nitram

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 22:07:02 +0200, [email protected] (Luca Logi) wrote:

    >B Vaughan <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> If you leave Paris on Monday and arrive in some town in
    >> Switzerland in the late afternoon, and then find your hotel, unpack,
    >> and have some dinner, you'll see very little of Switzerland before you
    >> have to repack, check out of your hotel, go back to the train station
    >> and continue your journey to Rome.
    >He'll see no Switzerland at all, considering that the country shuts up
    >at 6.30pm :-)

LOL

Padraig Breathnach

[email protected] (Luca Logi) wrote:

    >Dolomites in November?

Do they take them down and put them away for the winter?

--
PB
The return address has been MUNGED

Luca Logi

Padraig Breathnach <[email protected]> wrote:

    > >Dolomites in November?
    >
    > Do they take them down and put them away for the winter?

little snow for skying
too cold and rainy for walking around
short days
probably the worst month in the whole year to be there

--
Luca Logi - Firenze - Italy e-mail: [email protected]
Home page: http://www.angelfire.com/ar/archivarius
(musicologia pratica)

JohnT

"Luca Logi" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:1gk881x.139fk2vl5f4a4N%[email protected]...
    >B Vaughan <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> If you leave Paris on Monday and arrive in some town in
    >> Switzerland in the late afternoon, and then find your hotel, unpack,
    >> and have some dinner, you'll see very little of Switzerland before you
    >> have to repack, check out of your hotel, go back to the train station
    >> and continue your journey to Rome.
    > He'll see no Switzerland at all, considering that the country shuts up
    > at 6.30pm :-)
.......Not true. I managed to get a drink in Wengen in July at 10 pm. Admittedly
the Bar didn't open for the evening until 5:30 pm.

JohnT

John Owens

You have had lots of good advice.

I'd be inclined to include a chill time within it, perhaps a long indulgent
train journey ? (Would that be the way to do the scenery bits ?).

None of us can know what your preferences are but as sample of 'europe'
then I would do Barcelona rather than Paris - though it notches up less
brownie points ! It is more likely to suit your budget as well.

As for vegetarianism. I eat fish and dairy food but no meat. That is one
definition of veggie that works within eu. Caution . Germany often loads
ham into fish dishes and others. Learn the phrase for NO MEAT in every
place you visit.
A deeper problem is no fish, and yes there are large parts of EU that will
feed you cheese and eggs till the cows come home. However you are less
troubled with fish added in without you knowing !

In every city there are veggie/organic places where you can top up the diet
with some bean /nut related stuff.

Your accommodation budget is a bit lean. OK you are off season, but (no
insult intended) you are also American and so will probably not like many
eu 1 star places ! Thank your stars you are not including Britain.


Post your itinerary VS..2 and then there will be some people who will
volunteer more detail, inc. hotels.



Good luck.

--
John Owens


Fax 44 1509 89 08 22
www.GoodViews.co.uk


"What Ever" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected] m...
    > [email protected] (What Ever) wrote in message
news:<[email protected] om>...
    > > My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    > > between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    > >
    > > Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
    > > in site seeing.
    > >
    > > 1. Paris: I am assuming one night and two days would be sufficient. We
    > > are interested in visiting Eiffel Tower, Louvre, and Seine. I am not
    > > sure what else we can see in 2 days.
    > >
    > > 2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    > > visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    > > to stay for 1 night and 2 days.
    > >
    > > 3. Italy: We like to visit Rome, Vatican City, Venice. I am assuming 4
    > > days and 4 nights would be sufficient.
    > >
    > > Here are the things that I need help with. I greatly appreciate your
    > > feedback.
    > >
    > > 1. Travel: Is there a travel agent that you could recommend to get a
    > > better trans Atlantic flight rates. We will be leaving from
    > > Baltimore/Washington D.C. area and would like to reach Paris, and then
    > > probably return from one of the Italian cities.
    > >
    > > 2. Travel from one country to another within Europe (and from one city
    > > to another): Is it advisable to purchase rail tickets instead of rail
    > > passes? Where can I find information on how long it takes and how much
    > > it costs?
    > >
    > > 3. Itinerary feasibility: Do you think this itinerary is feasible? Or
    > > should I make any changes? I have a total of 10 days including
    > > trans-Atlantic flying time.
    > >
    > > 4. Places to stay: Do you have any recommendations on where we could
    > > stay. We are planning to spend around $100/night.
    > >
    > > 5. Recommendations on "places to Visit": We are first time travelers,
    > > we believe we like scenic mountains in Switzerland, Lakes in Italy,
    > > over-all architectural beauty of Europe, and everything about Paris.
    > > Are there any particular recommendations you would like to make?
    > >
    > > 6. Food: Both my wife and I are vegetarians; we hope finding
    > > vegetarian food wouldn't be a problem. Milk products are okay.
    > >
    > > 7. Language: We both speak English, do we need to learn native
    > > language of the country or can we manage with English?
    > >
    > > Anything else that I am missing?
    > >
    > > Thanks a lot in advance.
    > >
    > > SP.
    > Thanks a lot to everyone. I'll reconsider my approach, and probably
    > come up with more questions later on. I agree with the stuff you have
    > all said.
    > I need to do some brainstorming this weekend.
    > Thanks again.
    > SP.

Dan Stephenson

Mr. Ever - as I'm sure other people will tell you, you're squeezing far
too much in. With you time available, I'd pick at most two places.
I'd even stay a whole week in Paris or especially Rome. Since this is
your first time to Europe, you might even consider a week in London
since they theoretically speak English over there. In summary I highly
recommend Rick Steves' _Europe Through the Back Door_ - it is a travel
skills book will help you a LOT in planning you time and factoring in
transportation. Actually, I think he web site ricksteves.com probably
has good stuff too.

    > 7. Language: We both speak English, do we need to learn native
    > language of the country or can we manage with English?

It helps to have some smattering of foreign language experience so you
can get the gist of menus, signs, etc. Otherwise, ask your hotel
people how to say the following in the native tongue and you'll be OK:

Yes
No
Please
Thank you
Where is ... ?

    > SP.

--
Dan Stephenson
Photos and movies from US Parks and all over Europe:
http://homepage.mac.com/stepheda

Martin Rich

On 15 Sep 2004 08:09:45 -0700, [email protected] (What Ever)
wrote:

    >My wife and I are planning to travel to Europe as tourists from USA
    >between Nov. 20th and Nov. 28th. I need help in planning the trip.
    >Here are the places we are interested in. We are primarily interested
    >in site seeing.

I'll join the chorus saying that you are trying to do too much. I
suggest limiting yourself to two centres and/or a relatively small
aea. So Paris and Rome would be feasible, though if you want to go
between the two by train then allow a whole day for the journey as
it's around 13 hours. Or you could aim to visit Italy, rather than
trying to 'do Europe' so Rome, Venice, and the Italian lakes would be
feasible within the time that you have..

To be fair you acknowledge that you could spend much more time in any
one of the places that interest you.

    >2. Switzerland: Zurich, and Alps (I am not sure what city we should
    >visit for Alps, and if November would be a good time). We are planning
    >to stay for 1 night and 2 days.

The Alps cover a huge area and your best approach might not be to go
for a city at all, especially in Switzerland where there is quite a
dense rail network. Or, given your time constraints, just see them
through a train window:-)


    >2. Travel from one country to another within Europe (and from one city
    >to another): Is it advisable to purchase rail tickets instead of rail
    >passes? Where can I find information on how long it takes and how much
    >it costs?

The best resource for train times (not fares) across Europe is run by
Deutsche Bahn and is at http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/en
for the English version.

Conventional wisdom on rail passes is that you need to do a lot of
travelling to make them worth while. If you buy tickets for
individual train journeys, buy them once you arrive in Europe and not
in the US. The people who sell rail passes in the US also sell point
to point tickets but these are invariably MUCH more expensive than
buying the equivalent tickets in Europe.


    >7. Language: We both speak English, do we need to learn native
    >language of the country or can we manage with English?

It's worth learnign a few simple useful phrases, but otherwise just
don't assume that everybody will understand English, and ask politely
whether somebody speaks any English when you first approach them

Martin

Martin Bienwald

Martin Rich schrieb:

    > The best resource for train times (not fares) across Europe is run by
    > Deutsche Bahn and is at http://reiseauskunft.bahn.de/bin/query.exe/en
    > for the English version.

Standard international fares can be looked up at
http://www.jizdenka.cz/IT.aspx

This is a Czech site, and is available only in Czech language, but
rather simple to use: enter your starting point at "Z" and your
destination at "Do", hit the <Tab> key or click anywhere on the
ticket image, and the price in euros (and Czech crowns) will show up
at the bottom. Write place names in their local language (e.g. Zuerich,
Warszawa, Roma).

Those are standard 2nd class fares; there may be any number of special
offers depending on where you buy your ticket. For example, a standard
one-way second class fare from Paris to Rome is given as EUR 144.

You can get 1st class fares by clicking on the number "2" after the word
"Trída" (which will then change to 1).

I think the whole thing is still being tested, and it does have some
bugs (i.e. uses a rather awkward routing between some pairs of places)
but it helps to get a general impression of the fare to pay.

... Martin

barney

In article <[email protected]>,
[email protected] (Padraig Breathnach) wrote:

    > [email protected] (Luca Logi) wrote:
    >
    > >Dolomites in November?
    >
    > Do they take them down and put them away for the winter?

Yup, just like the roads on Craggy Island.

B Vaughan

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 07:45:49 +0100, Martin Rich <[email protected]>
wrote:

    >I'll join the chorus saying that you are trying to do too much. I
    >suggest limiting yourself to two centres and/or a relatively small
    >aea. So Paris and Rome would be feasible, though if you want to go
    >between the two by train then allow a whole day for the journey as
    >it's around 13 hours.

There's a train that leaves Paris at 8 AM which arrives in Milan at
2:55 pm. A Eurostar from Milan to Rome takes 4 and a half hours,
although you might have to wait an hour to get one. That would be
about 11 and a half hours on the train, plus around an hour in the
station at Milan. There's a Eurostar leaving Milan at 4 pm, so you
would be in Rome by 8:30 pm. It's certainly a full day, but a bit less
than 13 hours.

If you don't want to see scenery, you could take the overnight train
with a couchette from Paris to Milan. Actually, it only costs about
half as much, for some reason, and it saves you a night in a hotel.

I took this train last week.
-----------
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup

B Vaughan

On Thu, 16 Sep 2004 22:07:02 +0200, [email protected] (Luca Logi) wrote:

    >B Vaughan <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> If you leave Paris on Monday and arrive in some town in
    >> Switzerland in the late afternoon, and then find your hotel, unpack,
    >> and have some dinner, you'll see very little of Switzerland before you
    >> have to repack, check out of your hotel, go back to the train station
    >> and continue your journey to Rome.
    >He'll see no Switzerland at all, considering that the country shuts up
    >at 6.30pm :-)

If I remember correctly, one of the daytime trains leaving Paris got
to Lausanne aroung 2 pm, though. It arrived in Milan well before 6.

-----------
Barbara Vaughan
My email address is my first initial followed by my surname at libero dot it
I answer travel questions only in the newsgroup

Juliana L Holm

B Vaughan <[email protected]> wrote:

    > If you don't want to see scenery, you could take the overnight train
    > with a couchette from Paris to Milan. Actually, it only costs about
    > half as much, for some reason, and it saves you a night in a hotel.

I love doing these overnight trains in Europe when I travel in Europe and
have to cover a lot of distance. In 2001 when we visited Germany, a daughter
wanted to see Auschwitz so we did a couchette trip from Berlin to Krakow, then
back to Berlin the next night. They were comfortable, fun and very
European. A great experience, you save a hotel room and convenient.


--
Julie
**********
Check out my Travel Pages (non-commercial) at
http://www.dragonsholm.org/travel.htm

nitram

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 14:34:14 +0000 (UTC), Juliana L Holm
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >B Vaughan <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> If you don't want to see scenery, you could take the overnight train
    >> with a couchette from Paris to Milan. Actually, it only costs about
    >> half as much, for some reason, and it saves you a night in a hotel.
    >I love doing these overnight trains in Europe when I travel in Europe and
    >have to cover a lot of distance. In 2001 when we visited Germany, a daughter
    >wanted to see Auschwitz so we did a couchette trip from Berlin to Krakow, then
    >back to Berlin the next night.

Did you travel by cattle truck?

Magda

On Fri, 17 Sep 2004 07:45:49 +0100, in rec.travel.europe, Martin Rich
<[email protected]> arranged some electrons, so they looked like this :


... I'll join the chorus saying that you are trying to do too much. I
... suggest limiting yourself to two centres and/or a relatively small
... aea. So Paris and Rome would be feasible, though if you want to go
... between the two by train then allow a whole day for the journey as
... it's around 13 hours.

You mean "a night".
There are berths in trains, you know. No need to waste a whole day travelling.

Randee

Not wasting a day at all, I would watch the scenery. A great way to
learn the physiography of an area.
--
wf.

Magda wrote:
    >
to go
    > ... between the two by train then allow a whole day for the journey as
    > ... it's around 13 hours.
    >
    > You mean "a night".
    > There are berths in trains, you know. No need to waste a whole day travelling.