Mecca
 

Not much chance of getting in unless you are a Muslim but you can have a peak here

Witness Mecca's Dramatic Transformation Over The Past Century In Just 14 Photos

Re: Mecca
 

I thought this thread was about the Bingo hall chain :(

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I think I'd rather face ISIS than some of the old women in those Bingo clubs!

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Truly distasteful urbanisation. Imagine if we decided to commercialise Stonehenge by erecting skyscrapers around it. Arabs simply making money.

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the millionaires apartments overlooking it just do it for me.

I struggle to find the words to describe it, really I do.

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I agree, it is pretty sad how 'commercial' it all is now. It has boiled down to, me hearing two persons talking to each other : 'Did you do the cheap Hajj or the expensive one?' The other guy proudly stating 'I went all out on this one'

Basically from what I have been told, the cheap one means that you cannot afford the ridiculously high room rates closer to the mosque so you have to take a room as far as your pocket will allow and then walk as taxis are out of the question in those days.

Yep, all about money now.

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and by that alone did islam start to die

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everything dies

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Except viruses.

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My boss recently did Hajj. It cost him around 1000USD per day with the hotels, taxis, shuttles etc.

not cheap.

Anyway - Christmas is quite a sell out event.

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Christianity gave us St. Peter's and Rome.

Islam gave us Mecca?

I see.

That aside, there are beautiful historic mosques all over the greater Islamic world and it's odd that the heart of Islam is a rather ugly affair.....

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Unlike its soul ?

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it now resembles LAS VEGAS.

thanks to the Al Saws

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Sir, you are referring to my former employers !

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No it's not...some of us are quite selfless. I'm asking for: New golf clubs, so my old ones can be given to a mate, new iPhone so I can give my mrs mine and not have to buy her one and world peace.

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Your arrogant comments and attitude is appalling. It seems you have a deep burning hatred for Islam, Muslims and Middle East as a whole.

I have been through many of your posts and you seem to be spouting the same vitrol over and over again, whenever the topic of Islam and Muslims comes into play.

I suggest you keep your biased thoughts to yourself, and not on this forum, especially since you are living in this part of the world. Just some friendly advice.

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That there's fighting talk where we come from. I thought you'd be one not to be involved in threats, intimidation and violence. Are you with Daish?

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Interesting first post. Welcome to BE, tell us about yourself. Where are you from in UK? What are you doing out here?

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Doesn't sound friendly. :blink:

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I flew in to Madinah en route to Al Ula & Mada'in Saleh a few years back. There's a ring road and a load of pillars demarking the haram bit. The road kept dipping in and out of the haram zone. Felt like a naughty boy traspassing

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So you would have everyone be politically correct and bit their tongue in the face of injustice. It is precisely because he lives in the MidEast that he can firsthand see the meanness that is the norm for the MidEast .

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have the Mutawaa joined the sandpit?

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Yes, instead of mods giving bans as a punishment you could now get lashes instead.

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Any latex?

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Optional extra for which there is a supplement.

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Norm_uk I think he/she/it is one of those one shot wonders, will never be seen again.

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You know some people pay good money for that sort of stuff! :o

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Now that you have asked, yes there are a large number of your posts where you have blatantly attacked Islam and yes I do take an exception to that.

It is one thing stating you disagree with the notion of religion in general or Islam, which you are entitled to. But making a mockery of Prophets and places of worship is stepping the line a bit too far. So I am making a kind request to you to stop this hate and mockery, especially since you are living in Abu Dhabi and knowing how advanced technology is I would hate to you see you on the wrong side of the law.

And before anyone starts to accuse me of being an Islamic Extremist, Daesh, ISIS, Taleban, AQ or whatever twisted group you accuse all Muslims of belonging to. Let me remind you that I have no affiliation to any group or sect and have the utmost respect for all faiths, even Atheists.

Furthermore, let me also add that I abhor those religious bigots' which attack other non Muslims and adopt cultural elements which are then seemed to be associated with Islam. To me they are no different to EDL or BNP.

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Why is, or should, any religion be immune from mockery?

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how advanced is it exactly? i'm intrigued.

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I think you can mock or disapprove of various aspects of any or all religions, but general mockery of an entire religion is at the very least disrespectful and could cause upset feelings.
It is the gross generalisation thing again.

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Give it a rest...
Mocking religion is one of the core parts of every stand-up comedians routine. And generalisations is what makes it funny.

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Disrepectful. Why should I, or anyone else, show respect to any religion which has caused untold suffering and death over centuries? That goes for pretty-much any organised religion. Nobody has the right to demand respect.

Upset feelings. This forum is, essentially, British. Part of the essence of being British is free speech. Free speech trumps hurt feelings, every time. Moreover, if someone has their feelings hurt by reading what's on here, their choice is simple: deal with it, or don't read.

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I take your point, but I think there is a difference between comedy and 'serious' mockery, or denigration. A joke made by Bernard Manning was quite different to one made by Eric Morecombe for instance!!

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How would you react to a post mocking Christians in general??
This is a discussion forum, you would at least expect a protest or different opinion would you not??

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Opinions - yes.
Threats - no.

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Mock Christians in the West. Most people don't blink and don't care and don't get defensive or argumentative about it. In the "christian" west we thrive on debate and open argument and nothing is sacred. The devout Christians I know in the West welcome the debate for it makes their faith stronger. They say they have nothing to be afraid of, that's how much they value their faith.

I'm not opposed to the general concept of religion. I think many devout people are admirable. I think many wonderful things have happened because of religion.

But I don't like Islam. I think it's a terrible, repressive and ugly and of all the world's main religions, it's by far the worst one. I don't like the role of women in Islamic societies. It's the Islamic world, not the Christian world or the Jewish world, that has the genuine problems with fundamentalists. There's no Christian or Hindu or Sikh or Confucian version of Afghanistan or ISIL. I think much of the Islamic world is terribly backwards. I think the Koran is hypocritical and even horrendous (yes, I've read it). I don't like the extreme double standards I find in Islamic preaching and Sharia law - such as it's ok for a Muslim man to marry a non Muslim woman, but if a Muslim woman marries a non-Muslim, all hell apparently breaks loose.

Does it mean I don't like Muslims? Hell, no. I like many Muslims. I respect their general devoutness (as long as they don't take it too seriously and attempt to infringe it on others). I know most Muslims are people who just want to have a normal life with their families and friends, no differently from how most people across the world just want to have a normal, quiet life, and I'm all for that.

I just don't like their religion.

There, I've said it.

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I agree with most of what you have said. This what I meant!!
You have respect for devout christians you know. You know "most Muslims----" etc.
This is discussion, rather than generalised mockery or derision which sometimes occurs.

(I think all the religions have or have had their share of fundamentalists).

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Entirely justified. I might criticise it if the grammar was bad.

My "religion" is to try to be nice to people, treat others as I would like to be treated, try to relieve some of the suffering in the world, not object to anyone holding a view unless its damaging to others but speak up or take action when that's not the case.

However, this is a debate forum, and since you've asked the question, I fail to see how any rational person needs a huge institution which has a history of torture, murder, rape, idolatory, homophobism, sexual discrimination, sexual repression, child abuse (by way of indoctrination) in order to believe in the same good things as I believe in. In fact, any rational person would be deeply embarrassed and should be constantly apologetic for all the things which his or her institution has done (and, in many cases, continues to do), which can't be good for anyone's spiritual well-being or self-confidence. So, happy-clappy Christians who are all about love are deeply hypocritical in the compartmentalisation they must go through in order to block out the vile sins of their institution. Although I give many of them great allowance, because they are weak-minded and have been indoctrinated since childhood into believing the non-sense forced upon them.

Hope that clarifies.

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Religion:
"Ridicule is the only weapon that can be used against unintelligible propositions. Ideas must be distinct before reason can act upon them."
-Thomas Jefferson

The way to deal with superstition is not to be polite to it, but to tackle it with all arms, and so rout it, cripple it, and make it forever infamous and ridiculous. Is it, perchance, cherished by persons who should know better? Then their folly should be brought out into the light of day, and exhibited there in all its hideousness until they flee from it, hiding their heads in shame.
True enough, even a superstitious man has certain inalienable rights. He has a right to harbor and indulge his imbecilities as long as he pleases, provided only he does not try to inflict them upon other men by force. He has a right to argue for them as eloquently as he can, in season and out of season. He has a right to teach them to his children. But certainly he has no right to be protected against the free criticism of those who do not hold them. He has no right to demand that they be treated as sacred. He has no right to preach them without challenge. Did Darrow, in the course of his dreadful bombardment of Bryan, drop a few shells, incidentally, into measurably cleaner camps? Then let the garrisons of those camps look to their defenses. They are free to shoot back. But they can't disarm their enemy.
-- H L Mencken, "Aftermath" The Baltimore Evening Sun, (September 14, 1925)