Creative Yogi

Hi, be great if anyone could help me with this please. I'm sure it's all been covered before, but struggling to find concise info. I've recently moved here (to just North of Lagos, from the UK), and the situation is that I'm intending to work self employed as an acupuncturist and yoga teacher (as soon as i'm legally able) and may also be doing some employed work too. The employed work is not the immediate priority, but it's an option - and I may also be able to work for this same employer on a self employed basis.

On top of this I also still have some very small earnings, less than £100p/w being accrued, from a business interest, back in the U.K. This may fluctuate up and down slightly. If this becomes too complex in the bigger picture, I could also shut down the U.K earnings all together.

- I'm extremely confused about the initial permit I need to have and the time frame in which I need to apply for it. From What I understand I have 90 days where I don't need a permit at all - but would I then be able to still work self employed during this time if I have a fiscal number and social security number?

Or does the fact I'm here and actively seeking work mean I have to get a permit straight away?

I'm also confused about the various types of permit, and their translation:

I visited the SEF website and read the following

REGISTRATION CERTIFICATE FOR CITIZENS OF THE EU/EEA/SWITZERLAND Certificado de Registo para cidadão da UE

"The Registration Certificate is the document that formalizes the right of residence in Portugal and must be applied for by any EU/EEA/Switzerland citizen that remains in Portugal for a period exceeding three months. If the period of stay is inferior to three months it only mandatory to hold a valid Identity Card or Passport"

But on Angloinfo Forum it says the following I need to work here Self Employed:

A Residency Card (Cartão de Residência) issued by the Portuguese Immigration Service or SEF (Serviços de Estrangeiros e Fronteiras)

And then on a subsequent page on the same website it says:

Authorisation for Residence and Residence Permits The residence card (Autorização de Residência) is necessary for anyone who moves to Portugal, or for anyone who is planning to stay for longer than six months. This includes those who work, the self-employed, students, those intending to live off savings, retired people and family members of any of the above.

So i'm confused - what do I need to apply for:
A registration certificate for citizens of the EU OR a Residency Card (Cartao de Residencia) OR The Residence Card (Autorizacao de Residencia) Or are they all the same thing?!

What has confused the issue greatly is the interaction i've had with the various Portuguese authorities so far.

On Monday I called SEF and asked them the procedure, given the fact I wish to work here self employed: The lady originally told me I have to go to Portimao City Hall. She then changed her mind and told me the following:

1) I need to go to the local Junta da Freguesia to get a declaration of residence - basically take someone with me where I am living to declare I have a permanent address and somewhere to stay.
2) I then need to go to the local Social Security to get a social security number
3) I then need to go to Finances to get the Fiscal number.

THIS IS WHAT HAPPENED IN REALITY

1) I went to the local Junta da Freguesia (in Bensafrim) and the lady there told me to go to Camara in Lagos. I went to Camara in Lagos and the receptionist told me I have to book an appt to for a residency card (scheduled for next Monday) She couldn't understand English, I can't talk Portuguese and i'm not sure what type of appt for which residency card she made for me, but I've a feeling it's for a permanent one, and not just the eu citizen registration that I think I need (see above)

2) Not satisfied with the above, since I'd made no inroads into getting the declaration of the address, fiscal number or social security number, I went to the Junta Da Freguesia in Lagos as it was close. There the lady told me she can't give me the declaration of address until I have a Fiscal number and Social Security number.

3) So I then went to Finances and got a Fiscal number, good! I was told to then go to Social Security.

4) I went to Social Security where they wouldn't issue me a social security number since I need to have a 'certificate' or 'evidence of activity' (which I assume means that I've started self employed work) which is issued from Finances.

I then ran out of time. So at the moment I have an appt for some kind of permit scheduled on Monday (my bad, I should really know which one but if you read above it's all a bit confused and I couldn't understand her) I have no Social Security number - as no evidence of 'activity' and no declaration of address, which I believe I need.

To further muddy the waters about what permit I need, the SEF site also seems to indicate I need a quite specific residence permit for self employment... Please see this link: entitled "Residence permit for Self-employed workers" or is this one of the same resident permits as outlined above?
Autorização de residência para exercício de atividade profissional independente

Social Security Query:

Also - moving forward slightly, once I have a social security number, what happens if I have either a substantial period of time when I don't work or have no income - do I still have to make the monthly payments, or can I pause them? And what happens should I return to the UK?

Any help most gratefully received! Rich

Red Eric

Hi Rich - Welcome to the forum and the wonderful world of dealing with formalities in a language you're not yet fluent in! Quite a lot there but perhaps I can help you with one or two explanations, if nothing else.

The registration process for EU citizens is (or should be!) very straightforward and is done at the Câmara Municipal in your area of residence. There is only one type initially - a certificate, rather than a card, which has a validity of 5 years. The Câmaras are not authorised to issue residence permits for non-EU citizens, so you will be issued with the correct one. Documents required listed on the SEF website are passport and a declaration of honour that you are working or self-employed in Portugal (or that you have sufficient means and are covered either by the Health Service or a health insurance policy) but the Câmara may ask for more, including perhaps an atestado from your Junta de Freguesia saying where you live (and for a Junta atestado, a Social Security number is not required). If you have a rental contract or own a property, it'd be worth taking those documents along. There have been posters on here before who've said they had to provide proof of income rather than just an unsubstantiated declaration, which is what the SEF website says you need. Best to wait and see if they ask for anything other than what you're able to provide initially.

You shouldn't need a Social Security number for the residence registration. They may ask for the Fiscal Number (NIF), esp as there's a small fee to pay (15€), so it's good you've got that.

I don't know much about self-employment here but as far as I'm aware you'll only have to register an "activity" at Finanças - other than that, as an EU citizen, you don't need any special visa or permit that I'm aware of (the one you link to appears to be for third country nationals only).

Hope this helps for the time being - the initial settling-in and associated paperwork can be a bit frustrating but I think you're doing fine so far

cedricp

On the self-employment front, it is relatively straightforward once you have the Residency certificate and fiscal number.

Go to your local finanças, take those documents plus a passport and request to register to start your activity. Each profession here has a classification code and the clerk will probably take you through a long list. You can find it online so you could find your classification ahead of time and make the process a little bit smoother

They will ask you to estimate your gross earnings to put on the form. Self-employed workers are granted an exemption from social security payments for at least a year so don't worry about that for now. When you register for self-employment, finanças will send your details to the SS office anyway and they will eventually contact you (after a year).

The only thing left to do after that is purchase workers insurance. This is a legal requirement for all self-employed here and the cost of it is based on that estimated gross amount you gave and the classification. Any insurance company will be able to supply this for you.

By the way, I came here with a Portuguese wife and we were sent back and forth between offices with contradictory advice even though we could communicate perfectly, so don't feel bad about that. I'm sure this ridiculous dance they inflict on you is an unwritten initiation rite for all foreigners.

Red Eric

It's very well-meant - they just like you to get to know as many as possible of your local public functionaries in person

Creative Yogi

Thanks for this great info, made some inroads today as got the atestado residencia form, just need to find a another person here on the electoral role to sign it! I'm feeling bit better about it all today, and hopefully on Monday I'll get the Camara side of things sorted and then onto the self-employed side of things!

captainflack

I registered in Cascais couple of years ago when I came over. I am self employed (software development, generally paid from my UK company).

From what I recall, first step was the Fiscal number.

Next can't remember whether I set up a bank account or went to the Camera to register and get my EU residency doc. It's basically a one page A4 sheet with my details and a big EU flag in the background on it. I seem to recall we needed some kind of health option at the bank, though I am dubious about this and have a feeling they might have been upselling us.

Registering for social security / health came later from what I recall.

My wife is from Brazil so it made the language side of things a bit easier. You should not need any special permits as an EU citizen, just residency as self employed and you're good to go.

I didn't need any trip to the SEF office, my wife did because she's Brazilian, so we needed to get her the residency card for family member of an EU citizen.