Jeff North

On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 13:20:00 GMT, in alt.politics.homosexuality
[email protected]
<[email protected]> wrote:

    >| Call me a prude but, ANYONE getting it on in a hugely public place and in
    >| front of a captive audience has no respect for anyone, including themselves.
    >| Obviously their parents had no manners, either...and all before them!

So you don't show any form of affection, in public, to your partner?
---------------------------------------------------------------
[email protected] : Remove your pants to reply
---------------------------------------------------------------

No One

<bibon@râlant.org> writes:

    > On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 19:07:58 GMT, No One <[email protected]>
    > wrote:
    >
    > ><bibon@râlant.org> writes:
    > >
    > >> On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 23:28:40 GMT, mrtravel <[email protected]>
    > >> wrote:
    > >>
    > >> >Mxsmanic wrote:
    > >> >> No gAAys on AA writes:
    > >> >
    > >> >The FA's involved were female. Witnesses on the plane have backed up the
    > >> >lover's story.
    > >>
    > >> But the "witnesses" were queer too. That, of course, calls their
    > >> impartiality in this issue into question...don't you agree?
    > >
    > >Prove that the witnesses were gay - since gays make up 3 to 5
    > >percent of the population, the probability that all the witnesses
    > >were gay is small.
    >
    > Since homosexuals make up 3 to 5 percent of the population, prove that
    > they weren't.

See W. Feller, "An introduction to probability theory and its applications".

Dave Frightens Me

On Mon, 25 Sep 2006 05:36:43 GMT, No One <[email protected]>
wrote:

    ><bibon@r�lant.org> writes:
    >> On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 19:07:58 GMT, No One <[email protected]>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >> ><bibon@r�lant.org> writes:
    >> >
    >> >> On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 23:28:40 GMT, mrtravel <[email protected]>
    >> >> wrote:
    >> >>
    >> >> >Mxsmanic wrote:
    >> >> >> No gAAys on AA writes:
    >> >> >
    >> >> >The FA's involved were female. Witnesses on the plane have backed up the
    >> >> >lover's story.
    >> >>
    >> >> But the "witnesses" were queer too. That, of course, calls their
    >> >> impartiality in this issue into question...don't you agree?
    >> >
    >> >Prove that the witnesses were gay - since gays make up 3 to 5
    >> >percent of the population, the probability that all the witnesses
    >> >were gay is small.
    >>
    >> Since homosexuals make up 3 to 5 percent of the population, prove that
    >> they weren't.
    >See W. Feller, "An introduction to probability theory and its applications".

http://www.google.com/ proves otherwise.
--
---
DFM - http://www.deepfriedmars.com
---
--

Lab~Rat >:-)

On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 13:20:00 GMT, [email protected] puked:

    >Call me a prude but, ANYONE getting it on in a hugely public place and in
    >front of a captive audience has no respect for anyone, including themselves.
    > Obviously their parents had no manners, either...and all before them!
    >Argyle

This is clearly an issue of respect for others. Ironically, the gays
that are arguing in this thread in all likelihood argue in other
venues that gays deserve respect.


--
lab~rat >:-)
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Lab~Rat >:-)

On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 22:42:48 GMT, <bibon@r�lant.org> puked:

    >On Sun, 24 Sep 2006 19:07:58 GMT, No One <[email protected]>
    >wrote:
    >><bibon@r�lant.org> writes:
    >>> On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 23:28:40 GMT, mrtravel <[email protected]>
    >>> wrote:
    >>>
    >>> >Mxsmanic wrote:
    >>> >> No gAAys on AA writes:
    >>> >
    >>> >The FA's involved were female. Witnesses on the plane have backed up the
    >>> >lover's story.
    >>>
    >>> But the "witnesses" were queer too. That, of course, calls their
    >>> impartiality in this issue into question...don't you agree?
    >>Prove that the witnesses were gay - since gays make up 3 to 5
    >>percent of the population, the probability that all the witnesses
    >>were gay is small.
    >Since homosexuals make up 3 to 5 percent of the population, prove that
    >they weren't.

They were traveling together?
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Lab~Rat >:-)

On Sat, 23 Sep 2006 16:37:49 GMT, Strife767 <[email protected]>
puked:

    >On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 00:48:14 -0400, IranianSwine <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> [email protected] wrote:
    >>> What amazes me is that if the airlines had "strict" policies on overt
    >>> affection, every plane would be diverted.
    >>> Heterosexual couple do the same things but it is "OK" ,when a gay
    >>> couple does it its "wrong"?!
    >>> On many a flight I have taken, there have been many female
    >>> couples,(whether gay or straight, I dont know) who seem to be in
    >>> compromising positions yet its over looked.
    >> Of course it is wrong for a couple of fags to get into foreplay on an
    >> airplane. Children could see that and grow up believing the whole world
    >> is ****ing nuts. If fudge packers get in your face, they should get
    >> slapped silly.
    >And do you feel exactly the same way about a hetero couple doing the exact
    >same thing?

If someone objects to the heterosexual couple, they should stop as
well. It's called respect for others and common sense. Something
that wasn't exhibited in this whole episode.
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Lab~Rat >:-)

On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 22:12:59 GMT, Jeff North <[email protected]>
puked:

    >On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 13:06:00 GMT, in alt.politics.homosexuality
    >"lab~rat >:-)" <[email protected]>
    ><[email protected]> wrote:
    >>| On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 12:47:11 GMT, Jeff North <[email protected]>
    >>| puked:
    >>|
    >>| >On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 09:29:59 GMT, in alt.politics.homosexuality
    >>| >"Gooserider" <[email protected]>
    >>| ><[email protected]> wrote:
    >>| >
    >>| >>|
    >>| >>| <[email protected]> wrote in message
    >>| >>| news:[email protected] oups.com...
    >>| >>| > What amazes me is that if the airlines had "strict" policies on overt
    >>| >>| > affection, every plane would be diverted.
    >>| >>| > Heterosexual couple do the same things but it is "OK" ,when a gay
    >>| >>| > couple does it its "wrong"?!
    >>| >>| > On many a flight I have taken, there have been many female
    >>| >>| > couples,(whether gay or straight, I dont know) who seem to be in
    >>| >>| > compromising positions yet its over looked.
    >>| >>|
    >>| >>| That's because heterosexual affection is normal. I would not want to have to
    >>| >>| explain to my 8 year old why those two men were making out. Tolerance and
    >>| >>| acceptance are two different things, you know.
    >>| >
    >>| >But you'd have no problem if it were two women making out!
    >>|
    >>| I would if my kids were sitting next to me.
    >Love the caveat....and if your kids were NOT sitting next to you?

Two men making out probably wouldn't bother me if my kids weren't
there. But even if someone else's kids were there it WOULD bother me.

Like I said:

    >>| There is a time and a place for everything.
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Lab~Rat >:-)

On 22 Sep 2006 18:08:15 GMT, curtsybear <[email protected]>
puked:

    >["Followup-To:" header set to alt.politics.homosexuality.]

Header returned, chickenshit.

    >On 2006-09-22, lab~rat >:-) <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> On 21 Sep 2006 12:39:30 -0700, [email protected] puked:
    >>>What amazes me is that if the airlines had "strict" policies on overt
    >>>affection, every plane would be diverted.
    >>>Heterosexual couple do the same things but it is "OK" ,when a gay
    >>>couple does it its "wrong"?!
    >> My guess is that if someone complained about the normal couple, they
    >> would be asked to stop as well. Do you disagree with me?
    >I'll try it on my next flight. Every five minutes I'll ring the
    >call and when the FA comes over, I'll complain about some opposite-sex
    >couple who is sharing their pretzels or sitting too close or doesn't
    >have the armrest down to separate them. Perhaps I'll just complain
    >loudly about a fat woman and say that I don't need to keep seeing
    >pregnant women shoving their sex lives in everyone's faces and could
    >she be covered up with a blanket for the duration of the flight or
    >something.

Of course that isn't the same thing as making out. Maybe what you're
doing here is demonstrating EXACTLY the reason that gays perceive
themselves as discriminated against, they go over the top to make
asses out of themselves for some real or imagined problem, then when
people ask them why they are getting so out of control and over
reacting, they cry discrimination.

If I were asked to knock it off under the same circumstance but with
my wife, I would have been a decent human being and complied. Unlike
the two individuals in this instance...
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Lab~Rat >:-)

On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 11:53:10 -0500, Alan Moorman <[email protected]>
puked:

    >On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 20:58:04 GMT, "Wull" <[email protected]>
    >wrote:
    >>What a bunch of crap. I thought the scenario was that what people do in the
    >>privacy of their own home (uncontested) is what gay people desire. I agree
    >>with that 100%. Doing anything in poor taste out in public by any couples
    >>should be frowned upon. I don't think anyone alive would object to private
    >>affairs, except maybe a few religious fanatics.
    >>Wull--who is very old fashioned.
    >I agree that it might have been in bad taste.
    >But, can you EVER expect the cabin crew to come talk to a hetero
    >couple for kissing a bit? I've been on flights where that happened
    >a lot, and non of the crew even blinked an eye.
    >So, there is NO justification for what went on regarding the two men.
    >NONE.

If one person was made uncomfortable by the unnecessary action it was
justified enough. As would be the same if the couple were
heterosexual...
--
lab~rat >:-)
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Lab~Rat >:-)

On Sat, 23 Sep 2006 16:48:15 GMT, Strife767 <[email protected]>
puked:

    >On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 08:39:04 -0400, lab~rat >:-) <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> And that hasn't been proven. If there was a heterosexual couple on
    >> the same flight doing the same thing and they weren't asked to stop,
    >> MAYBE then there would be some argument.
    >> Bottom line is that if a heterosexual couple were asked to stop,
    >> chances are more than good that it wouldn't have escalated into some
    >> type of psuedo-Rosa Parks like discrimination crusade. They would
    >> have quietly stopped, end of story, no one hurt.
    >I see "if" a lot up there. Of course, since no one ever complains about a
    >hetero couple doing that kind of thing, you'd never know, would you? Just
    >that fact alone (the lack of complaint against heterosexuals) says a lot.

That is an outright lie and there have been instances where people
have been detained for trying to join the mile high club in the
aircraft lavs.
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Lab~Rat >:-)

On 23 Sep 2006 11:10:18 -0700, [email protected] puked:

    >[email protected] wrote:
    >> To the great majority of the world 2 homosexuals engaging in anything
    >> other than light chit-chat is going to bring some negative attention.
    >> Rightly so, if it is NOT the norm, then it is to be expected that it
    >> will not be treated as normal.
    >> I am not understanding how this turns into something about how gays
    >> should be treated equal and how they were mistreated and blah, blah...
    >> Heck, we don't treat a lot of people equal, so why start with
    >> homosexuals?
    >**** you, bitch or asshole. You would love to be treated horribly too,
    >wouldn't you? Do not ****ing complain when you get treated unfairly.
    >Kapish, asshole? Once again, this is America, jack. Like I told the
    >other asshole (labrat), if you find even the lightest homosexual PDA
    >offensive, turn the cheek. Who the **** do you think you are to judge
    >what is "norm?"
    >[snipping the rest of it's bullshit nonsense. blah blah blah]
    >Bill Hewlett

I guess differing opinions aren't tolerated in your world. Who's to
say that I have any obligation to tolerate people making out in an
airplane?
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Lab~Rat >:-)

On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 16:17:49 GMT, mrtravel <[email protected]>
puked:

    >lab~rat >:-) wrote:
    >> There is a possibility that another passenger complained. If that
    >> were the case, what do you think that the flight attendant was
    >> obligated to do?
    >Nothing. Not all complaints are valid

So your contention is that it was a judgment call as to whether or not
it was valid? In your opinion, are you more adept at using your
judgment than others?
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Lab~Rat >:-)

On 22 Sep 2006 07:44:46 -0700, [email protected] puked:

    >lab~rat >:-) wrote:
    >> On 22 Sep 2006 05:22:52 -0700, [email protected] puked:
    >> I don't know what the **** PDA is
    >Public Display of Affection
    >>, but if I were asked politely to
    >> knock it off, I would. I'm an adult and I know how to conduct myself
    >> in public.
    >Yeah, you would obey to everything somebody complains about, wouldn't
    >you.? That's your weakness, not mine. This is America, jack. Everyday,
    >you see "normal" people displaying light PDA. They are adults too.
    >There is nothing wrong that. However, if several people complained
    >about a certain couple over there going at it over the edge, yes, by
    >all means, show some common courtesy and stop it.

Well, in reality it was a tran-continental flight. In addition, since
this is America, I have the right and social obligation to contest
what infringes on my perceived life, liberty and pursuit of happiness.
If your actions interfere with those, we have an issue.

If your homosexual tryst spills out into public and the view of my
children, I have a right to object. If you want to cry unfair, do so,
just like the people in this story did.

Who the **** do you think you are to step on MY rights?

    >You obviously feel uncomfortable showing even light PDA. By all means,
    >that's fine for you. However, don't tell others it's wrong if it's only
    >a light peck on the cheek or even a simple kiss on the mouth. If it
    >offends you, turn the cheek.

If you want to be accepted, the first step would be to not offend
people. And not making a public issue ON A PLANE FLIGHT would be a
good way to start, boxcutter...
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Lab~Rat >:-)

On Sat, 23 Sep 2006 16:51:24 GMT, Strife767 <[email protected]>
puked:

    >On Fri, 22 Sep 2006 07:55:24 -0400, lab~rat >:-) <[email protected]> wrote:
    >> On Thu, 21 Sep 2006 17:48:48 +0000, No gAAys on AA <[email protected]>
    >> puked:
    >>> http://www.advocate.com/news_detail_ektid36619.asp
    >>> September 20, 2006
    >>> American Airlines rebukes gay couple
    >>> An American Airlines captain reportedly threatened to divert a flight
    >>> from Paris to New York after a gay couple complained about how they
    >>> were treated by the flight crew, The New Yorker reported on Monday.
    >>> According to a "Talk of the Town" item in the magazine's September 25
    >>> issue, now posted on its Web site, TV journalist George Tsikhiseli and
    >>> his boyfriend of four months, writer Stephan Varnier, were told by a
    >>> stewardess to stop their "touching and the kissing" not long into
    >>> American Airlines Flight 45 from Charles de Gaulle to JFK on August
    >>> 22. The couple said they were doing nothing inappropriate�perhaps a
    >>> peck on the cheek, a head on the other's shoulder�a story backed up by
    >>> the two passengers seated behind them and another across the aisle.
    >>> When they asked to see the purser�whom the stewardess claimed had
    >>> issued the order�the purser said she knew nothing about the incident
    >>> and initially agreed that their behavior had not been inappropriate,
    >>> the men and witnesses reported. But she returned later to say that
    >>> other passengers had complained about the men's affectionate gestures.
    >>> When the gay couple asked who had complained, asked to speak with an
    >>> American Airlines representative upon landing, and asked for the
    >>> stewardess's name and employee number, the purser told them to drop
    >>> the matter or the flight would be diverted, the magazine reported.
    >>> An hour later, the purser asked Tsikhiseli to meet the captain in a
    >>> galley, and the captain repeated the threat to divert the airplane if
    >>> the men continued to "argue" with the crew, according to The New
    >>> Yorker.
    >>> A spokesman for the airline backed up the flight crew's behavior and
    >>> said their complaints to the men had nothing to do with the fact that
    >>> they were a gay couple. "Our understanding is that the level of
    >>> affection was more than a quick peck on the cheek,� he told the
    >>> magazine.
    >> Just curious, if it were a normal couple, do you think the couple
    >> would have a hissy fit like this?
    >The day someone goes out of their way to complain about a hetero couple
    >doing such a thing, I'll listen to this argument.

In my past, I have had it happen to me. Surprise! Guess what my
reaction was?

    >> This is exactly why gays think they're victims, they create the
    >> situation themselves. If I were doing the same with my wife on a plane
    >> and the stewardess commented on it, I would think that my actions were
    >> making someone else feel uncomfortable AND I'D SHOW SOME FREAKING
    >> CONSIDERATION FOR OTHERS AROUND ME.
    >But no one complains about hetero couples doing the same stuff these guys
    >got so much shit for.
    >> But no, it's a big deal because
    >no one complains when heteros do it.

Try being straight and learning what you are talking about instead of
just pretending to be straight, you closet case.
--
lab~rat >:-)
Do you want polite or do you want sincere?

Curtsybear

["Followup-To:" header set to alt.politics.homosexuality.]
On 2006-09-25, lab~rat >:-) <[email protected]> wrote:
    > On 22 Sep 2006 18:08:15 GMT, curtsybear <[email protected]>
    > puked:
    > Of course that isn't the same thing as making out. Maybe what you're
    > doing here is demonstrating EXACTLY the reason that gays perceive
    > themselves as discriminated against, they go over the top to make
    > asses out of themselves for some real or imagined problem, then when
    > people ask them why they are getting so out of control and over
    > reacting, they cry discrimination.

When my actions are judged by someone else, then it is required
that this other person have a universal capability to judge my
actions. Unfortunately, there's a significant section of the
homophobe population which cannot equally judge opposite-gender
activity on a level with same-gender activity. If I wanted to
overjudge other people, much like many homophobes do, I could act
just a heterophobic as I explained and see what the Flight Attendant's
reaction would be. I just think that a homophobe on a plane (OOH,
now that's a great sequel for Samuel L Jackson -- _HOMOPHOBES_ON_A_PLANE_,
heh) would get immense sympathy from a lot of posters around here,
but the equal actions of someone pretending to be a heterophobe
would not. So I went there.

    > If I were asked to knock it off under the same circumstance but with
    > my wife, I would have been a decent human being and complied. Unlike
    > the two individuals in this instance...

As usual in life, this may have been nothing more than calling each
other "honey" and "snugglepuss" and a couple of pecks on the cheek.
You make it sound like they were performing live sex acts in the
aisle. It very well could have been anything in the spectrum.

The complaint could have been anything from a devout phobe being
splintered-log-up-the-butt about something which would be quite
innocent, all the way to some seatgrope under the blanket during
the flight. In any case, at the "innocent" end of the spectrum,
I'd expect the FA to wince and explain the entire history of personal
rights to the complaining grouse, no matter what the gender of the
participants -- which is reported to have happened by at least ONE
of the flight crew. At the other end of the spectrum, I don't
expect there'd be any difference in the genders of the participants.
Because of this, I really don't think it to be along the level of
anything which was actually untoward (until I read differently, of
course).

--
"I've always said you can lead a gift horse to water but you can't
always look it in the mouth." -- Lurlean Tucker's follow-up to her
other favorite saying about trying to teach an old dog to make a
silk purse using a stitch in time.