Following up to

    > is 3 antipasti followed by three deserts (it's ok to reverse
    >the order, btw).

!!!!
--
Mike Reid
Spanish regional cooking at
"http://www.fell-walker.co.uk/espania.htm"

Following up to John Stolz

    >Aside from the other good advice already posted, bear in mind that in
    >italian restaurants, main or meat/fish dishes will notmally be unaccompanied
    >by vegetable accompaniments. Thus if you order a steak, you'll get a
    >steak - almost always without fries or veg. In Italy, people tend to take
    >thier carbohydrate in the form of pasta, before the main course.

you can select a veg from the contorni section

Judith! See i'm a usenet "expert" now! Just one spaghetto, give it to
me, opps sorry.
--
Mike Reid
Spanish regional cooking at
"http://www.fell-walker.co.uk/espania.htm"

    > "Too much milk"???? How much milk can one cappuchino contain? No
    > more than half that tiny cup, surely! ...But then I always drink my

More, actually. A cappuccino (without the "h") is a espresso shot topped up
with frothed milk. Usually at a rate of 1:2.

Some recipes I saw suggested 1/3 espresso, 1/3 milk, 1/3 froth. However, I
have found that it's better just to froth all the milk. That's also the way
I saw it done it Italy and the Italian bar we've got here in my city.

The thing about the milk is that it is actually supposed to hamper
digestion after a heavy meal, instead of helping it like a pure espresso
would.

R

John Stolz a écrit :

    > Aside from the other good advice already posted, bear in mind that in
    > italian restaurants, main or meat/fish dishes will notmally be unaccompanied
    > by vegetable accompaniments. Thus if you order a steak, you'll get a
    > steak - almost always without fries or veg. In Italy, people tend to take
    > thier carbohydrate in the form of pasta, before the main course.

What you describe has nothing to do with eating carbohydrates before, and
everything to do with the fact that in Italy the side dish is supposed to be
ordered apart, and you can choose whichever side dish you want with whichever
main dish.

Nathalie in Switzerland

"Miss L.Toe" a écrit :

    > Starting a new thread from something I saw buried in 'Americans travelling
    > to France'.
    > What is the normal/acceptable way to pick from a menu in an Italian
    > Restaurant in Italy.

In Rome (but I *think* only there, at least that's the only place I saw it done
and I've traveled pretty extensively in Italy), you're not supposed to order
everything except dessert at the beginning. If you do that, you'll find that the
main dish comes when you're not finished with the appetizer, mostly. What you're
supposed to do is to order a dish - appetizer for instance - eat it, then order
another, etc. At first it seems weird, but once you're accustomed to it it's
actually much nicer than the usual way, because you can order according to your
remaining hunger.

Nathalie in Switzerland

Following up to Nathalie Chiva

    >What you describe has nothing to do with eating carbohydrates before, and
    >everything to do with the fact that in Italy the side dish is supposed to be
    >ordered apart, and you can choose whichever side dish you want with whichever
    >main dish.

as I understand it the thinking is that you get rid of your hunger
with the pasta and then enjoy the quality of your piece of fish/meat
w.h.y. without having to think of hunger.


I remember the Reginald Perrin episode in which he orders

Spaghetti Bolognese for antipasta
Spaghetti Bolognese for pasta
Spaghetti Bolognese for main course
dessert, you guess.

When the waiter queries he says "I like spaghetti bolognese!"
--
Mike Reid
Spanish regional cooking at
"http://www.fell-walker.co.uk/espania.htm"

"Ralph" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > > "Too much milk"???? How much milk can one cappuchino contain? No
    > > more than half that tiny cup, surely! ...But then I always drink my
    > More, actually. A cappuccino (without the "h") is a espresso shot topped
up
    > with frothed milk. Usually at a rate of 1:2.
    > Some recipes I saw suggested 1/3 espresso, 1/3 milk, 1/3 froth. However, I
    > have found that it's better just to froth all the milk. That's also the
way
    > I saw it done it Italy and the Italian bar we've got here in my city.

All the nilk is frothed btw. After pouring it in the cup, the result is 1/3,
1/3, 1/3.

And eating is a personal thing. Order what you want but keep in mind that
just some salad and desert combined with water is a loss for the restaurant
when all tables are taken.

Ronald www.netspresso.com
www.mulazzo.nl



    > The thing about the milk is that it is actually supposed to hamper
    > digestion after a heavy meal, instead of helping it like a pure espresso
    > would.
    > R


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"R@L" wrote
    | And eating is a personal thing. Order what you want but keep in
    | mind that just some salad and desert combined with water is a
    | loss for the restaurant when all tables are taken.

Salads, desserts etc are where the restaurant probably makes more profit
than on expensive meat dishes. So, provided you don't linger toooooooo long
it should balance out.

I can remember a couple sitting next to me in Pizzaland (okay, only very
loosely related to Italian eating habits!) sharing one microscopic pizza
between them. I almost gave them one of my Pizza-for-a-penny vouchers out of
pity.

Owain

"The Reid" wrote
    | I remember the Reginald Perrin episode in which he orders
    | Spaghetti Bolognese for antipasta
    | Spaghetti Bolognese for pasta
    | Spaghetti Bolognese for main course
    | dessert, you guess.
    | When the waiter queries he says "I like spaghetti bolognese!"

Wrote the following a couple of years ago, entitled "Pasta and Cheese":

Ah well, must stop listening to Rondo Veneziano thumping away in the
background and go and make dinner. I think I shall have ... pasta? or maybe
pasta? Or for a change, a nice bowl of pasta? I could do as I had last night
and have a plate of pasta, or as Sunday's dinner was quite nice, maybe have
that again. I think that might have been some pasta, actually, which is
quite handy as I've got some pasta left.

Sadly possibly not *enough* pasta so will have to have something *and*
pasta. Maybe some cheese? That's quite a nice combination, pasta and cheese.
Grated or sliced or diced, stirred in or sprinkled on the top, grilled into
meltingness or not grilled. It's so versatile, pasta and cheese, just so
many ways you can cook it. On its own, or with a sprinking of mixed herbs
for that authentic Italian taste. Served on a round plate, or an oval one
for chic modernity. Or eaten from the saucepan in a fit of laddish
informality.

That's me hungry now! So better go and find out that I have run out of
pasta, the cheese is mouldy and the cupboard is bare. Then I can go to Itos
and spend my last £1.75 on black pudding supper and indigestion.

Owain

© 2001 All rights reserved.

On Thu, 10 Apr 2003 15:51:21 +0100, "Miss L.Toe" wrote:

    >Starting a new thread from something I saw buried in 'Americans travelling
    >to France'.
    >What is the normal/acceptable way to pick from a menu in an Italian
    >Restaurant in Italy.
    >If, for example, you order the same starter for two people it sometimes
    >arrives as one larger portion on one plate.
    >Is it normal/acceptable to order one pizza and share it between two people ?
    >Do they expect you to always order a meat/chicken dish ?
    >Are you 'expected' to have starter, pasta, pizza, meat, coffee and dessert.
    >I always just pick what I fancy from the menu but often wonder if I'm
    >getting strange comments about my eating habits behind my back. Any comments
    >appreciated.

Many traditional Italian restaurants charge "pane e coperto" when you sit down.
You have paid to occupy the table, so they aren't so antsy about how much food
you order. I applaud the practice.

If you order a starter, a primo, a secondo, a vegetable, and a dessert, you may
find (as I have) that you have ordered enough food for two meals. I generally
omit one of the courses, or share with my wife.

For dessert, may I suggest a "vino santo" and biscotti, which you dunk in the
wine.
--
"If this is coffee, please bring me some tea. If this is tea, please bring me some coffee."
- Abraham Lincoln

Mason Barge wrote:

    > For dessert, may I suggest a "vino santo" and biscotti, which you dunk in
    > the wine.

The biscotti should be Prato almond cookies (cantuccini or mattonelle).
Don't bother asking for vin santo outside of Tuscany.


--
Luca Logi - Firenze - Italy e-mail: [email protected]

EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) wrote:

    > "Too much milk"???? How much milk can one cappuchino contain? No more
    > than half that tiny cup, surely! ...But then I always drink my coffee
    > "Boston" style at home, so am accustomed to drinking it with milk ("half
    > and half", actually).


I am sorry to confirm that Italian eating etiquette doesn't consider a
cappuccino as a proper ending to a meal (nothing against substituting
the *whole* meal with a cappuccino). Don't bother why: it's so.


--
Luca Logi - Firenze - Italy e-mail: [email protected]

    >What is the normal/acceptable way to pick from a menu in an Italian
    >Restaurant in Italy.

Hi from Italy. You can order whatever you need and want. Do you
really care of comments?
Anyway, it's strange seeing ppl sharing a pizza only because half
pizza makes you hungry! Our pizzas are not sooo thick as american
one are (i've been told). The only ppl who share pizzas are kids.
In case you want to share it, you can ask for an empty dish with
a wide smile and say "dieta" (diet). :-D


    >If, for example, you order the same starter for two people it sometimes
    >arrives as one larger portion on one plate.
It depends on the restaurant. Usually not.


    >Are you 'expected' to have starter, pasta, pizza, meat, coffee and dessert.
No. You are expected to order whatever you want!
We always end with coffee, and often the coffee has some grappa
into it! hehe.

ciao! Lolli

Ralph wrote:
    >
    > > "Too much milk"???? How much milk can one cappuchino contain? No
    > > more than half that tiny cup, surely! ...But then I always drink my
    >
    > More, actually. A cappuccino (without the "h")

Yes, I know! (My fingers tend to dyslexia.)

    > The thing about the milk is that it is actually supposed to hamper
    > digestion after a heavy meal, instead of helping it like a pure espresso
    > would.

But I've always found coffee with cream an aid to digestion, whereas the
plain black stuff gives me heartburn! ...Which raises a point I've
often wondered about. In my family, we always looked upon milk
(especially warm milk) as a remedy for mild indigestion. When I was a
child, I often developed headaches when on picnics or summer outings
where the children were served lemonade or soft drinks with their meal,
instead of milk. Once my mother started bringing a thermos of milk for
me to drink on such occasions, the headaches ceased. (Purely annecdotal
evidence, of course, but suggestive.)

I had never even HEARD of anyone being allergic to milk until I was
grown, and moved to a part of the U. S. that was not so heavily
populated by people of Northern European ancestry. Have there ever been
any studies of milk allergy vis a vis national origins of the sufferers'
ancestors? What is the incidence of such allergies, world-wide? Is
there as frequent lactose intollerance among Scandinavians and Germans
(where milk is a regular part of the diet) as there is, say, in the
Middle East, where milk is mostly reserved for infants, and few adults
drink it? Might there be a herditary factor that is bred in (or out of)
people, depending upon where in the world they live? (I'm not looking
for a flame war - it's not a matter of one being "better" than another -
but are there genetic differences attributable to regional diet over
many generations?)

(Might be interesting to find out.)

Luca Logi wrote:
    >
    > EvelynVogtGamble(Divamanque) wrote:
    >
    > > "Too much milk"???? How much milk can one cappuchino contain? No more
    > > than half that tiny cup, surely! ...But then I always drink my coffee
    > > "Boston" style at home, so am accustomed to drinking it with milk ("half
    > > and half", actually).
    >
    > I am sorry to confirm that Italian eating etiquette doesn't consider a
    > cappuccino as a proper ending to a meal (nothing against substituting
    > the *whole* meal with a cappuccino). Don't bother why: it's so.


But if I ordered one, they'd serve it to me, non e vero? (I don't speak
enough Italian to be bothered by any waiters' comments on "that crazy
old American lady"!)
    >
    > --
    > Luca Logi - Firenze - Italy e-mail: [email protected]