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Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by scot47
(Post 10670550)
I see parralels between the way many of today's Muslims celebrate Ramadan and how "the West" celebrates Christmas. Consumerist overload complete with gluttony !
I suppose the West can excuse itself by using the label "post-Christian" to decribe the frivolous, infantile and celebrity-driven society that has developed there ! |
Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by mikewot
(Post 10670215)
Not fully sure I understand your argument, surely you should be able to explain why you do something, you must have a reason, you must have thought about it and made a decision based on something, even if it's just following the crowd.
But your link is based on modern scientific investigation, this was not available in the time period when the subject under discussion started, so this point is not valid. Human bodies (not sure why you refer to mammals) are very adaptable, thats why we can live in hot places and in cold places, we can eat a lot in one sitting or we can browse. Nature did not adapt our bodies for one particular niche but to cover a range of possibilities. Your maths needs some work because they're not actually fasting all the time are they? Only for a part of the day and the meals are a little more widely spaced. Bringing humanity closer to their nature? What does that mean because I can't make any sense out of it. Also not drinking water is not natural, that is the thing that will kill you quicker than not eating food. Are you saying that deprivation induces sme form of pleasure? So you're saying that actually all muslims want to die quickly and early because life is unnatural. That is an absolutely incredible statement!!!! I’ve presented my interpretations of the view point of Islam; you (and others here) obviously have a different interpretation and that’s fair enough. My last input, however, would be to pick up on the last point you made about Muslims wanting a quick death. It is actually forbidden In Islam to wish for death, or even a mere saying ‘I wish I die’ is actually not allowed. Paradoxically, however, Islam preaches the attitude of being preoccupied with death and the life after, as according to this belief, it is where the unlimited pleasures lie. That’s why someone with Islamic faith would not have this attitude of ‘life is short, I therefore must suck up all its pleasures before it is too late’. His attitude would rather be ‘If I get something good in this life it is only a bonus, the main and the ultimate are yet to come’. Oh…BTW, Someone asked if I have ever examined other people’s belief; let me assure you that comparative religion is every open-minded religious Muslim’s favourite subject. |
Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by redShark
(Post 10670619)
Oh…BTW, Someone asked if I have ever examined other people’s belief; let me assure you that comparative religion is every open-minded religious Muslim’s favourite subject.
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Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by Meow
(Post 10670562)
We're discussing Ramadan not Christmas and no one has said anything about Christmas or said it's better in any way. I fail to see the relevance of your post or the lack of point it makes.
Maybe not relevant but just a digression . |
Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by redShark
(Post 10670619)
I’ve presented my interpretations of the view point of Islam; you (and others here) obviously have a different interpretation and that’s fair enough..
Originally Posted by redShark
(Post 10670619)
That’s why someone with Islamic faith would not have this attitude of ‘life is short, I therefore must suck up all its pleasures before it is too late’. His attitude would rather be ‘If I get something good in this life it is only a bonus, the main and the ultimate are yet to come’.
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Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by mikewot
(Post 10670635)
But you've only made vague wandering statements and nothing at all about why you've decided to follow what you do. Perhaps I'm labouring under the misapprehension that you have given some consideration as to your choices?
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Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by redShark
(Post 10670619)
death and the life after, as according to this belief, it is where the unlimited pleasures lie.
I'm genuinely interested, not baiting you here. |
Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by redShark
(Post 10670619)
I’ve presented my interpretations of the view point of Islam; you (and others here) obviously have a different interpretation and that’s fair enough. My last input, however, would be to pick up on the last point you made about Muslims wanting a quick death.
It is actually forbidden In Islam to wish for death, or even a mere saying ‘I wish I die’ is actually not allowed. Paradoxically, however, Islam preaches the attitude of being preoccupied with death and the life after, as according to this belief, it is where the unlimited pleasures lie. That’s why someone with Islamic faith would not have this attitude of ‘life is short, I therefore must suck up all its pleasures before it is too late’. His attitude would rather be ‘If I get something good in this life it is only a bonus, the main and the ultimate are yet to come’. Oh…BTW, Someone asked if I have ever examined other people’s belief; let me assure you that comparative religion is every open-minded religious Muslim’s favourite subject. All religions have things you can, can't, must, mustn't do...don't they? Doesn't the Quran say that you shouldn't judge other people? |
Re: Ramadan Kareem !
O Scamp
My point was that the way Ramadan is celebrated with overeating and overindulgence is mirrored in the Way Christmas is celebrated in Europe and US. I realise you may be a bear with a small brain but I thought that even you could grasp this fairly simple concept. |
Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by scot47
(Post 10670675)
O Scamp
My point was that the way Ramadan is celebrated with overeating and overindulgence is mirrored in the Way Christmas is celebrated in Europe and US. I realise you may be a bear with a small brain but I thought that even you could grasp this fairly simple concept. |
Re: Ramadan Kareem !
But I don't like you ! I like Meow so I will blame you for her post. I will treat you to a free non-alcoholoc beverage in the unliukely event that we ever meet.
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Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by scot47
(Post 10670709)
But I don't like you ! I like Meow so I will blame you for her post. I will treat you to a free non-alcoholoc beverage in the unliukely event that we ever meet.
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Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by scot47
(Post 10670709)
But I don't like you ! I like Meow so I will blame you for her post. I will treat you to a free non-alcoholoc beverage in the unliukely event that we ever meet.
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Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by mikewot
(Post 10670635)
But you've only made vague wandering statements and nothing at all about why you've decided to follow what you do. Perhaps I'm labouring under the misapprehension that you have given some consideration as to your choices?
But why have that attitude, where is the proof that there is an afterlife? Who has come back to tell you? If you look at the universe around you, you would see that everywhere there is an incredible system of balance. If energy is lost somewhere it will defiantly reappear in exact amount somewhere else, and so on. From this very law of equilibrium stems the Newton laws of action and reaction, for every action there is an equal and opposite amount of reaction. I have a phrase for this law, I call it the law of ‘ultimate justice’. Now let’s look back at life on earth and see if you can find this law!!.. I can’t find it, I don’t find ultimate justice on earth!... I find cruel people committing untold amount of evil and yet they die in peace! On the other hand, I see nice people with beautiful hearts suffer terribly in life and die in agony!! Where is this law of equilibrium then? Could it be that this law is missing on earth when it is everywhere in the universe? Absolutely not- so how can you solve this mystery? The only palpable solution to this problem is to have another life where this unbalanced equilibrium is rebalanced and this law of’ ultimate justice’ is eventually fulfilled. This is how I see logic, and this is also the starting point where anyone asking about the creator should start from., because once you’ve managed to answer this question then the next question of God’s existence will be easy to answer. |
Re: Ramadan Kareem !
Originally Posted by Kix
(Post 10670643)
What are the "Ultimate Pleasures"?
I'm genuinely interested, not baiting you here. It is in your mind search for it; Like I said, we are mentally wired up to see it in our mind, that’s why we are disappointed with life on earth because we can not attain it. |
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