I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We
need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:

Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
seeing.

Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
and reasonable costs and congestions.

Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.

What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?

We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.

All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.

We'll be leaving from New York City.

Thank you.

"John" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife
> and I are in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip
> to Italy. We need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as
> reasonable cost as possible. Here are some of the things we're
> wondering about: Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an
> organized tour using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other
> tour operators, or do all the planning ourselves, e.g.
> transportation, cities, hotels, site seeing.
> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent
> weather and reasonable costs and congestions.
> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?

I've been to Italy 3x. Twice w-wife #1, 3d-time, wife #2. What
I did... Looked at the tour itinerraries for sites to put on my list,
but traveled independently. You can see more in less time, with
better hotels+food, and not have to put up with sheep-treatment
and cheesy-shops where guides get a kick-back. However, if
you're not driving, day-tours, like to Tivoli or Pompeii are useful.
Check out www.viator.com

Visit in April or May. The weather is not as hot, nor the crowds
as large. July+August are to be avoided.

I drove Rome-Florence-Amalfi Coast (will never drive in Rome
again) and did rail Rome-Florence-Venice-Milan. Rail stations
are very convenient to city-centers. I suggest rail between the
main cities and rent a car for touring Tuscany or Lake Region.

Rick Steves gets mixed reviews, but IMO, he provides practical
how-to, in-what-order, sightseeing advice, like maps to parking
lots in Sienna. Eyewitness Guides for more academic information.
=R

On Jul 29, 1:45 pm, John <[email protected]> wrote:
> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
> in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We
> need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
> possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>
> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
> all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
> seeing.


Doing it on your own, with a little bit of advance planning, will be
much cheaper, and give you much more flexibility as to where to go and
how much time to spend in places. And you will have a much better
chance to meet local people and to see things outside of the major
tourist sights.

It's really very easy to get around and see things on your own in
Italy, even if you aren't an experienced traveler.

> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
> and reasonable costs and congestions.


First choice: March-April or October-November.

Second choice: May-June-September.

Third choice: July-August.

Last choice: December-January-February, unless you want to visit the
south of Italy.

Costs don't vary much through the year, but crowds really do, and
summer days can be over 100 degrees while winters get cold except in
the south of Italy.

Despite the above, I've gone to Italy in December and in August, and
enjoyed both trips. Even in Venice or Rome in the middle of the
summer, there will be many interesting places that aren't packed with
tourists.

> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.


Trains are both cheap and fast, while driving is a nightmare in Rome,
and you can't even bring the car into Venice - and you don't need a
car to explore Florence. I would only rent a car if you really want
to visit small towns off the beaten track - and then return the car
when you're done with the small towns.

> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?


Lonely Planet and Frommer's guidebooks for Italy are both very good.
Which guidebook you would want depends on which of the following are
most important to you: (1) art and history, (2) food and wine, (3)
major tourist sights, (4) little-known or unusual sights, (5) modern
Italian life.

"John" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
> in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We need
> a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
> possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>
> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do all
> the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site seeing.
>
> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
> and reasonable costs and congestions.
>
> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
>
> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?
>
> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.
>
> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>
> We'll be leaving from New York City.
>
> Thank you.

Do it on your own. Do some research on what you want to see. Get
reservations for the first nights after you land. Rome is more expensive
than most places in Italy, but we still got a nice room for about $125 near
the opera house. Take the trains and if you need a car for a day, just rent
for a day. We just bought tickets on the train, as I think it is cheaper
than a Rail Pass. All the cities have tourist bureau that will help you
find a room in your price range. And the tourist bureau does not send you to
the most expensive. Last trip we spent a month. Only rented a car for 5
days, and a couple of those were because we were returning to Rome with a
heavy gift for a friend. We spent 4 nights in Rome, then off to Ischia,
then Sorrento, Assisi, Siena, Cinqua Terre, then back to Rome for a night
before returning to SFO. Used those as bases for exploring the surrounding
areas. IF you like the place you are stay longer, if not, leave to next
stop. Much more fun and flexible than a tour. But some have to have all
organized before they arrive. Different folks.

John wrote:
> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
> in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We
> need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
> possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>
> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
> all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
> seeing.
>
> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
> and reasonable costs and congestions.
>
> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
>
> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?
>
> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.
>
> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>
> We'll be leaving from New York City.
>
> Thank you.

Many thanks to Rog, Iceman, and Calif Bill, for your helpful responses.
I appreciate it very much. And besides, you've all armed me with
ammunition to use vs my wife who is tending heavily towards an organized
tour.

May have more questions.

Thanks again.

On Sun, 29 Jul 2007 13:45:44 -0400, John <[email protected]>
wrote:

>I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
>in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We
>need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
>possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>
>Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
>using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
>all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
>seeing.

I prefer doing it all myself, so that I can see what I want to see,
and spend the time I want to spend. I sometimes take local tours with
an art group in our town, and even though it's only for one day, there
is nearly always something I would have liked to stop to see but can't
because the group is moving on. (I live in Italy.)
>
>Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
>and reasonable costs and congestions.

I think spring is ideal in Italy; I would suggest March or April.
There is a chance of rainy weather, but if you are mostly visiting
cities, it shouldn't put much of a dent in your plans. The countryside
is green at that time of year, and when you do get sun, it's lovely.

>Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.

Between cities, rail is usually the best way to travel. A car would be
a burden once you get to the city. Most cities have good public
transport. Some cities, such as Siena, are best reached by bus, but
most are well connected by rail. You might want to rent a car at some
point to visit the countryside.

>What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?

There are many good books about some part or other of Italy. If you
want a guidebook, I think the DK Eyewitness guide is very good for
helping you plan a trip. It has lots of pictures, so gives an idea of
how things look and helps to decide what you really want to see. It's
not the best guidebook for finding hotels or to have in your hands
while you're travelling, but for the initial stages of planning a
trip, it's very good.

I like to read background books before travelling. When you've
narrowed down your itinerary, let us know where you're going, and
people can suggest background books. If you're going to Florence, I
highly recommend Brunelleschi's Dome, for instance.

>All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.

How long to you expect to stay in Italy?
--
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup

Check out http://www.trenitalia.com/en/index.html for train
schedules and ticket-purchase options. Also browse thru
http://www.slowtrav.com/italy/ for useful information.

Calif-Bill, you used to be able to buy a ticket on board for a
small fee, but from Oct. 2004, if you wait to buy your ticket
on the train, you may be fined. Buy your ticket B4 boarding
(online, at a window or kiosk) and unless its you are reserved
for a specific train (like an ES), you stamp (validate) the ticket
at the train platform.



"John" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> John wrote:
>> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
>> in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We need
>> a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
>> possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>>
>> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
>> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do all
>> the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site seeing.
>>
>> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
>> and reasonable costs and congestions.
>>
>> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
>>
>> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?
>>
>> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.
>>
>> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>>
>> We'll be leaving from New York City.
>>
>> Thank you.
>
> Many thanks to Rog, Iceman, and Calif Bill, for your helpful responses. I
> appreciate it very much. And besides, you've all armed me with ammunition
> to use vs my wife who is tending heavily towards an organized tour.
>
> May have more questions.
>
> Thanks again.

On Sun, 29 Jul 2007 13:45:44 -0400, John <[email protected]>
wrote:

> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
> in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We
> need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
> possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>
> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
> all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
> seeing.


I think it depends on your personality. Personally, I hate tours for a
variety of reasons, and I love to do the planning myself.

Why do I hate tours? In no particular order,

1. They take you where they want to go, not where you want to go.

2. They take you to restaurants that *they* choose, and often restrict
your choices of what to eat.

3. They book you into what are usually decent hotels, but in most
cases those hotels are distant from the more convenient part of town
that I want to stay in.

4. They often take you shopping, which is a waste of time for me.

5. If you are lucky enough to like the people you are traveling with,
great, but the opposite is sometimes true.

6. They usually try to squeeze too many destinations into too short a
time, so you end up with a "If this is Tuesday, it must be Belgium"
type of experience.

There are probably more reasons, but those are the ones that quickly
came to mind.

On the other side of the coin, many tours can save you money. The tour
operators often get good prices on flights and hotels, and if you do
it yourself, you may pay more. On balance, though, I'd rather pay a
little more and get what I want. YMMV.

By the way, in these days when almost everyone has E-mail and web
sites, planning it yourself much easier than it used to be.



> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
> and reasonable costs and congestions.


Spring or fall. If you're going to Sicily, the winter is good too.


> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.


Train, definitely. Cars are a liability, not an asset, in cities.
There's no place to park, traffic is terrible, etc. A car can be
useful if you are traveling in the countryside, staying in small
towns, but not for cities. And for a first trip to Italy, I think you
should concentrate on the major tourist cities. Also trains are cheap,
and cars are expensive.


> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?


There are many. Go to the library and read them all. I'm sure many
people feel otherwise, but the only major one I actively dislike is
Rick Steves's.


> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.


Ask away.

> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>
> We'll be leaving from New York City.



How long will your trip be? Have you chosen which places you want to
visit?

My biggest suggestion: Do not try to visit too many places in too
short a time. You will end up spending more time traveling, checking
in and out of hotels, packing, and unpacking than you will seeing
anything. Less is more. Where to go depends on your personal interests
of course, but for most first-timers, unless you're going for a long
time, I would concentrate on the three major tourist cities: Rome,
Venice, and Florence.

My wife and I have been to Italy nearly 20 times, most recently this
part May. We're going again, in October-November, for three weeks,
visiting Rome, Naples, Sorrento and Capri (all of which we've been to
many times before).

--
Ken Blake
Please Reply to the Newsgroup

John wrote:
> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
> in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We
> need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
> possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>
> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
> all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
> seeing.
>
> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
> and reasonable costs and congestions.
>
> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
>
> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?
>
> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.
>
> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>
> We'll be leaving from New York City.
>
> Thank you.

The rail system in Italy is very good. Consider taking a train from
area to area and rent a car once you get there. If you are in
reasonably good shape, consider renting a bicycle.

Think about visiting some of the smaller towns as opposed to the large
cities. Italy is loaded with small towns and villages that have not
change all that much in 100 years. There will be far fewer tourists in
these quaint towns. If you pick the right town tourists will be so
rare, you may be the talk of the town.

A few important websites:

www.slowtrav.com and it's sister site www.slotalk.com.

A very important site:

www.enit.it this site will list all of the tourist offices in Italy.
Write down the ones in the towns you plan to visit and then go there
first thing.

www.trenitalia.com/en/index.html shows the train schedules.



--
Bruce E. Stemplewski

John wrote:
>And besides, you've all armed me with
>ammunition to use vs my wife who is
>tending heavily towards an organized tour.

Over the years I've had to take a day off while on vacation
occasionally (sprained ankle, foot problem, knee problem, cold, etc).
I've learned now that I'm older it is better 'to nip these problems in
the bud' by sacrificing a day and resting-up, usually with a couple
bottles of wine for medicinal
purposes :-).

On a tour you would either miss that day and that visit to some famous
sites or have too leave that day for the next city.

On your own you can always reschedule your itinerary and even rebook
your other city hotels if need be.

Imagine missing say the Colosseum or the Vatican because of a minor
illness or physical problem that you or your wife has that day.
Or having to get up early and hop on a tour bus for most of the day
when you are just under the weather a bit.
Regards, Walter



..And Paradise Was Lost...like teardrops in the rain...

Rog' wrote:
> Check out http://www.trenitalia.com/en/index.html for train
> schedules and ticket-purchase options. Also browse thru
> http://www.slowtrav.com/italy/ for useful information.
>
> Calif-Bill, you used to be able to buy a ticket on board for a
> small fee, but from Oct. 2004, if you wait to buy your ticket
> on the train, you may be fined. Buy your ticket B4 boarding
> (online, at a window or kiosk) and unless its you are reserved
> for a specific train (like an ES), you stamp (validate) the ticket
> at the train platform.
>
>
>
> "John" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> John wrote:
>>> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
>>> in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We need
>>> a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
>>> possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>>>
>>> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
>>> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do all
>>> the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site seeing.
>>>
>>> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
>>> and reasonable costs and congestions.
>>>
>>> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
>>>
>>> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?
>>>
>>> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.
>>>
>>> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>>>
>>> We'll be leaving from New York City.
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>> Many thanks to Rog, Iceman, and Calif Bill, for your helpful responses. I
>> appreciate it very much. And besides, you've all armed me with ammunition
>> to use vs my wife who is tending heavily towards an organized tour.
>>
>> May have more questions.
>>
>> Thanks again.
>
>

Yes be sure to validate at the machines on the platform. You can be
fined if you are caught on board with a ticket that is not validated.




--
Bruce E. Stemplewski

"Rog'" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> Check out http://www.trenitalia.com/en/index.html for train
> schedules and ticket-purchase options. Also browse thru
> http://www.slowtrav.com/italy/ for useful information.
>
> Calif-Bill, you used to be able to buy a ticket on board for a
> small fee, but from Oct. 2004, if you wait to buy your ticket
> on the train, you may be fined. Buy your ticket B4 boarding
> (online, at a window or kiosk) and unless its you are reserved
> for a specific train (like an ES), you stamp (validate) the ticket
> at the train platform.
>
>
>
> "John" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:[email protected]...
>> John wrote:
>>> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I are
>>> in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy. We
>>> need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost as
>>> possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>>>
>>> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
>>> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
>>> all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
>>> seeing.
>>>
>>> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent weather
>>> and reasonable costs and congestions.
>>>
>>> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
>>>
>>> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?
>>>
>>> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.
>>>
>>> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>>>
>>> We'll be leaving from New York City.
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>
>> Many thanks to Rog, Iceman, and Calif Bill, for your helpful responses. I
>> appreciate it very much. And besides, you've all armed me with ammunition
>> to use vs my wife who is tending heavily towards an organized tour.
>>
>> May have more questions.
>>
>> Thanks again.
>
>

I just said I use trains. I normally buy at the ticket window and not at
the automated kiosks, as seem to get better price at times.

"Bruce Stemplewski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:f39ri.1063$vW.272@trnddc08...
> Rog' wrote:
>> Check out http://www.trenitalia.com/en/index.html for train
>> schedules and ticket-purchase options. Also browse thru
>> http://www.slowtrav.com/italy/ for useful information.
>>
>> Calif-Bill, you used to be able to buy a ticket on board for a
>> small fee, but from Oct. 2004, if you wait to buy your ticket
>> on the train, you may be fined. Buy your ticket B4 boarding
>> (online, at a window or kiosk) and unless its you are reserved
>> for a specific train (like an ES), you stamp (validate) the ticket
>> at the train platform.
>>
>>
>>
>> "John" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>> news:[email protected]...
>>> John wrote:
>>>> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I
>>>> are in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy.
>>>> We need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost
>>>> as possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>>>>
>>>> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
>>>> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
>>>> all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
>>>> seeing.
>>>>
>>>> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent
>>>> weather and reasonable costs and congestions.
>>>>
>>>> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
>>>>
>>>> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?
>>>>
>>>> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.
>>>>
>>>> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>>>>
>>>> We'll be leaving from New York City.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you.
>>> Many thanks to Rog, Iceman, and Calif Bill, for your helpful responses.
>>> I appreciate it very much. And besides, you've all armed me with
>>> ammunition to use vs my wife who is tending heavily towards an organized
>>> tour.
>>>
>>> May have more questions.
>>>
>>> Thanks again.
>>
>>
>
> Yes be sure to validate at the machines on the platform. You can be fined
> if you are caught on board with a ticket that is not validated.
>
>
>
>
> --
> Bruce E. Stemplewski

Or you can plead ignorance as a tourist. The train personnel are very
helpful. In about 1985 we got on the wrong train at Frankfort. Right track
but there were two trains parked at the station. And we were in a hurry.
Explained it to the conductor, and we got off at Giesen (sp?) and they let
us take next train back to Frankfort and on to Heidelberg on the same
ticket.

Calif Bill wrote:
> "Bruce Stemplewski" <[email protected]> wrote in message
> news:f39ri.1063$vW.272@trnddc08...
>> Rog' wrote:
>>> Check out http://www.trenitalia.com/en/index.html for train
>>> schedules and ticket-purchase options. Also browse thru
>>> http://www.slowtrav.com/italy/ for useful information.
>>>
>>> Calif-Bill, you used to be able to buy a ticket on board for a
>>> small fee, but from Oct. 2004, if you wait to buy your ticket
>>> on the train, you may be fined. Buy your ticket B4 boarding
>>> (online, at a window or kiosk) and unless its you are reserved
>>> for a specific train (like an ES), you stamp (validate) the ticket
>>> at the train platform.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "John" <[email protected]> wrote in message
>>> news:[email protected]...
>>>> John wrote:
>>>>> I'm getting ready to retire at the end of the year and my wife and I
>>>>> are in the beginning stages of planning a long-desired trip to Italy.
>>>>> We need a lot of help to try and do it right and at as reasonable cost
>>>>> as possible. Here are some of the things we're wondering about:
>>>>>
>>>>> Tour or no tour. We don't know wether its best to do an organized tour
>>>>> using either Perillo, Tauck, or one of the other tour operators, or do
>>>>> all the planning ourselves, e.g. transportation, cities, hotels, site
>>>>> seeing.
>>>>>
>>>>> Best time of the year to go in terms of a balance between decent
>>>>> weather and reasonable costs and congestions.
>>>>>
>>>>> Transportation between cities. Car rental, vs rail, vs bus.
>>>>>
>>>>> What is a good book that talks about visiting Italy?
>>>>>
>>>>> We have many more questions, but will save them for another time.
>>>>>
>>>>> All comments and recommendations will be appreciated.
>>>>>
>>>>> We'll be leaving from New York City.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thank you.
>>>> Many thanks to Rog, Iceman, and Calif Bill, for your helpful responses.
>>>> I appreciate it very much. And besides, you've all armed me with
>>>> ammunition to use vs my wife who is tending heavily towards an organized
>>>> tour.
>>>>
>>>> May have more questions.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks again.
>>>
>> Yes be sure to validate at the machines on the platform. You can be fined
>> if you are caught on board with a ticket that is not validated.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bruce E. Stemplewski
>
> Or you can plead ignorance as a tourist. The train personnel are very
> helpful. In about 1985 we got on the wrong train at Frankfort. Right track
> but there were two trains parked at the station. And we were in a hurry.
> Explained it to the conductor, and we got off at Giesen (sp?) and they let
> us take next train back to Frankfort and on to Heidelberg on the same
> ticket.
>
>


I understand that in Italy they can be very difficult when it comes to
"the rules".


--
Bruce E. Stemplewski

"Calif Bill" <[email protected]> wrote:
> I just said I use trains. I normally buy at the ticket window and
> not at the automated kiosks, as seem to get better price at times.

That's not exactly what you said. Quoting from your 3:21 EST
post: "We just bought tickets /on the train,/ as I think..."
(emphasis added).