Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
Jul 28th 2004, 4:59 am
#106
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
Tim Challenger extrapolated from data available...
>
> Oh good grief, I opened up a can of worms there, didn't I?
> I haven't the faintest idea. It's all so wonderfully wrapped up in
> history and customs to be almost unfathomable (no pun intended).
>
The courtesy flag (worn on the foremast or yard thereof) for foreign
vessels entering UK ports should be the Union Jack, as only British ships
would legally fly a red, white or blue ensign depending upon their status.
>
> Oh good grief, I opened up a can of worms there, didn't I?
> I haven't the faintest idea. It's all so wonderfully wrapped up in
> history and customs to be almost unfathomable (no pun intended).
>
The courtesy flag (worn on the foremast or yard thereof) for foreign
vessels entering UK ports should be the Union Jack, as only British ships
would legally fly a red, white or blue ensign depending upon their status.
Jul 28th 2004, 9:55 am
#107
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
Following up to Olivers
>The courtesy flag (worn on the foremast or yard thereof) for foreign
>vessels entering UK ports should be the Union Jack, as only British ships
>would legally fly a red, white or blue ensign depending upon their status.
that makes sense to me.
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
>The courtesy flag (worn on the foremast or yard thereof) for foreign
>vessels entering UK ports should be the Union Jack, as only British ships
>would legally fly a red, white or blue ensign depending upon their status.
that makes sense to me.
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
Jul 28th 2004, 12:32 pm
#108
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: French risks? IsalmoFascism is spreading in Western Europe
[email protected] (Bobby Fischler) wrote in message news:<[email protected]. com>...
> Wolfgang Barth <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> > Sam schrieb:
> >
> > > my-nationality-is-better-than-your-nationality crap. Hate to agree
> > > agree with the pope on anything, but he is right in saying that this
> > > nationalism is the greatest evil in the world.
>
> No - expansionst & repressive Islam is. The pope was right in fighting
> communism but he failed to see left wing secularism would fill the
> vacuum and it will be supplanted by Isalmic fascism.
>
> > Say this to Bush and his "neoconservative" godfathers.
>
> Bush and his group know France will be an Islamic Republic in about 25
> years along with Holland, Belgium and Spain. Spain already
> surrendered. Book publishers in the UK refuse to publish books even
> mildly critical of Islamic fascism. Political parties critical of
> IslamoFascism in the UK are essentially being put out of business.
> The UK will fall in 35 years to Islam followed by Germany. Most of
> western European welfare state and the EU will collapse with the
> growth of Islam.
>
> Denmark, Italy, Norway, Austria, Switzerland, Finland and parts of
> Eastern Europe are the only countries who may refuse to submit to
> expansionist Islamic fascism.
>
> Kerry is like the rest of the European left with the "if we are noce
> to the IslamoFascists - they won't kill us."
>
> > Wolfgang
Sweden and Norway LIVE for that stuff:
Come on over mohammed, bring your 3 wives and 14 childen - we'll see
that you get a big house, lots of furniture, free medical care,
education, food, clothing, a little spending money. Anything else?
Oh, sure we'll build that mosque so you have a place to preach you
usual "death to Americans" rhetoric and.. what was that? Oh an
islumic cultural center? Would you like that to be two stories or
three? No, we don't mind if you recruit terrorist here, that is your
right. Passports? Absolutly! do your friends need some too? We love
our moslum population, they make us so diverse and they show the rest
of the world how great we are that we take you in and give you
everything you want".
> Wolfgang Barth <[email protected]> wrote in message news:<[email protected]>...
> > Sam schrieb:
> >
> > > my-nationality-is-better-than-your-nationality crap. Hate to agree
> > > agree with the pope on anything, but he is right in saying that this
> > > nationalism is the greatest evil in the world.
>
> No - expansionst & repressive Islam is. The pope was right in fighting
> communism but he failed to see left wing secularism would fill the
> vacuum and it will be supplanted by Isalmic fascism.
>
> > Say this to Bush and his "neoconservative" godfathers.
>
> Bush and his group know France will be an Islamic Republic in about 25
> years along with Holland, Belgium and Spain. Spain already
> surrendered. Book publishers in the UK refuse to publish books even
> mildly critical of Islamic fascism. Political parties critical of
> IslamoFascism in the UK are essentially being put out of business.
> The UK will fall in 35 years to Islam followed by Germany. Most of
> western European welfare state and the EU will collapse with the
> growth of Islam.
>
> Denmark, Italy, Norway, Austria, Switzerland, Finland and parts of
> Eastern Europe are the only countries who may refuse to submit to
> expansionist Islamic fascism.
>
> Kerry is like the rest of the European left with the "if we are noce
> to the IslamoFascists - they won't kill us."
>
> > Wolfgang
Sweden and Norway LIVE for that stuff:
Come on over mohammed, bring your 3 wives and 14 childen - we'll see
that you get a big house, lots of furniture, free medical care,
education, food, clothing, a little spending money. Anything else?
Oh, sure we'll build that mosque so you have a place to preach you
usual "death to Americans" rhetoric and.. what was that? Oh an
islumic cultural center? Would you like that to be two stories or
three? No, we don't mind if you recruit terrorist here, that is your
right. Passports? Absolutly! do your friends need some too? We love
our moslum population, they make us so diverse and they show the rest
of the world how great we are that we take you in and give you
everything you want".
Jul 29th 2004, 2:30 am
#109
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
The Reids extrapolated from data available...
> Following up to Olivers
>
>>The courtesy flag (worn on the foremast or yard thereof) for foreign
>>vessels entering UK ports should be the Union Jack, as only British
>>ships would legally fly a red, white or blue ensign depending upon
>>their status.
>
> that makes sense to me.
In fact, the origin of the practice dates back to the late 18th century and
an ongoing state of maritime conflict between France and the UK. A foreign
flagged ship inbound for a British port would hoist a British flag (at some
place other than where her colors were flown) to signify her destination,
and to relieve the suspicions of RN vessels maintaining a blockade of
French ports. Certainly, entering the Channel under sail from the
Atlantic, a ship provides no clear evidence of her next port of call, and
even after weathering Ushant still has a number of choices.
The growth of US maritime commerce, substantial income and an undeclared
war (with France) followed later by a formally decalred one (with the UK)
resulted to a great extent from the US insistence that it ought to be able
to trade in both French and British ports no matter the relations between
those two obstinate countries.
TMO
> Following up to Olivers
>
>>The courtesy flag (worn on the foremast or yard thereof) for foreign
>>vessels entering UK ports should be the Union Jack, as only British
>>ships would legally fly a red, white or blue ensign depending upon
>>their status.
>
> that makes sense to me.
In fact, the origin of the practice dates back to the late 18th century and
an ongoing state of maritime conflict between France and the UK. A foreign
flagged ship inbound for a British port would hoist a British flag (at some
place other than where her colors were flown) to signify her destination,
and to relieve the suspicions of RN vessels maintaining a blockade of
French ports. Certainly, entering the Channel under sail from the
Atlantic, a ship provides no clear evidence of her next port of call, and
even after weathering Ushant still has a number of choices.
The growth of US maritime commerce, substantial income and an undeclared
war (with France) followed later by a formally decalred one (with the UK)
resulted to a great extent from the US insistence that it ought to be able
to trade in both French and British ports no matter the relations between
those two obstinate countries.
TMO
Jul 29th 2004, 6:58 am
#110
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
Tim K
"Tim Challenger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Wed, 28 Jul 2004 15:14:40 +0100, The Reids wrote:
> > Following up to Tim Challenger
> >
> >> Most Brits
> >>down know which way up it should be anyway.
> >
> > including me.
> The diagonal white stripes closest to the flagpole are wider above the
> diagonal red line than below. Similarly those away from the flagpole
are
> wider below the red diagonals.
> see : http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/gb-hist.html
> I wasn't aware that the Union Flag (aka the Union Jack) is in fact a
royal
> flag and used with HM's permission and was never officially adopted by
law
> as the national flag. Also it is illegal for a civilian ship to fly
it.
> Loads of useful/less information on the above site.
> --
> Tim C.
own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
Tim K
"Tim Challenger" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> On Wed, 28 Jul 2004 15:14:40 +0100, The Reids wrote:
> > Following up to Tim Challenger
> >
> >> Most Brits
> >>down know which way up it should be anyway.
> >
> > including me.
> The diagonal white stripes closest to the flagpole are wider above the
> diagonal red line than below. Similarly those away from the flagpole
are
> wider below the red diagonals.
> see : http://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/gb-hist.html
> I wasn't aware that the Union Flag (aka the Union Jack) is in fact a
royal
> flag and used with HM's permission and was never officially adopted by
law
> as the national flag. Also it is illegal for a civilian ship to fly
it.
> Loads of useful/less information on the above site.
> --
> Tim C.
Jul 29th 2004, 8:36 pm
#111
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
On Thu, 29 Jul 2004 18:58:05 GMT, Tim Kroesen wrote:
> Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
'Flag waving', like 'blowing your own trumpet' has for a long time been
seen as crass. "I don't need a flag to be proud of my country", sort of
think.
Also the effective hijacking of the Union Flag by skinheads and right-wing
extremists have made it a sign of racicsm and nationalism, and therefore
has become "not the done thing". I believe it's not quite so bad now, as
the flag seems to be being reclaimed by the common man. However the Brits
only really flag wave on special occasions. The popular use of the US flag
to constantly bolster up the pride of Americans is seen by many (not just
Brits, national flag waving is fairly uncommon in the rest of Europe too,
on the whole) as just that. A nation of people who constantly need
reassuring that they are so wonderful.
The private displaying of a national flag is just sad. Similarly owning
one. I once stuck a union flag sticker on my car, when I lived in Germany,
and looking back I'm quite embarrassed about it.
--
Tim C.
> Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
'Flag waving', like 'blowing your own trumpet' has for a long time been
seen as crass. "I don't need a flag to be proud of my country", sort of
think.
Also the effective hijacking of the Union Flag by skinheads and right-wing
extremists have made it a sign of racicsm and nationalism, and therefore
has become "not the done thing". I believe it's not quite so bad now, as
the flag seems to be being reclaimed by the common man. However the Brits
only really flag wave on special occasions. The popular use of the US flag
to constantly bolster up the pride of Americans is seen by many (not just
Brits, national flag waving is fairly uncommon in the rest of Europe too,
on the whole) as just that. A nation of people who constantly need
reassuring that they are so wonderful.
The private displaying of a national flag is just sad. Similarly owning
one. I once stuck a union flag sticker on my car, when I lived in Germany,
and looking back I'm quite embarrassed about it.
--
Tim C.
Jul 29th 2004, 9:00 pm
#112
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
Following up to Olivers
>In fact, the origin of the practice dates back to the late 18th century and
>an ongoing state of maritime conflict between France and the UK. A foreign
>flagged ship inbound for a British port would hoist a British flag (at some
>place other than where her colors were flown) to signify her destination,
>and to relieve the suspicions of RN vessels maintaining a blockade of
>French ports. Certainly, entering the Channel under sail from the
>Atlantic, a ship provides no clear evidence of her next port of call, and
>even after weathering Ushant still has a number of choices.
Funnily enough, I was by the Thames yesterday, in the "Prospect
of Whitby" and a French registered boat was sailing past towards
the Tower of London, flying only a tricolour at the stern. I
considered contacting the river police next door to request a
salvo from the Belfast to teach them some manners, but thought
better of it as I was in danger of having my pint diluted by any
straddling fire.
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
>In fact, the origin of the practice dates back to the late 18th century and
>an ongoing state of maritime conflict between France and the UK. A foreign
>flagged ship inbound for a British port would hoist a British flag (at some
>place other than where her colors were flown) to signify her destination,
>and to relieve the suspicions of RN vessels maintaining a blockade of
>French ports. Certainly, entering the Channel under sail from the
>Atlantic, a ship provides no clear evidence of her next port of call, and
>even after weathering Ushant still has a number of choices.
Funnily enough, I was by the Thames yesterday, in the "Prospect
of Whitby" and a French registered boat was sailing past towards
the Tower of London, flying only a tricolour at the stern. I
considered contacting the river police next door to request a
salvo from the Belfast to teach them some manners, but thought
better of it as I was in danger of having my pint diluted by any
straddling fire.
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
Jul 29th 2004, 10:19 pm
#113
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
Following up to Tim Kroesen
>Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
>own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
>privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
Correct.
Personally I regard pride in country as rather suspect,
preferring objectivity.
Flying a flag would be regarded as risible at best by many
although nowadays some do have a Scottish or Welsh sticker on
their car and recently english too, although a lot of this is a
two finger salute to either the EU or the BNP (see below).
"Proud Americans" flying flags and saying "God bless America" are
regarded as suspectly nationalistic and boastful, we have a
saying about "not blowing your own trumpet" and I think that is
the core reason for not flag flying.
I think there is much more awareness here of the slippery slope
of patriotism, nationalism and zenophobia but at the same time
there is the contradiction that there is no particular shortage
of the latter here.
Anyone flying an english national flag outside a private house
would be assumed to be a right wing nationalist loony and
probably a racist thug too (BNP) (although there have been
efforts recently to "reclaim the flag" from these nutters so
there are a few more flags around).
The only time you really see many flags is when a big
international football match is on.
Perhaps being an island we don't often forget which country we
are in and need reminding by the flying of flags. :-)
(Joke, thanks to JU)
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
>Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
>own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
>privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
Correct.
Personally I regard pride in country as rather suspect,
preferring objectivity.
Flying a flag would be regarded as risible at best by many
although nowadays some do have a Scottish or Welsh sticker on
their car and recently english too, although a lot of this is a
two finger salute to either the EU or the BNP (see below).
"Proud Americans" flying flags and saying "God bless America" are
regarded as suspectly nationalistic and boastful, we have a
saying about "not blowing your own trumpet" and I think that is
the core reason for not flag flying.
I think there is much more awareness here of the slippery slope
of patriotism, nationalism and zenophobia but at the same time
there is the contradiction that there is no particular shortage
of the latter here.
Anyone flying an english national flag outside a private house
would be assumed to be a right wing nationalist loony and
probably a racist thug too (BNP) (although there have been
efforts recently to "reclaim the flag" from these nutters so
there are a few more flags around).
The only time you really see many flags is when a big
international football match is on.
Perhaps being an island we don't often forget which country we
are in and need reminding by the flying of flags. :-)
(Joke, thanks to JU)
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
Jul 29th 2004, 11:01 pm
#114
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
In article <[email protected]>, The Reids
<[email protected]> wrote:
> Following up to Tim Kroesen
>
> >Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> >own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> >privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
>
> Correct.
> Personally I regard pride in country as rather suspect,
> preferring objectivity.
> Flying a flag would be regarded as risible at best by many
> although nowadays some do have a Scottish or Welsh sticker on
> their car and recently english too, although a lot of this is a
> two finger salute to either the EU or the BNP (see below).
>
> "Proud Americans" flying flags and saying "God bless America" are
> regarded as suspectly nationalistic and boastful, we have a
> saying about "not blowing your own trumpet" and I think that is
> the core reason for not flag flying.
>
> I think there is much more awareness here of the slippery slope
> of patriotism, nationalism and zenophobia but at the same time
> there is the contradiction that there is no particular shortage
> of the latter here.
>
> Anyone flying an english national flag outside a private house
> would be assumed to be a right wing nationalist loony and
> probably a racist thug too (BNP) (although there have been
> efforts recently to "reclaim the flag" from these nutters so
> there are a few more flags around).
> The only time you really see many flags is when a big
> international football match is on.
> Perhaps being an island we don't often forget which country we
> are in and need reminding by the flying of flags. :-)
Perhaps Brits have run that flag up on so much foreign soil, that many
are embarrassed of its legacy....
jay
Fri Jul 30, 2004
mailto:[email protected]
> (Joke, thanks to JU)
<[email protected]> wrote:
> Following up to Tim Kroesen
>
> >Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> >own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> >privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
>
> Correct.
> Personally I regard pride in country as rather suspect,
> preferring objectivity.
> Flying a flag would be regarded as risible at best by many
> although nowadays some do have a Scottish or Welsh sticker on
> their car and recently english too, although a lot of this is a
> two finger salute to either the EU or the BNP (see below).
>
> "Proud Americans" flying flags and saying "God bless America" are
> regarded as suspectly nationalistic and boastful, we have a
> saying about "not blowing your own trumpet" and I think that is
> the core reason for not flag flying.
>
> I think there is much more awareness here of the slippery slope
> of patriotism, nationalism and zenophobia but at the same time
> there is the contradiction that there is no particular shortage
> of the latter here.
>
> Anyone flying an english national flag outside a private house
> would be assumed to be a right wing nationalist loony and
> probably a racist thug too (BNP) (although there have been
> efforts recently to "reclaim the flag" from these nutters so
> there are a few more flags around).
> The only time you really see many flags is when a big
> international football match is on.
> Perhaps being an island we don't often forget which country we
> are in and need reminding by the flying of flags. :-)
Perhaps Brits have run that flag up on so much foreign soil, that many
are embarrassed of its legacy....
jay
Fri Jul 30, 2004
mailto:[email protected]
> (Joke, thanks to JU)
Jul 29th 2004, 11:18 pm
#115
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
Following up to Go Fig
>> Perhaps being an island we don't often forget which country we
>> are in and need reminding by the flying of flags. :-)
>Perhaps Brits have run that flag up on so much foreign soil, that many
>are embarrassed of its legacy....
If you mean that we have a mature attitude to nationalism, then
yes.
(Perhaps if US had actually run up its flag in the south american
countries it has interfered in it wouldn't be so proud of the
flag).
If you mean are we embarrassed by Australia, New Zealand, Canada,
, India etc. then no.
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
>> Perhaps being an island we don't often forget which country we
>> are in and need reminding by the flying of flags. :-)
>Perhaps Brits have run that flag up on so much foreign soil, that many
>are embarrassed of its legacy....
If you mean that we have a mature attitude to nationalism, then
yes.
(Perhaps if US had actually run up its flag in the south american
countries it has interfered in it wouldn't be so proud of the
flag).
If you mean are we embarrassed by Australia, New Zealand, Canada,
, India etc. then no.
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
Jul 29th 2004, 11:20 pm
#116
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in
In article <[email protected] et>,
[email protected] (Tim Kroesen) wrote:
> Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
Yes, private flag ownership is quite uncommon. (I don't think I know
anyone who has one.) Others in the thread have suggested why this may be
so...
[email protected] (Tim Kroesen) wrote:
> Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
Yes, private flag ownership is quite uncommon. (I don't think I know
anyone who has one.) Others in the thread have suggested why this may be
so...
Jul 30th 2004, 12:42 am
#117
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in
Following up to a.spencer3
>(I do have a Welsh, English and union flag for appropriate sports use!).
You sometimes support Wales and sometimes England?
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
>(I do have a Welsh, English and union flag for appropriate sports use!).
You sometimes support Wales and sometimes England?
--
Mike Reid
If god wanted us to be vegetarians he wouldn't have made animals out of meat.
Wasdale-Lake district-Thames path-London "http://www.fellwalk.co.uk" <-- you can email us@ this site
Eat-walk-Spain "http://www.fell-walker.co.uk" <-- dontuse@ all, it's a spamtrap
Jul 30th 2004, 1:05 am
#118
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
"Go Fig" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:300720040401162399%[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, The Reids
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Following up to Tim Kroesen
> >
> > >Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> > >own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> > >privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
> >
> > Correct.
> > Personally I regard pride in country as rather suspect,
> > preferring objectivity.
> > Flying a flag would be regarded as risible at best by many
> > although nowadays some do have a Scottish or Welsh sticker on
> > their car and recently english too, although a lot of this is a
> > two finger salute to either the EU or the BNP (see below).
> >
> > "Proud Americans" flying flags and saying "God bless America" are
> > regarded as suspectly nationalistic and boastful, we have a
> > saying about "not blowing your own trumpet" and I think that is
> > the core reason for not flag flying.
> >
> > I think there is much more awareness here of the slippery slope
> > of patriotism, nationalism and zenophobia but at the same time
> > there is the contradiction that there is no particular shortage
> > of the latter here.
> >
> > Anyone flying an english national flag outside a private house
> > would be assumed to be a right wing nationalist loony and
> > probably a racist thug too (BNP) (although there have been
> > efforts recently to "reclaim the flag" from these nutters so
> > there are a few more flags around).
> > The only time you really see many flags is when a big
> > international football match is on.
> > Perhaps being an island we don't often forget which country we
> > are in and need reminding by the flying of flags. :-)
> Perhaps Brits have run that flag up on so much foreign soil, that many
> are embarrassed of its legacy....
Which is why so many of those terribly downtrodden countries still
voluntarily include the union flag within their own?
Ask Hawaii.
Surreyman
news:300720040401162399%[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected]>, The Reids
> <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Following up to Tim Kroesen
> >
> > >Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> > >own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> > >privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
> >
> > Correct.
> > Personally I regard pride in country as rather suspect,
> > preferring objectivity.
> > Flying a flag would be regarded as risible at best by many
> > although nowadays some do have a Scottish or Welsh sticker on
> > their car and recently english too, although a lot of this is a
> > two finger salute to either the EU or the BNP (see below).
> >
> > "Proud Americans" flying flags and saying "God bless America" are
> > regarded as suspectly nationalistic and boastful, we have a
> > saying about "not blowing your own trumpet" and I think that is
> > the core reason for not flag flying.
> >
> > I think there is much more awareness here of the slippery slope
> > of patriotism, nationalism and zenophobia but at the same time
> > there is the contradiction that there is no particular shortage
> > of the latter here.
> >
> > Anyone flying an english national flag outside a private house
> > would be assumed to be a right wing nationalist loony and
> > probably a racist thug too (BNP) (although there have been
> > efforts recently to "reclaim the flag" from these nutters so
> > there are a few more flags around).
> > The only time you really see many flags is when a big
> > international football match is on.
> > Perhaps being an island we don't often forget which country we
> > are in and need reminding by the flying of flags. :-)
> Perhaps Brits have run that flag up on so much foreign soil, that many
> are embarrassed of its legacy....
Which is why so many of those terribly downtrodden countries still
voluntarily include the union flag within their own?
Ask Hawaii.
Surreyman
Jul 30th 2004, 1:11 am
#119
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in
<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected] et>,
> [email protected] (Tim Kroesen) wrote:
> > Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> > own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> > privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
> Yes, private flag ownership is quite uncommon. (I don't think I know
> anyone who has one.) Others in the thread have suggested why this may be
> so...
And as to expecting us to wear union flag lapel badges!!!!! ..............
(I do have a Welsh, English and union flag for appropriate sports use!).
Surreyman
news:[email protected]...
> In article <[email protected] et>,
> [email protected] (Tim Kroesen) wrote:
> > Makes me wonder; how many Brits have enough regard and pride in their
> > own country to actually own a national flag, let alone display it
> > privately... Seems *much* more rare than in the USA, correct?
> Yes, private flag ownership is quite uncommon. (I don't think I know
> anyone who has one.) Others in the thread have suggested why this may be
> so...
And as to expecting us to wear union flag lapel badges!!!!! ..............
(I do have a Welsh, English and union flag for appropriate sports use!).
Surreyman
Jul 30th 2004, 1:28 am
#120
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Lance Armstrong essentially says Americans are at risk while traveling in France
The Reids <[email protected]> wrote:
>Following up to Go Fig
>>Perhaps Brits have run that flag up on so much foreign soil, that many
>>are embarrassed of its legacy....
>If you mean that we have a mature attitude to nationalism, then
>yes.
>(Perhaps if US had actually run up its flag in the south american
>countries it has interfered in it wouldn't be so proud of the
>flag).
>If you mean are we embarrassed by Australia, New Zealand, Canada,
>, India etc. then no.
Hmm. Are you embarrassed by Ireland?
--
PB
The return address has been MUNGED
>Following up to Go Fig
>>Perhaps Brits have run that flag up on so much foreign soil, that many
>>are embarrassed of its legacy....
>If you mean that we have a mature attitude to nationalism, then
>yes.
>(Perhaps if US had actually run up its flag in the south american
>countries it has interfered in it wouldn't be so proud of the
>flag).
>If you mean are we embarrassed by Australia, New Zealand, Canada,
>, India etc. then no.
Hmm. Are you embarrassed by Ireland?
--
PB
The return address has been MUNGED
