Le Mon, 15 Jul 2002 14:36:43 +0100, The Oik <[email protected]> a écrit :

{ snip }

    > I gather you are unfamiliar with the rash of spiral jobbies??

Well, no, I haven't been constipated for a while, to be honest ...

--
Desmond Coughlan |****#1 YGL#4 YFC#1 YFB#1 UKRMMA#14 two#38 Yamaha FJR1300 |BONY#48
ANORAK#11 desmond @ zeouane.org http: // www . zeouane . org

Le Mon, 15 Jul 2002 15:14:32 +0100, The Oik <[email protected]> a écrit :

{ snip }

    > thats the one, first exit - signal left, any other - signal right until passing the
    > one before you want, then left. Passed car AND bike test that way (actually, bike
    > test it was a question, that was still in the days of hands signals - on an RD250?
    > Hand signals? Bwaahahahaha)

I'm not entirely sure that this is the way it was either taught, or defined in the
Highway Code.

The way I learnt it was ...

i) First exit, left-hand lane, left-hand indicator
ii) second exit, left-hand lane, no indicator until past first exit
iii) third and subsequent exits, right-hand lane, right-hand indicator until past
the exit before the one you intend to take

--
Desmond Coughlan |****#1 YGL#4 YFC#1 YFB#1 UKRMMA#14 two#38 Yamaha FJR1300 |BONY#48
ANORAK#11 desmond @ zeouane.org http: // www . zeouane . org

One suggestion I have heard is to remove the hub caps (if any) on the left side of
the car, saves having to pay to replace them.

On Sun, 14 Jul 2002 22:52:48 -0700, Dan Stephenson <[email protected]> wrote:

    >I'm vacationing in Britain next month and will be renting a car. I've never driven
    >in Britain before (I'm a Texan) so driving on the left will be new for me. Is there
    >anything I should "know"? For example, a coworker suggests it is easy to jump curbs
    >and blow tires because of the unusual geometries.
    >
    >Thanks in advance, please post.

Rick Garner To email replace the with isomedia

In article <[email protected]>, Horst Prillinger
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >Elio's posting about resuming a drive after a stop somewhere on a quiet road is
    >cartainly valid, and his "keep left" note is a good idea for those occasions.

I did that once on a quiet country road in Japan--we were pulled to the right for a
construction detour, and after the construction ended, I just kept buzzing merrily
along in the right lane. My boss, in the left seat, nearly had a heart attack.

--

Eric Holeman eholatenteractcom Chicago Illinois USA

"Desmond Coughlan" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Le Mon, 15 Jul 2002 14:36:43 +0100, The Oik
<[email protected]> a écrit :
    >
    > { snip }
    >
    > > I gather you are unfamiliar with the rash of spiral jobbies??
    >
    > Well, no, I haven't been constipated for a while, to be honest ...
    >
Yep, they fix that problem, as well

In message <[email protected] t>, Desmond Coughlan
<[email protected]> writes
    >Le Mon, 15 Jul 2002 15:14:32 +0100, The Oik <[email protected]> a écrit :
    >
    >{ snip }
    >
    >> thats the one, first exit - signal left, any other - signal right until passing
    >> the one before you want, then left. Passed car AND bike test that way (actually,
    >> bike test it was a question, that was still in the days of hands signals - on an
    >> RD250? Hand signals? Bwaahahahaha)
    >
    >I'm not entirely sure that this is the way it was either taught, or defined in the
    >Highway Code.
    >
    >The way I learnt it was ...
    >
    > i) First exit, left-hand lane, left-hand indicator
    > ii) second exit, left-hand lane, no indicator until past first exit
    >iii) third and subsequent exits, right-hand lane, right-hand indicator until past
    > the exit before the one you intend to take
    >
    >

According to the written test you only indicate when exiting a roundabout, but in
reality most people indicate all the time. This caught me and a lot of people by
surprise, a large number of drivers with licenses failed the mock paper exam,
fortunately the person who had to take it for real passed.
--
Ron Clarey Translaters.net HTTP://www.translaters.net

On Sun, 14 Jul 2002 23:07:53 -0700 (PDT), [email protected] (I. Wilson Gittleman,
M.D.) wrote:

    >>Despite Paul's opinion regarding roundabouts, I find them the best thing since
    >>Kleenex.
    >>
    >>Just wait until there is an opening. Once into the roundabout, you need fear no one
    >>coming in. If you have, for some reason, missed the sign for the town you, you are
    >>safe to go around again and again without fear.
what a useless piece of advice... forget the highway code, there is a very simple
formulae for working out who has right of way at roundabouts.... The greater the
tonnage, the more right of way.... The only exception to this rule is in London where
black cabs think they have absolute right of way at all times, under all
circumstances.

TEST Coming into London Gatwick? Fixed price Taxi to Central London
http://www.airport-transfers-uk.com

"Ron Clarey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > In message <[email protected] t>, Desmond Coughlan
    > <[email protected]> writes
    > >Le Mon, 15 Jul 2002 15:14:32 +0100, The Oik <[email protected]> a
    > >écrit :
    > >
    > >{ snip }
    > >
    > >> thats the one, first exit - signal left, any other - signal right until passing
    > >> the one before you want, then
left.
    > >> Passed car AND bike test that way (actually, bike test it was a
question,
    > >> that was still in the days of hands signals - on an RD250? Hand
signals?
    > >> Bwaahahahaha)
    > >
    > >I'm not entirely sure that this is the way it was either taught, or defined in the
    > >Highway Code.
    > >
    > >The way I learnt it was ...
    > >
    > > i) First exit, left-hand lane, left-hand indicator
    > > ii) second exit, left-hand lane, no indicator until past first exit
    > >iii) third and subsequent exits, right-hand lane, right-hand indicator
until
    > > past the exit before the one you intend to take
    > >
    > >
    >
    > According to the written test you only indicate when exiting a roundabout, but in
    > reality most people indicate all the time. This caught me and a lot of people by
    > surprise, a large number of drivers with licenses failed the mock paper exam,
    > fortunately the person who had to take it for real passed.
    > --
I've gone to find a Highway code, circa 197x.....

On starting the car and leaving the curb, on a residential street, I will invariably
start driving on the right. To the point that on seeing a car coming in the opposite
direction on my side of the street, will start honking and flashing lights, until my
'so reminds me I am on the wrong side of the street.

Never an accident yet, but have noticed some very angry looking drivers.

--mikeb

In article <[email protected]>, Elio <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    >"Dan Stephenson" <[email protected]> ha scritto nel messaggio
    >news:AA3B81A97088BB3A.E3417191E604F9...lp.airnews.net...
    >> I'm vacationing in Britain next month and will be renting a car. I've
    >never
    >> driven in Britain before (I'm a Texan) so driving on the left will be new for me.
    >> Is there anything I should "know"? For example, a coworker suggests it is easy to
    >> jump curbs and blow tires because of the unusual geometries.
    >>
    >> Thanks in advance, please post.
    >> --
    >> Dan Stephenson
    >>
    >> (remove from email address to reply via email)
    >
    >Based on my experience, the more risky situation when driving on the left may arise
    >when You resume driving after a stop in less trafficated roads where You don't have
    >reference with other cars. In that case You may have a tendency of going to the
    >right side of the road as You are used to do at home until You realize the mistake.
    >To prevent the risk i use to put a sticker in front of the driving seat with a big
    >"Keep Left" sign. I found out that this really helps me.. Regards Elio

"Elio" wrote
    > "Dan Stephenson" ha scritto
    > > I'm vacationing in Britain next month and will be renting a car. I've
    > never
    > > driven in Britain before (I'm a Texan) so driving on the left will be new for me.
    > Based on my experience, the more risky situation when driving on the left may arise
    > when You resume driving after a stop in less trafficated roads where You don't have
    > reference with other cars.

Not just in 'less trafficated' roads ... saw someone try and drive down the wrong
lane in Edinburgh's Princes St only a few weeks ago. (It was fun to watch from a safe
distance.)

Owain

On Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:18:07 GMT, "Stephen C. Gallagher"
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >
    >> I drove on the left in Ireland--can't give you specifics about Britain. But, there
    >> are two things that may pose a problem: the rearview mirror; and, shifting with
    >> the left hand.
    >>
    >> You will find yourself looking up and to the right for the mirror. It's automatic
    >> for those of us who have driven for 30 years on American roads. Over there, you
    >> will see the sky. Somewhat disconcerting.
    >>
    >> Assuming that you use a manual transmission here, you will unconciously reach for
    >> the shifter with your right hand AND HIT THE DOOR. The shifter is on the left.
    >> This, too, will take some getting used to. By the time you get used to it, it's
    >> time to go home.
    >
    >What was funny for me, is that I used a trip to Scotland to "learn" how to drive a
    >manual transmission. After I returned home to New York, I had an opportunity to
    >drive a manual transmission car in the US, and I kept trying to shift with my left
    >hand. After a while you get used to it.
    >
    >Stephen Gallagher
    >
    >
I drove a manual transmission from about age 17 until I was in my 30's. Then, it was
automatic transmissions for over twenty years, until November of '01 when I went to
Ireland. The thing that amazes me, in retrospect, is that I tried shifting with my
right hand without even thinking about it--AFTER TWENTY YEARS!

The cliche on the west side of the pond is, "...like riding a bicycle."

<[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > On Mon, 15 Jul 2002 11:18:07 GMT, "Stephen C. Gallagher"
    > <[email protected]> wrote:
    >
    > >
    > I drove a manual transmission from about age 17 until I was in my 30's. Then, it
    > was automatic transmissions for over twenty years, until November of '01 when I
    > went to Ireland. The thing that amazes me, in retrospect, is that I tried shifting
    > with my right hand without even thinking about it--AFTER TWENTY YEARS!
    >
    > The cliche on the west side of the pond is, "...like riding a bicycle."

One other point if you swap from auto to manual: don't forget the clutch at traffic
lights... I've done it a few times (I drive auto in UK, due to trafiic, manual
everywhere else)

"Ron Clarey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > In message <[email protected] t>, Desmond Coughlan
    > <[email protected]> writes
    > >Le Mon, 15 Jul 2002 15:14:32 +0100, The Oik <[email protected]> a
    > >écrit :
    > >
    > >{ snip }
    > >
    > >> thats the one, first exit - signal left, any other - signal right until passing
    > >> the one before you want, then
left.
    > >> Passed car AND bike test that way (actually, bike test it was a
question,
    > >> that was still in the days of hands signals - on an RD250? Hand
signals?
    > >> Bwaahahahaha)
    > >
    > >I'm not entirely sure that this is the way it was either taught, or defined in the
    > >Highway Code.
    > >
    > >The way I learnt it was ...
    > >
    > > i) First exit, left-hand lane, left-hand indicator
    > > ii) second exit, left-hand lane, no indicator until past first exit
    > >iii) third and subsequent exits, right-hand lane, right-hand indicator
until
    > > past the exit before the one you intend to take
    > >
    > >
    >
    > According to the written test you only indicate when exiting a roundabout, but in
    > reality most people indicate all the time.

In which case, the written test disagrees with the Highway Code and the Official
Driving Manual, both of which require you to signal right before entering and while
negotating the roundabout if you are taking the last exit or turning 360 degrees,
as above. Roadcraft works on the principle that you should only signal when it
would be of use to other road users, so simply advises that you should consider
whether to signal.

Colin Bignell

In article <AA3B81A97088BB3A.E3417191E604F94D.8F19F5761EC521E [email protected]>, Dan
Stephenson <[email protected]> wrote:

    > I'm vacationing in Britain next month and will be renting a car. I've never driven
    > in Britain before (I'm a Texan) so driving on the left will be new for me. Is there
    > anything I should "know"? For example, a coworker suggests it is easy to jump curbs
    > and blow tires because of the unusual geometries.
    >
    > Thanks in advance, please post.

DRIVING IN ENGLAND

Most Americans faced with the thought of driving in England (or Wales, Scotland, or
Ireland...) get worried about the problem of remembering to drive on the ³wrong² side
of the road, and about how to deal with roundabouts (traffic circles). Neither are
very hard as long as you keep your head about you, and the same goes for the rest of
what¹s different about driving in England as opposed to driving in the US.

Before even talking about the task of driving, a word about your hire car (rental
car) is in order. Unless you are comfortable with driving a manual shift car in
America, get an automatic. Do not attempt to ³pick it up as you go along²‹you will
have enough else to think about without the added distraction of learning that as
well. If you are used to a manual shift, then adapting to a manual in England should
cause little difficulty‹the difference is in shifting with your left hand rather than
your right. The shift pattern remains the same (first up and to the left, etc.), as
do all the pedals.

Traffic in England drives on the left side of the road; overtaking (passing) is done
on the right. While this would seem to be a huge difficulty to someone whose entire
driving instincts tell them to ³keep right², the fact that driving is done from the
right side of the car presents a very powerful reminder that something different is
going on! Just as in the US, you need to keep yourself in the center of the road. Do
remember, however, that roads may be narrower, and if you are in the center of the
road, the left side of your car may be crashing through the hedgerows...or worse!
Somewhat more difficult are the other habits that need adapting to driving on the
left‹it will take you a bit of time to get used to looking in the right spots for the
rear view mirrors, for example. More important, remember that when driving in England
the most immediate danger will be from the right, so look right first, before edging
out to see to the left at an intersection.

Intersections are pretty much the same as in America, though you will see very few
³STOP² signs‹most intersections are signposted with ³GIVE WAY² (Yield) signs (often
marked as an upside-down triangle painted on the road). These mean exactly what they
say: if there is someone coming along on the other road, you have to stop, otherwise
just go ahead. In towns, you will find traffic lights, which work the same as in
America with one exception: just before turning green, they change to red and yellow
together. This is everyone¹s signal to get in gear and get ready, so you can move
right off when the light goes green. Also, note that there is no equivalent to our
³right turn on red.²

It¹s the last main type of intersection that gives everyone their
anxiety‹roundabouts. These come in all sizes from huge, multi-lane affairs with big
grass islands in the middle, to tiny painted bumps in an otherwise normal looking
intersection. (These are the easiest to miss, especially when they are strung
together two or three in a row!) For all of them the routine is the same: Give Way
to the traffic in the circle. A step-by-step guide to negotiating a roundabout: [1]
A short distance before the roundabout, there will be a sign showing route and town
names for each of the exits off the roundabout, so you can plan ahead of time where
you will be getting off. [2] There may also be a second sign, showing local
destinations off the roundabout. [3] Finally, there will be a sign letting you know
that a roundabout is ahead‹usually obvious, but handy for those hard-to-spot mini
roundabouts! [4] Entrance to the roundabout is controlled by a Give Way triangle and
double dotted lines painted on the road‹remember, you must give way to traffic
already on the roundabout. [5] An arrow will remind you to go to the left, though in
practice, this is easy to remember. Use your turn signal as if the roundabout were
not there (ie. if your road is the one at the 3:00 position on the clock, you would
signal a right turn). Once on the roundabout, count off your exits as you go, and
just before the one you want to get off, indicate a left turn (to get off the
circle). [6] There will be signs at each exit saying what road it is, and [7] once
on that road, there will be a sign to confirm what road you are on. If you goof up
somehow, just go around the circle again! Wonderfully simple, and for the most part,
they keep the traffic moving much better than a traffic lighted four way
intersection does.

Road signs in general are the other biggest difference from driving in the US, though
one people don¹t give much thought to. Signs come in different shapes, each of which
gives a different type of information. Round signs give orders: speed limits (30 mph
in towns, 70 mph on motorways and dual carriageways (divided highways with two lanes
in each direction), and 60 mph everywhere else), end of speed restriction (a white
circle with a black diagonal‹usually found at the end of towns and villages, and
indicating a return to the 60 mph limit), no entry (red circle with a white
horizontal bar), and no parking (blue circle with a red diagonal or X in it‹the first
means ³no parking³ and the second ³no standing³). Triangular signs give warnings: of
an approaching roundabout, of the road narrowing, of a curve in the road, etc.
Rectangular signs give information: route information, tourist attractions, car parks
(parking lots), etc.

A couple of signs and road markings that are somewhat cryptic bear special mention.
One is the motorway junction (exit) countdown marker: as a junction is nearing, there
will be a small rectangular sign with 3 slashes on it, then somewhat nearer the
junction, one with 2 slashes, then finally one with 1 slash, then the junction
itself. An important road marking to be aware of (as often they are instead of any
signage) is that for a zebra crossing (crosswalk): as you approach it, there will be
zig-zag white lines on the side of the road, then the white stripes of the crossing
itself, with either black and white striped poles with flashing yellow lights on top,
or a traffic signal. You must stop for pedestrians in the crossing! Another marking
to be aware of are single and double yellow lines on the curbside. These indicate
parking restrictions: double yellow means no parking at all, single means some sort
of limited parking (look for a sign nearby). In towns, look for white signs with a
blue ³P² on them‹that means a car park. Many are ³pay and display²‹rather than having
meters at each space, there is a machine somewhere that you put your money into, and
you get a small sticker which goes on your window indicating what time you have paid
until. Car parks are easy to find‹just follow signs to Town Centre and look for the P
signs. Finding a space in the car park is another matter...popular tourist spots,
market towns on Saturdays, etc. all have parking problems.

England¹s roads are very well signposted for directions and route information. A good
map or road atlas is very helpful, however, as roads are marked by the towns they go
to rather than compass directions. Two exceptions that you will see are signs for
³The North² or ³The West²‹these are regions rather than simply directions. At some
intersections, the route numbers will be painted right on the road‹which lane to go
in‹as well as being on signs. M roads (with blue signs) are motorways, and are the
equivalent to the US interstate highways. A roads (with dark green signs) are the
main roads other than motorways‹the lower the number, the bigger and more like a
motorway the road is. They are also sometimes called trunk roads, and are similar to
US highways and state highways in America. B roads (white signs) are smaller still,
and would be like county highways in some parts of the US. Finally, there are the
unnumbered ³lanes² that criss-cross the countryside like a web. On all signs, when a
road is put in parentheses, it means that you are not on that road yet, but by
following the road you are on, you will get to it. If you are driving alone, take
some time to work out your route ahead of time, writing road numbers and landmark
towns along the way on a sticky paper pad and then tack it to your dashboard. In
addition to the road signs, you will see white signs with blue borders‹local
destinations‹and brown signs‹tourist attractions.

As many of the roads in England are only one lane in each direction, overtaking
(passing) happens much more frequently than in America. First of all, only overtake
if there is a broken white line in the middle of the road. Then, if you are going to
pass, be ready to do so quickly and smoothly. Signal that you are crossing the center
line, pull out (to the right!) and then pull back in. You do not need to signal for
going back into you regular lane if you are on a two lane road. On motorways and dual
carriageways, keep right unless you are overtaking‹it is illegal to pass on the
inside, and drivers are far less ³random² about what lane they use than in America.
At some point, you will probably end up on one of the tiny lanes that connect
villages in the country. Some are only six or seven feet wide (for two
directions!)‹if you meet up with a car going in the opposite direction, one of you
simply reverses to a passing place, a gate into a field, or a driveway to let the
other pass.

In some built-up areas, you will see various ³traffic calming² measures on the roads.
These are intended to slow down the traffic, and come in a variety of forms‹sleeping
policemen or ³humps² (speed bumps), textured paving such as rumble strips, and actual
obstructions or gates in the roadway. Check the signs to see who has priority‹the
small red arrows on your side mean you have to give way to traffic in the other
direction; a larger black arrow indicates you have the priority.

England is somewhat incompletely metric‹distances and speed limits are quoted in
miles and miles per hour, but when you go to buy petrol (gasoline) you do so by the
liter (though some garages also quote prices by the Imperial gallon!). Be prepared
for a shock if you take the time to work out what 70-80p per liter works out to in
dollars per US gallon‹about $4.50-$5.00!

Good luck and have fun!

Bill

--
Bill Wright Old Greenwich, CT USA [email protected]

Important to remember, you cannot turn right on red lights