slummymummy

OMG! Just found this thread... So funny, and true unfortunately. I'm Swedish but always felt kind of different. I went to London on holiday when I was 17, loved it and decided to move there. I did and lived there for 10+ years. Now I live in the US. My family sometimes say "why don't you come and live in Sweden?" and I'm like no way but it's hard to explain exactly why.

I love going to Sweden (Bohuslän) in the summer though, most beautiful place on earth!

Gordon Barlow

Blackie and Cletus. I travelled through in Scandinavia in 1963 as a backpacker (there's a post about it on my blog in January, if anybody's interested), and now I have two Norwegian grandchildren. I hasten to say there is no connection between the two facts: my English son provided the grandchildren!

I loved everything about Sweden when I was there. I haven't been back, but I still won't hear a word against the place or its people. So I'm not listening to the critics. Lalalalalalalala - that's me, hands over ears and not listening.

Norway - well, we've bought a forest cabin (hytte) there, which we're having done up. We may live there in our old age, if we can stand the cold!

OzTaylor

Well I've only been in Sweden for 6 months and despite the difficulty in getting my personnummer, it's pretty much as I expected. Being from the north of England I always knew my sense of humor might be lost on the Swedes (I believe we call it 'banter' back in the UK) but so far I've experienced a warm welcome from my neighbours. I've taken up winter sports, I'm learning the language, my job/business is going well and I feel optimistic for the future.

And it's on that last comment that I would like to elaborate, because after spending the last five years running a business in the UK, optimism was few and far between. Ok so maybe the Swedes don't like to criticise themselves but it's much better than the alternative of hearing/reading/seeing the effects of recession, cut backs, people constantly complaining about how well the other guy is doing, how hard it is getting to make a living etc. Being around that really saps the energy and drive out of a person, and I just had to get away.

Maybe after 40 years in Sweden, you see the steady, predictable lifestyle as a negative. I personally see it as a positive and as a steady platform on which to succeed. I think many people feel the way you do after dedicating their life to their family. Most guys buy a bright yellow Porsche or a sportsbike. All the best in France!

Mike1001

I have been here almost 5 months. I have to say everyone has been pretty pleasant from the guy in the local bike shop to the nursery teachers and I also have a great landlord. The weather has been good too. Sure it was cold in February but the sun has been shining for 80% of the time and it does not do that in the UK. We have two small kids so socialising is not our top,priority but we get out and about at weekends and there is a lot to do with great walks and great countryside. I have started my SFI and although not exactly enjoyable its not as bad as I thought it may have been. The administration from the authorities has been fine and my wife loves her job the kids are doing great so all in all a great move so far.

Think2times

Hi Guys

I'm a britt living in Malmo for the past 2 years.
I find Blackladder's list absolutely hilarious and (tongue in cheak or not) very accurate!

I am married (to another imigrant) with two children, and can say life has been far from the utopia we were expecting when moving to Sweden with our young family.

On a positive note, there are parks and activities galore. And the weather has been much better than what we were used to in the UK (North West). It is true that schooling is more affordable at all ages levels (Pre-school through to´university) and both parents get to spend time with their young children with paid copensation (The UK can learn a lot from the Swedes in this respect).

But on a not so positive note, we also find the people on an entirely different wave length to us in so many ways.
If you have kids with lots of energy and character, then quite frankly my advise is think twice before moving to Sweden.
We are either frowned upon for having such children in the first place (must be a problem with the parents mentality), or when we do need to discipline them (in a non aggresive way) we are frowned on for not allowing them to do as they want. Whenever Swedes sense a Child / parent conflict arising, you can be certain that they all stop what they are doing, stand around and stare with their fingers hovering over the police quickdial button on their mobile phones. (@Blackladder maybe this is the reason they have so many phones!?)

Also, I understood soon after moving to Sweden why we have the term "Angry Swede". Before relocating to Sweden, I had visions of a nation of people who were reserved but friendly and caring; After all, Swedes have a beautiful country with forests and retreats throughout. They stayed neutral in times of conflict having not been to war in 2 centuries (Perhaps they have centruries of aggression that has remained inside?).
Bus drivers too frenquently close the door on you whilst stepping on and off; cyslists shout at you / run you over if you hover in the cycle lane; Motorists who have absolutely no road manners whatsoever; People scream at you from time to time if you're not fully compliant with the "rules" (This is despite displays of emotion being aganist the "rules").
My wife was actually screamed at a couple of weeks back by a man who felt she should have done more to stop my 4 years son from having a tantrum on the street.

Well, we've given it our best, and despite liking so much about Sweden, we feel very alien to most Swedes. We have met some very nice people (other imigrants) who have no doubt made our 2 years in Sweden more tolerable, but we have decided to head back to the UK for a warmer social climate.

Hej Då

slummymummy

Wow, thanks for your report and good luck with the move!

I'm swedish but my kids were born in the UK and now living in Florida. I feel like in Sweden they wouldn't be allowed to be themselves, it's kind of like all kids have to fit the swedish model of how a child should be. I can't explain it very well, it's just a feeling.

And yeah people can be quite rude and unfriendly. I like going there for a few weeks holiday but I don't think I could ever live there again.

Gordon Barlow

My son and his Norwegian girlfriend (late 30s, mid 30s) have just this week moved to Stockholm - she to attend a music school, he to find work where he can. Neither speaks Swedish. They have just bought an old caravan for about 1500 pds, to live in for the next ten months at some camping ground. The online forums are full of reports on how hard it is to find a place to live in Stockholm and to find work there.

I'll report on this thread how he gets on finding a "yob" and how the caravan thing works out for them. He should be OK; He once lived in a treehouse in Guatemala (I've just posted a blog about that - "Not the Swiss Family Robinson") during his hippy phase. And he did find bits and pieces of work in Oslo ten years ago when he didn't speak Norwegian. So I want you all to think positive thoughts on his behalf. Send him energy, as he would put it. Thanks.

Annabel12

One of the things that I like about Sweden - no unruly kids here! In 3 months since I moved here I've seen only 1 (literally: ONE) tantrum in a superstore and the public was giving the mother a deathlook for not sorting little brat out - maybe a bit harsh but it works and I can do my shopping in peace
I haven't seen anyone shouting, though (yet?).
Wishing you all the best back in UK

Dick Dasterdly

I think you have been very fortunate, though to be fair they are normally not so bad in public places, but maybe that's down to the shy reserved nature of Swedes in general when in public.
However in their home environment, at school or other places with which they are very familiar, they can be your worst nightmare.

I know some schoolteachers who really despair at the way things are going not only with kids behaving like spoilt brats but also many of their parents who will never accept they do any wrong making teachers lives almost impossible.
In some ways they are more streetwise than UK kids knowing exactly how to play the system, how far they can push people and just what they can get away with, which is generally much more than in the UK.
The fact that Swedish teachers and parents have even more restrictions with regard to dealing with them than those in the UK certainly doesn't help either.

Dick Dasterdly

Apologies for the belated reply, if you are still with us that is.

Having gone through your posts again I have to say just how accurate they are with regard to Swedes and their lifestyle.

Maybe it's as well you still have a sense of humour, (amazing you haven't lost it by now), to survive the soul destroying Swedish system for all these years.

I don't live in Sweden now, much, much further South actually but I have spent a considerable amount of time there over the years and did consider making it my main home at one time, until I got the full measure of things that is.

Suffice to say my residencia was in the rubbish bin within the first 12 months, so I have been fortunate enough to continue enjoying what better things the country and it's people have to offer without ending up like a total zombie.

Quite a few unhappy people have found themselves victims of the Swedish flytrap, ie. starting a family with a Swedish partner who does not want to leave the country, but on the bright side no doubt there are those who can adjust to the drab routine of the lifestyle.

I fear the word spontaneity never quite found it's way into Swedish dictionaries or if it did I guess it must have been quickly stamped upon and suppressed by the powers that be.

Anyway, I wish you well with your new life in the S. of France and I hope it is all you would have wished for.

Blackladder

Hya Dick,thanks for the reply!
We are now settled in SW France, finally leaving Sweden on 15 December last year. We are loving every minute of it here and have managed to get accustomed to the French Lifestyle like fish in water.
Now, getting on for a year down here (or up here if you are in Spain), I find that I have almost forgotten what Life was actually like there. I am still in touch with a couple of good friends (one Scot, one Yank) who send me email cuttings from local newspapers and so on, plus their own thoughts on retirement in Sweden - and I don't envy them one bit.
Take care and thanks for the kind thoughts!
Blackie

Annabel12

Oh I believe that but frankly I don't care what they're like at home or school
In regards of parents and teachers' restrictions I would never decide to have a child in this country, no way.

Ugo51

The first post of this thread almost killed my Swedish dream, but then it kinda got better as I was reading through the whole thread. I don't really care whether people around me are friendly or prone to display of bad temper. Growing up in Italy got me immune to all that

What actually concerns me a little bit are taxes and accomodation...


It's my first post in the Scandinavia section though, so I guess I will look around a bit better before to come back asking for more.

Blackladder, I hope you're doing fine in France

Annabel12

Hej! Taxes are actually not that bad, also you don't pay National Insurance. I'm just starting up my business, I thought I would pay way more but I was wrong, also I'm already educated by Swedes how to pay less When I was in employment I paid less deductions then in UK, too.
Accomodation will be a problem if you go to big cities like Stockholm or Gotheborg but in the countryside houses are cheap as chips if you're happy to comute a bit.
Not sure what you wanna do but for the business the climate here is much better then the rest of the Europe and economy is expected to slowly but surely go up.
My plan is to earn my money and live in a decent house for a while here, then I'm heading South like Blackie. Someone said that Scandinavia is best place to work at the moment so take an advantage of that. Also it's a beautiful country - I wouldn't stay here forever but for 20 years or something that will do
Oh, not sure how you feel about Norway - I don't like it there but money is soooo much better - Swedes are immigrating to do shitty jobs there instead of decent ones here as they're much better off. Also in Norway it's easier to find English speaking job.

Ugo51

thanks Annabel!

I hope I will be able to get "educated" on how to pay less taxes as well
Don't get me wrong, I'm a strong supporter or the system "more taxes=more services" but it really depends on how much of your salary you have to give away

About accomodation, well, I guess it's up to how good transportation is.
I can live about 1hr from the workplace, no more.
That could be anything from 10 to 60Km radius
(this is new-thread material )


Thanks for the tip about Norway. I was just looking how much a university lecturer gets and for a moment I seriously thought there was a mistake. That's a LOT of money.
Cost of living is pretty high though...