Pollyana

I remember when my now ex-husband came to the UK for the first time, in 2003. He had expected cold and rain, even in August. Instead he landed at Heathrow where the temperature that day was 38 degrees and spent the first few days moaning about a lack of ceiling fans and air con. He just couldn't understand that the houses didn't have those things cos we never normally needed them!

Moses2013

Actually that was the time when hundreds of people died in the UK and although that was extreme, it's not unusual that London has quite a few days above 25 degrees during summer. People are actually surprised when they hear that London has a summer just as sunny as Aucklands.

Lorry1

'In America 2-3 times a year & Canada from time to time'. WOW you must have so much experience of the culture over there.
The only thing we have in common is the language, and even that's questionable. Many words & sayings are different and sometimes it's a struggle to actually get what you are trying to ask for.

You can definitely get culture shock as a Brit moving to the US, Canada, OZ, NZ and any other 'English' speaking country. They are not the same.

I don't know about spain, or France or Germany, as I have only been on holiday and wouldn't dare try & presume to know what their culture was like to live in day to day.

amideislas

I don't claim to be an expert in anything. I have fully disclosed my levels of experience, and it is demonstrably not zero as was previously suggested.

But I am British, having lived both in Britain and abroad for the majority of my adult life, and having travelled (and lived) extensively around the world, I do have a bit more experience than most do in terms of comparing similarities and differences between cultures.

Without the benefit of that frame of reference, some may find it disturbing to compare Yanks to Brits, demonstrably as many Brits wish to characterise the differences as as 'chalk and cheese'. But in the big scheme of things, there are far more similarities than differences, especially when compared to 'the rest of the world'.

No doubt that's not what some Brits want to hear. But c'mon, that's not my fault. Sorry.

Pollyana

I know, I lived there at the time It was just himself that was surprised, arriving from Queensland

Pollyana

Having discussed this with a Canadian, who has wide experience of Brits and Americans..........she said that the two peoples are vastly different - like chalk and cheese in fact!

amideislas

Naturally. I refer you to back my tomato analogy.

http://britishexpats.com/forum/rover.../#post11682762

Moses2013

Actually it's surprising how similar these countries are. You always get a few odd people wherever you are, but overall I've never had problems regarding culture. Take away the language and you'll find life is pretty much the same in these countries. Most people go to work, drive cars, they drink alcohol, play and watch football, you have churches, museums, cinemas, shopping malls etc.

themajor

I am in my 70's now and have travelled extensively all round the world. I have lived and taken residency in many countries. I happen to speak the language of some of those countries and still have the driving licences and books of residency.

The difference was as stated Chalk and Cheese.

Culture,religeon,laws,weather,language,education,i nfrastructure,economy etc etc etc.

amideislas

Yes, every country has roads, shops, museums, football, etc. But that's extremely simplistic. And since you brought it up...

If you are European, and travel to the US (and almost equally to the UK), it is quite visibly far more 'commercialised'. You will find a far greater occurrence of mega-stores, chain restaurants, shopping malls... everywhere, really. Advertising is remarkably more 'heavy-handed' and 'pushy'... I read somewhere that the density of 'chain' restaurants (including fast food) in US cities is something like 1 per sq. mile (and it does seem that way at times). In Britain it's probably a little less than that but not much, but here, it's perhaps 1 per 50 sq. kilometers. Americans and Brits are both demonstrably much more 'consumer-ish', and it's very obvious.

As you yourself know, Moses, Germans in particular are quite averse to big commercialism and blatantly hard sell. And the Spanish, well, forget it. Mega-discount-stores like Wal-Mart failed miserably in Germany. It just didn't suit them. Too much in one place. For tools, you go to the tool shop. For food, you go to the food shop. For bikes, you go to the bike shop... For automobile accessories, you go to the auto accessories store. Simples (?).

You will also find a dramatic difference in behaviour. For example, both Brits and Americans are well-known for their party and drinking culture.

I could point out a local example, Magaluf, which has become one of the wildest, most controversial (drunken) party resorts in Europe - and it's entirely British. We don't have many yanks here, but Magaluf is often compared to the American 'spring break' activities in Florida, Cabo San Lucas, and Cancun. Magaluf is not unlike a sunny Brighton or Blackpool - or Vegas for that matter. Flashing neon and loud music dominates the streets, every major fast-food brand on every corner, Everybody offering €1 pints, Fish & Chips, full English breakfasts...

On the other hand, most Europeans - especially the Spanish - are very moderate drinkers. Yes, they consume wine for lunch, and might put a bit of rum in their coffee, but I have yet to encounter a drunken Spaniard. Germans drink a bit more, but nothing like the Brits. Some Americans visited us a couple years back, and we were shocked at how much they could drink. From the afternoon to all night long. It's not really a criticism, because it was some of the best fun I'd had in years! Just an observation, that's all.

Speaking of that, Brits overwhelmingly prefer to be surrounded by British things on their hols abroad - and even the Brits who settle here overwhelmingly congregate almost exclusively in distinctly British communities where they can effectively enjoy 'Britain in the sun'. They don't have to learn a new language, they have easy access to F&C, HP sauce, Branston pickle, and can always get roast beef & pud on Sunday.

Most of the Brits we are friends with come from a more 'international' mindset, but we know a few who whinge endlessly about how 'un-British' everything is here. From the 'crap Spanish food' and the lack of Morrison's or Tesco or shopping malls, to 'crap Spanish beer', to those arrogant Spanish refusing to speak English, Spanish idiot drivers - because they drive on the 'wrong side of the road'.. They only buy food in (very expensive) British shops, refuse to speak a word of Spanish, and have never been to a local festival or market.

Germans, on the other hand, are far more likely to settle in non-German communities, preferring to blend in with the local culture. We have a lot of Germans around - especially in the outback. Most become fluent in Spanish, adopt local cuisine, attend local fiestas.. etc. Integrate into the community.

And whilst there are a few German-oriented holiday hotspots here, what's different is that whilst you will largely only find Brits in designated British resorts, you will find Germans, Scandinavians, Spanish, Italians, French and virtually all other Europeans everywhere. There really isn't much of a nationality distinction - except for the Brits.

Work - Yes, of course Europeans work, but the work culture is markedly different.

You mentioned Germans... Well, for me, one of the most pronounced differences is that Germans are much more process oriented - and most Americans and British expats working in Germany have to get used to this eventually (read the expat forums in Germany). And the chain of command is a bit more rigorous - you aren't supposed to address your boss by their first name, etc..

But Results are less important than following the proper process. A German plumber cannot remove a socket cover or flip the electricity off if he needs to connect an appliance. Only a certified electrician can do that.

Virtually any business you want to start in Germany requires some sort of university degree. The official stamp is the most important thing. Your actual skills are secondary. If you have the stamp, it is adequate proof that you are skilled, even if you have never done the job.

Brits and Americans, on the other hand, are far more results oriented. The object is achieving the desired result, rather than following a defined process. They are far more interested in simply getting the job done - right. American or British plumbers have the skills, can, and will flip the electricity off to install an appliance. You need not call the electrician.

Spanish - well, I reckon you could argue that they too are 'results' oriented. "Just put a little glue on it. That'll hold it up". "Just twist these wires together and put a little tape over it"...

But all kidding aside, the Spanish have a very different work and lifestyle ethic. In at 9:30 or 10:00, out at 13:30 (for siesta), back at 16:30 and work till 20:00. Then go home, read the paper, and eat at 22:00. On the weekends, it's the restaurant from 22:00 to 12:30, then maybe a drink at the local bar till 01:30 or 2:00.

Anyway, that says a lot about cultural differences.

So, if you're moving to the UK from the US or Canada, don't worry - it's really not all that [culturally] different, despite what they tell you.

You'll still have mostly all the same or similar stores & shopping, similar work hours and ethics, very similar foods, people speak a very similar language that you will most definitely understand without any problems (~Scotland?), they share many of the same interests, and despite how some Brits like to claim you're 'like chalk and cheese', in reality, it's more like 'Golden Delicious vs. Granny Smith'.

christmasoompa

Or, to be correct, *some* of you may have 'mostly all the same', but you'll be in the minority. I don't recognise most of the UK you've described, but then I don't live in a city and live a fairly rural life. So no consumerism near me whatsoever (nearest shopping mall is too far for me, I do any shopping online), little drinking (I have maybe 2 glasses a month), if I go on holiday I will seek out local foods (and so will my 2 children - gazpacho is a fave food with them if we go to Spain for example).

You mention similar working hours and ethics, but again you've never worked in the US and/or Canada - we found huge differences in working hours and ethics between Canada and the UK (a quick look at the Canada forums will reveal many others struggle to adapt too). And Canada certainly isn't 'results orientated', it seems it's much more like Germany where a degree is needed for pretty much any job. If you don't have a degree and several pieces of paper to your name in Canada, forget it. Even a secretary needs a degree.

In short, perhaps the two countries aren't that different if you are a pleb in the UK that doesn't care about other cultures or is driven by consumer goods. For the vast majority of people I know though, there is a huge difference and the generalisations you're making about Brits don't even come close to applying to them. You're also making incorrect assumptions about Canada (again, I can't comment on the US as I've never lived there).

As somebody that has lived in both countries, they really are 'chalk and cheese', no matter what you'd like to think.

Moses2013

Yes, I agree that there are many Brits who drink a lot and Magaluf is embarrassing. The Ballermann is similar for Germans, only that you find less naked younger women (more older men) and there are now stricter rules. I've seen loads of drunk French in France and the Dutch are drunk in Spain too. Include the Scandinavian countries, but they don't have a huge population like Germany or the UK, so don't get as much negative press. The Spanish actually drink a lot and the new generation is starting to be just as bad. Look up the videos of Spanish on the beach in Barcelona dumping their rubbish (not only tourists). Not all Spanish eat foreign food and a lot of Germans rather eat a tasty Bratwurst on holiday as well. You'll get all types of people everywhere and it might only be the old generation who have problems. We have loads of Spanish here in Galway and the culture is no different. You can watch the CL semi final in a pub where the Irish drink San Miguel and the Spanish drink Guinness, then you go to Barcelona and just watch it in a bar with the same type of drinks. And that commanding German is probably Turkish with a German passport Overall it's not a huge difference and you hear the same crappy songs in the charts, eat the same food and have the same problems with a bit of variety in each location.

Editha

Amideisias said:

Probably because they already had Aldi and Lidl.

aries

This sort of temperature is the exception rather than the rule, Brits usually complain of the heat once it gets to the mid twenties for more than a few days.

amideislas

Aldi and Lidl are NOTHING like wal-mart. They are FOOD stores. When you want food, you go to a food store. When you want Tyres, you go to the Tyres store. That's why it failed.