming of a city close on 1.5 million people then do not bother.
