Gordon Forbess <[email protected]> staggered to the nearest
keyboard and wrote:

    >From: http://www.hsrc.unc.edu/pressrelease/background.htm

    >Below is a distribution of distracting activities. Listed next to the
    >percentages are the 95% confidence intervals.
    >Outside person, object, or event 29.4% (plus or minus 4.7%)
    >Adjusting radio/cassette/CD 11.4% (plus or minus 7.2%)
    >Other occupant 10.9% (plus or minus 3.3%)
    >Moving object in vehicle 4.3% (plus or minus 3.2%)
    >Other device/object 2.9% (plus or minus 1.6%)
    >Adjusting vehicle/climate controls 2.8% (plus or minus 1.1%)
    >Eating and/or drinking 1.7% (plus or minus 0.6%)
    >Using/dialing cell phone 1.5% (plus or minus 0.9%)
    >Smoking related 0.9% (plus or minus 0.4%)
    >Other distractions 25.6% (plus or minus 6.0%)
    >Unknown distraction 8.6% (plus or minus 5.3%)
    >My understanding of these two tables is as follows:
    >Of the over 32,000 damaged vehicles studied, the cause of the crash
    >was a "distracted" driver in 8.3% of the crashes. Of this 8.3%, the
    >second table lists the determined causes of the distractions. Note
    >the relative position of "Using/dialing cell phone" in this ranking.
    >I believe that the data is quite clear.

No the data are not "clear" by a long shot, because we have to
consider the proportion of drivers who engage in each activity and the
frequency with which they engage in it.

ANYONE can be distracted by an "outside person, object or event" at
most any time but obviously only those who are using cell phones can
be distracted by using a cell phone. At any given moment, what
fraction of drivers are using cell phones while driving? If only 5%
of all drivers are using cellphones (to pick a number out of thin air)
but cellphones are implicated in 1.5% of accidents, then cellphones
are disproportionately dangerous.



--

Icono Clast wrote:
    >
    > "Casey" <[email protected]> wrote:
    > > cities/countries have banned the use of cell phones
    > > while driving. Anyone want to mention specific localities?
    >
    > I don't know what laws have been enacted in San Francisco or the state
    > that surrounds us but I do know that many bars, restaurants, stores,
    > and other businesses have banned their use on the premises. Such signs
    > at entrances seem to be greater in number each day.

I hope they have better luck than the theaters and auditoriums that post
similar notices (in the case of L.A. Opera, even in lights, in the space
above the stage that the surtitles occupy during performance). I don't
know when I last attended a concert or opera where at least one
cell-phone did not ring during the performance. (And sometimes the
idiots even ANSWER the damned things!)

    >
    > I just love it when I see someone driving on a Yuppiefon and I toot
    > the horn and they jump and look around with "What'd I do?" on their
    > faces. I hope to scare them into cessation of use.

More likely to "scare" them into colliding with another car, if they
actually turn around to look at you, IMO!

    >
    > As with others, I've seen many red lights run and pedestrians narrowly
    > missed by Yuppiefon drivers. Yes, it happens with non-users, too, but
    > not with such great frequency in my line of sight.
    >
    > It hasn't yet been mentioned that pedestrians on Yuppiefons are also
    > quite hazardous to pedestrians as well as drivers.

I think Barbara Vaughan covered that in one of her posts - she narrowly
avoided being hit by one, thanks to being fast on her feet.

    >
    > The other day a woman sitting behind me was speaking to me. Although I
    > heard her voice, I tuned her out because I tought she was on a
    > Yuppiefon.

Yeah, used to be when you saw people walking down the street, talking
and gesturing wildly, you assumed they were mentally disturbed - now
they're more likely just using a "hands free" cell-phone!

Wolfgang Schwanke schrieb:
    >
    > "Casey" <[email protected]> wrote in
    > news:[email protected]:
    >
    > > Some European cities/countries have banned the use of cell
    > > phones while driving.
    >
    > With a hands free kit they're still allowed AFAIK.
    >
    > > Anyone want to mention specific localities?
    >
    > Germany

In spite of which you see people using their "Handys" on the autobahn
every day.
Tom

    >
    > --
    > Loki Helmut Cha Cha Cha
    >
    > http://www.wschwanke.de/

On Sun, 24 Aug 2003 20:11:01 GMT, [email protected] (Charles Hawtrey)
wrote:

    >No the data are not "clear" by a long shot, because we have to
    >consider the proportion of drivers who engage in each activity and the
    >frequency with which they engage in it.

    >ANYONE can be distracted by an "outside person, object or event" at
    >most any time but obviously only those who are using cell phones can
    >be distracted by using a cell phone. At any given moment, what
    >fraction of drivers are using cell phones while driving? If only 5%
    >of all drivers are using cellphones (to pick a number out of thin air)
    >but cellphones are implicated in 1.5% of accidents, then cellphones
    >are disproportionately dangerous.

That's a valid question that this study doesn't address, and I don't
think it would be legitimate to cross-correlate the results of the two
phases.

However if you did, smoking looks to be standout loser. Only 7.1%
participation, 1.55% of the driving time and .9% of the crashed
vehicles.

Gordon

Charles Hawtrey <[email protected]> wrote:
    > ANYONE can be distracted by an "outside person, object or event" at
    > most any time but obviously only those who are using cell phones can
    > be distracted by using a cell phone. At any given moment, what
    > fraction of drivers are using cell phones while driving? If only 5%
    > of all drivers are using cellphones (to pick a number out of thin air)
    > but cellphones are implicated in 1.5% of accidents, then cellphones
    > are disproportionately dangerous.

Random data point: Went for a 40-mile ride today. Twice, drivers ran stop
signs and almost ran me off the road. In both cases they were talking on
cell phones.

miguel
--
Hit The Road! Photos and tales from around the world: http://travel.u.nu

Casey's ([email protected]) pet ferret ran around on the keyboard to
create news:[email protected]:

    > Some European cities/countries have banned the use of cell
    > phones while driving. Anyone want to mention specific localities?
    >
    >
    > Casey
    >
    >

It's illegal in France, and the fine is €90 so I'd be careful.

-Alex Tievsky

--
LET'S GO CAPS! (Even if they can't get past the first round, once again)

History will be kind to me, for I intend to write it.
- Sir Winston Churchill

Email: "atievsky" at-symbol "cox" dot "net"

    > > Some European cities/countries have banned the use of cell
    > > phones while driving. Anyone want to mention specific localities?
    > >
    > It's illegal in France, and the fine is ?90 so I'd be careful.

Is it enforced in France?
Here in Germany it's forbidden, too. Fine is 30 EUR or so. But nobody
cares. Even driving by a Police man everyone keeps the phone at the
ear.

I always thought French have a relaxed attitude to regulations and
Germans are the law observers nbr 1.


Walter

walter a écrit :

    > I always thought French have a relaxed attitude to regulations and
    > Germans are the law observers nbr 1.

Well, ever since a Swiss woman driving somewhere in France caused an
accident which killed 2 policemen because she was driving at 170km/h while
typing a text message on her cell phone (no I'm not inventing this, it's
true, some people are nuts), all this with her 2 small kids in the back of
the car, I think they're not so relaxed about it...
It happened about 2 months ago.

Nathalie in Switzerland

On Sun, 24 Aug 2003 13:12:30 +0200, tim wrote:


    > "Derek F" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    >> "Casey" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >> news:[email protected]...
    >>> > > Some European cities/countries have banned the use of cell
    >>> > > phones while driving. Anyone want to mention specific localities?
    >>> >
    >>> > any country that has any sense.
    >>> > Why do you wish to put someone's life at risk [1] for the sake of
    >>> > a small amount of convenience? What did you do before you had
    >>> > the phone? Stop at every coin-box?
    >>> I think you and I are in violent agreement. I think the USA
    >>> should ban the use of cell phones while driving. I was just
    >>> curious about Europe.
    >>> Casey
    >> We call them Mobile phones:-)

    > No, they are 'Handies' and they think it's an English word :-o

    > I see perfectly translated signs which still include the word Handy
    > and the Brits all look at each other and say "what's a handy".

    > Tim


In Germany the plural should be "Handys", not "Handies" anyway, to stick to
the new German spelling rules. Along with Babys, and Ladys. Ugh!

--
Tim.

If the human brain were simple enough that we could understand it, we would
be so simple that we couldn't.

On Sat, 23 Aug 2003 22:12:23 GMT, Gordon Forbess wrote:

    > On Sat, 23 Aug 2003 23:25:57 +0200, "tim"
    > <[email protected]> wrote:

    >>But as the report itself suggests that mobile phone use is only 1.5% of
    >>distractions, it seems to be point towards the claim that mobile phone use is
    >>more distracting that othe 'distractions' which is exactly why it should be
    >>banned.

    > I don't think that's the conclusion most people who read it are
    > making. Some examples:
<snip>
    > http://www.psychologytoday.com/htdoc...808-000001.asp

At the bottom of this report it says " While drivers may spend more time
eating than talking, a phone call may demand more mental reserves--and
bring a greater risk."

So it hardly was a well-chosen example.

--
Tim.

If the human brain were simple enough that we could understand it, we would
be so simple that we couldn't.

Tim Challenger <"timothy(dot)challenger(at)apk(dot)at"> wrote in
news:9d2f581bc8b99dce9ee46c34326fe15....teranews.com:

    >>> We call them Mobile phones:-)
    >
    >> No, they are 'Handies'

The word "Mobiltelefon" exists.

    > and they think it's an English word :-o

It is. German just adapted its meaning. There are more such "fake
English" words in German.

    > In Germany the plural should be "Handys", not "Handies" anyway, to
    > stick to the new German spelling rules. Along with Babys, and Ladys.
    > Ugh!

Old rules as well, no change there. And why shouldn't we? They are loan
words alright, but we only import the word, not its grammar. When used in a
German sentence, they are German words, and German grammar applies. English
acts just the same. Or do you pluralise "rucksäcke", "kindergärten" and
"glockenspiele"?

Regards

--
Franz jagt im komplett verwahrlosten Taxi quer durch Bayern.


http://www.wschwanke.de/

On Tue, 2 Sep 2003 14:39:15 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke wrote:

    > Tim Challenger <"timothy(dot)challenger(at)apk(dot)at"> wrote in
    > news:9d2f581bc8b99dce9ee46c34326fe15....teranews.com:

    >>>> We call them Mobile phones:-)

    >>> No, they are 'Handies'

    > The word "Mobiltelefon" exists.

    >>> and they think it's an English word :-o

    > It is. German just adapted its meaning. There are more such "fake
    > English" words in German.

    >> In Germany the plural should be "Handys", not "Handies" anyway, to
    >> stick to the new German spelling rules. Along with Babys, and Ladys.
    >> Ugh!

    > Old rules as well, no change there. And why shouldn't we? They are loan
    > words alright, but we only import the word, not its grammar. When used in a
    > German sentence, they are German words, and German grammar applies.

Quite right.

    > English acts just the same. Or do you pluralise "rucksäcke", "kindergärten" and
    > "glockenspiele"?

I don't think I've ever heard the plurals of glockenpiel or kindergarten
used before. But it's beside the point, as I was commenting on Tim's use
in English sentences.

--
Tim (Challenger).
If the human brain were simple enough that we could understand it, we would
be so simple that we couldn't.

On Tue, 2 Sep 2003 14:39:15 +0200, Wolfgang Schwanke
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >Tim Challenger <"timothy(dot)challenger(at)apk(dot)at"> wrote in
    >news:9d2f581bc8b99dce9ee46c34326fe15....teranews.com:
    >>>> We call them Mobile phones:-)
    >>
    >>> No, they are 'Handies'
    >The word "Mobiltelefon" exists.
    >> and they think it's an English word :-o
    >It is. German just adapted its meaning. There are more such "fake
    >English" words in German.
    >> In Germany the plural should be "Handys", not "Handies" anyway, to
    >> stick to the new German spelling rules. Along with Babys, and Ladys.
    >> Ugh!
    >Old rules as well, no change there. And why shouldn't we? They are loan
    >words alright, but we only import the word, not its grammar. When used in a
    >German sentence, they are German words, and German grammar applies. English
    >acts just the same. Or do you pluralise "rucksäcke", "kindergärten" and
    >"glockenspiele"?
Wolfgang, I hope for your sake that Marie isn't reading this, or
she'll make you stay behind after lessons and write out 100 times "I
must not muder the English language." :-)

"Alex Tievsky" <[email protected]> wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > Casey's ([email protected]) pet ferret ran around on the keyboard to
    > create news:[email protected]:
    > > Some European cities/countries have banned the use of cell
    > > phones while driving. Anyone want to mention specific localities?
    > >
    > >
    > > Casey
    > >
    > >
    > It's illegal in France, and the fine is ?90 so I'd be careful.
    > -Alex Tievsky
And in the UK, use of a mobile phone in a car, even stationary (e.g at
traffic lights), without a hands-free kit will be illegal from November (I
think). Fixed penalty of £60 and 3 points on your licence.

Alec

On Tue, 2 Sep 2003 23:55:00 +0100, Alec wrote:


    > "Alex Tievsky" <[email protected]> wrote in message
    > news:[email protected]...
    >> Casey's ([email protected]) pet ferret ran around on the keyboard to
    >> create news:[email protected]:
    >>> Some European cities/countries have banned the use of cell
    >>> phones while driving. Anyone want to mention specific localities?
    >>> Casey
    >> It's illegal in France, and the fine is ?90 so I'd be careful.
    >> -Alex Tievsky
    > And in the UK, use of a mobile phone in a car, even stationary (e.g at
    > traffic lights), without a hands-free kit will be illegal from November (I
    > think). Fixed penalty of £60 and 3 points on your licence.

In Austria too, only "hands-free" are allowed - but it doesn't stop anyone
as the police never stop anyone for that sort of thing. Having a non
type-approved wing mirror or fog-lights fitted perhaps.

--
Tim.

If the human brain were simple enough that we could understand it, we would
be so simple that we couldn't.