The things you hear.
Dec 27th 2014, 3:43 pm
#106
Forum Regular
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 96
Re: The things you hear.
Well, depends on the definitions of "vast" and "nondescript." What is certainly true is that there is significant acreage of brownfield sites in the UK, all the way from major cities and suburbs to small rural towns. Much of this awaits redevelopment, limited only by planning and environmental considerations, and, of course, developers' judgements as to when the market is ripe.
For instance, a town I know in North Nofolk, there's a prime site near the railway station, relatively small, maybe ten acres. Factory/ warehouse on the site has been vacant and derelict for at least twenty years. Now a very desirable development of about 150 homes is under construction. The developer ironed out the bargain with the local council last year, and judged the time was ripe in terms of demand for homes. Probably there are tens of thousands of such sites throughout the UK.
For instance, a town I know in North Nofolk, there's a prime site near the railway station, relatively small, maybe ten acres. Factory/ warehouse on the site has been vacant and derelict for at least twenty years. Now a very desirable development of about 150 homes is under construction. The developer ironed out the bargain with the local council last year, and judged the time was ripe in terms of demand for homes. Probably there are tens of thousands of such sites throughout the UK.
But there again, we aint a democracy any more, are we?
Dec 27th 2014, 4:17 pm
#107
Heading for Poppyland
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: North Norfolk and northern New York State
Posts: 14,558
Re: The things you hear.
Ask the people who live next door about what? Not sure if your remarks have anything to do with my post, which you quoted.. If you mean, ask the people who live next door to a derelict factory site or similar whether they would rather it was developed or left derelict, probably many would prefer a new development with new homes to derelict buildings. If however the potential development is on green fields, then most would probably prefer it to remain undeveloped.
Dec 27th 2014, 8:02 pm
#108
Life is what YOU make it.
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: Christchurch
Posts: 3,312
Re: The things you hear.
A very large number of Brown field sites scattered across the towns and cities of the UK will suffer ground work problems to convert them into housing sites. Contamination from past known, and more importantly, unknown industrial processes will quite often mean the removal and safe disposal of vast amounts of earth waste and the expensive replacement of this spoil with clean infill.
Some of these sites will have mains water works and electrical supplies running within their boundaries that will require redirection.
The better use for a lot of these sites is not for the extra housing but all of the extra infrastructure the increased inhabitants will require, i.e areas for extra car parking, filling stations, schools, hospitals, roads, shops, sports centres, workplaces etc.......
Some of these sites will have mains water works and electrical supplies running within their boundaries that will require redirection.
The better use for a lot of these sites is not for the extra housing but all of the extra infrastructure the increased inhabitants will require, i.e areas for extra car parking, filling stations, schools, hospitals, roads, shops, sports centres, workplaces etc.......
Dec 27th 2014, 10:23 pm
#109
Yo
Joined: Nov 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 24,501
Re: The things you hear.
So you think you can easily build new towns, villages etc in the "desolate"
north of the country
Who will be paying for all this work? Then you will need to provide all the social
services to cater for these people. Who will pay for all this?
I suppose you will say build some more factories,etc.
You folks live in the land of nod.
I bet you all live in very nice areas. As far away from the plebs as possible.
If this lunacy carries on there are always gated compounds to reside in.
You will think I am a complete nutter no doubt, but until we exit the corrupt
eu we cannot control our own destiny.
Oh,BTW, will anyone give me an answer to the question I asked, namely,
At what level of population should we say enough is enough?
north of the country
Who will be paying for all this work? Then you will need to provide all the social
services to cater for these people. Who will pay for all this?
I suppose you will say build some more factories,etc.
You folks live in the land of nod.
I bet you all live in very nice areas. As far away from the plebs as possible.
If this lunacy carries on there are always gated compounds to reside in.
You will think I am a complete nutter no doubt, but until we exit the corrupt
eu we cannot control our own destiny.
Oh,BTW, will anyone give me an answer to the question I asked, namely,
At what level of population should we say enough is enough?
As for population size, the equation is not simply based on geographical area, but on the practical and financial (pensions) needs of the lump of aged citizens the UK will need to look after. If we're 63 MN now somewhere up to, say 80 million should be possible with good planning. Easier said done, but not impossible.
Dec 27th 2014, 10:28 pm
#110
Yo
Joined: Nov 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 24,501
Re: The things you hear.
Vast is a relative word. My point was that too many write off Britain as lacking space, when in fact it is mainly the SE that is crowded. Even within the SE there is plenty of space to accommodate new towns or expand villages. Whether that is desire able is a different argument, but it is quite incorrect to suggest the country is out of space.
Dec 28th 2014, 5:25 pm
#111
Forum Regular
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 96
Re: The things you hear.
"Who will be paying for all this work?" Easy. When Barratts or Persimmon build a development of houses, their investment is eventually paid for when the houses are sold. Infrastructure to support the new population is paid for by elements the developer agrees to put in place as a quid pro quo to being granted planning permission, council tax and other fees the new residents pay, and subventions from county and national government agencies as appropriate. Obviously, the new residents are taxpayers (income tax, stamp duty, VAT, etc. etc.)
"What level of population should we say enough is enough?" Sorry don't know.
"What level of population should we say enough is enough?" Sorry don't know.
Private hospitals, private schools, private roads, no subsidised housing.
Robin, this sounds absolutely fantastic. All I can say is if pigs could fly, you
would be my choice of squadron leader.
Dec 28th 2014, 6:11 pm
#112
Oscar nominated
Joined: Jan 2008
Location: Moncton, NB, CANADA
Posts: 50,937
Re: The things you hear.
You have missed the part about the additional taxes raised from all those involved in the developments and the subsequent boost to the economy.
Last edited by BristolUK; Dec 28th 2014 at 6:14 pm.
Dec 28th 2014, 11:35 pm
#113
Heading for Poppyland
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: North Norfolk and northern New York State
Posts: 14,558
Re: The things you hear.
Do you really have no understanding of capitalism? Of why developers might build houses? Of the planning process? Of the fact that people who live in Britain have jobs, earn wages, pay taxes? In short, I'm not sure what cloud you're living on...
Last edited by robin1234; Dec 28th 2014 at 11:39 pm.
Dec 29th 2014, 12:59 am
#114
Yo
Joined: Nov 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 24,501
Re: The things you hear.
Well, depends on the definitions of "vast" and "nondescript." What is certainly true is that there is significant acreage of brownfield sites in the UK, all the way from major cities and suburbs to small rural towns. Much of this awaits redevelopment, limited only by planning and environmental considerations, and, of course, developers' judgements as to when the market is ripe.
For instance, a town I know in North Nofolk, there's a prime site near the railway station, relatively small, maybe ten acres. Factory/ warehouse on the site has been vacant and derelict for at least twenty years. Now a very desirable development of about 150 homes is under construction. The developer ironed out the bargain with the local council last year, and judged the time was ripe in terms of demand for homes. Probably there are tens of thousands of such sites throughout the UK.
For instance, a town I know in North Nofolk, there's a prime site near the railway station, relatively small, maybe ten acres. Factory/ warehouse on the site has been vacant and derelict for at least twenty years. Now a very desirable development of about 150 homes is under construction. The developer ironed out the bargain with the local council last year, and judged the time was ripe in terms of demand for homes. Probably there are tens of thousands of such sites throughout the UK.
There is also arable land producing low crop yields or grazing a few animals, conveniently subsidised by the EU. If necessary such land could support new towns or infrastructure without the country risking starvation. Of course, brownfield is a better development choice (for society) and should be pursued first.
Dec 29th 2014, 3:41 am
#115
Born again atheist
Joined: Jul 2005
Location: Europe (to be specified).
Posts: 30,259
Re: The things you hear.
I don't realy understand your post. It seems completely unrelated to what I wrote, anyway.
Do you really have no understanding of capitalism? Of why developers might build houses? Of the planning process? Of the fact that people who live in Britain have jobs, earn wages, pay taxes? In short, I'm not sure what cloud you're living on...
Do you really have no understanding of capitalism? Of why developers might build houses? Of the planning process? Of the fact that people who live in Britain have jobs, earn wages, pay taxes? In short, I'm not sure what cloud you're living on...
Dec 29th 2014, 10:49 am
#116
Concierge
Joined: May 2006
Location: ex ex-pat, in Taunton
Posts: 27,220
Re: The things you hear.
So you think you can easily build new towns, villages etc in the "desolate"
north of the country
Who will be paying for all this work? Then you will need to provide all the social
services to cater for these people. Who will pay for all this?
I suppose you will say build some more factories,etc.
You folks live in the land of nod.
I bet you all live in very nice areas. As far away from the plebs as possible.
If this lunacy carries on there are always gated compounds to reside in.
You will think I am a complete nutter no doubt, but until we exit the corrupt
eu we cannot control our own destiny.
Oh,BTW, will anyone give me an answer to the question I asked, namely,
At what level of population should we say enough is enough?
north of the country
Who will be paying for all this work? Then you will need to provide all the social
services to cater for these people. Who will pay for all this?
I suppose you will say build some more factories,etc.
You folks live in the land of nod.
I bet you all live in very nice areas. As far away from the plebs as possible.
If this lunacy carries on there are always gated compounds to reside in.
You will think I am a complete nutter no doubt, but until we exit the corrupt
eu we cannot control our own destiny.
Oh,BTW, will anyone give me an answer to the question I asked, namely,
At what level of population should we say enough is enough?
You are really beginning to sound like Paulry in the UKIP thread, he really needs a few friends there..
Dec 29th 2014, 2:13 pm
#117
Heading for Poppyland
Joined: Jul 2007
Location: North Norfolk and northern New York State
Posts: 14,558
Re: The things you hear.
If we do set a figure, what happens when we reach it, do we have the 100 babies born today, so we have to deport 100 people, or euthanase 100 older people to make room?
You are really beginning to sound like Paulry in the UKIP thread, he really needs a few friends there..
You are really beginning to sound like Paulry in the UKIP thread, he really needs a few friends there..
