GeniB

This is a very worrying development. A Dutch woman who has lived in the UK for over 24 yrs and has two British born kids with her British husband,has been told she must make arrangements to leave the country... Why?

She foolishly? applied for citizenship ! By the time the 84 page document arrived she was travelling back and forth to the Netherlands on family matters after her father died. She could not therefore surrender her passport as requested by the home office. They deemed this reason enough to demand that she leave the country.!! Her complaint about this treatment was sent back with 'no reason to complain stamped on it

It looks like the home office is applying it's own rules before article 50 has been signed. The woman is an EU citizen married to another EU citizen. I hope this does not cause a retaliation . We could have problems if it does

macliam

This is just an example of the ridiculous, faceless, monstrosity that British "Public Service" has become. No way to speak with anyone and automated, linear processes that allow no deviance. Even if an applicant for UK citizenship failed the process, as an EU citizen they still have a right to live in the UK so the "Prepare to leave" notice is incorrect.

This could be interesting for the many Irish long-term residents in the UK, if a hard Brexit meant the imposition of a hard border to the Republic and the end of the Common Travel Area. So, tens of thousands of people in limbo due to a Whitehall farce!

mfesharne

Yet another example of hysterical media/remoaner hyperbole & BS. (Almost verging on 'fake news')

If you actually spend just a few minutes researching the story there's more to it such as the home office statement of " her application was rejected because she failed to submit an original ID and that it had also launched an express passport check-in service in 58 councils, including one 10 miles from her home in the London borough of Sutton"

And further stating: ""The rights of EU nationals living in the UK remain unchanged while we are a member of the European Union. EU nationals do not require any additional documents to prove their status"

mikelincs

As has been stated in another thread, the application was turned dowm for failure to provide the correct documents, nothing to do with Brexit, as it would happen to anyone not providing the correct documentation, she has now reapplied WITH the correct documentation, so teacup all calm again.

macliam

Hmmm, interesting responses.

Firstly, mfesharne, this story is reported in the Daily Mail, Daily Express and Evening Standard amongst others - hardly "remoaner" journals, although your use of that word declares the camp you're in. On the other hand, I have seen no retraction of the story, so perhaps mikelincs or someone can provide a link to show how the Home Office have altered their stance, apologised for the misunderstanding and confirmed her permanent right to reside?

Secondly, I was not aware that there were local facilities to check foreign nationality, or what they do, or how it works - were you? I suspect that an educated woman (and the German national also quoted) would have taken advantage of these had they known abut them and if they soved the problem. So were they actually informed of this service before rejection?

Thirdly, no resolution was possible before the intervention of her MP as she was unable to contact anyone to speak about the issue - so how has that been resolved? Also, why was her reason for not including her documentation (as allowed for in the application) rejected and the certified copy of her documents from her solicitor ignored without explanation?

And lastly - since, as an EAA citizen, she has the right to reside and as the spouse and mother of UK nationals she can apply for a residence card, why was she sent a letter saying “As you appear to have no alternative basis of stay in the United Kingdom you should now make arrangements to leave,”??

Or is joined-up thinking too much to expect?

Ukkram

They say that the EU regulations still apply. I don't think so. We were nearly turned back at Bristol airport because my South African wife did not have a visa and when we showed them her Portugal ResidentiaI Card the guy said the UK is not a member of the Schengen Area so it does not apply.

mfesharne

The story has been reported by endless media including Sky news but it's her not the media that is the remoaner....... as I see it, she just wants to whine but the truth is she should have submitted proper ID as required for the application and had she done so, the application would have been processed to her satisfaction.

The fact that her application was refused is her own fault.

mfesharne

The EU rules do still apply & the UK is indeed not a member of the Schengen Area.

Naaling

So the fact that her father was Ill and dying in Holland isn't relevant!

Please give us the benefit of your obviously vast intellect and wisdom and tell us what she should have done?

mfesharne

No. The fact that her Father was dying was not relevant to the application....... If you research the story all she had to do was fill in the forms & supply the requested documents including original ID......... The simple fact is by failing to supply some of the specified documents (specifically her passport) she failed to supply the specified documents.

Therefore they had no choice but to refuse the application because it was incomplete.

As with any application to any government anywhere in the world an incomplete application for anything would be expected to be refused.

What she should have done is either delayed her application until she no longer needed her passport or asked what other original ID might be acceptable & then supplied that as an alternative.

DaveLovesDee

She gave a certified copy of her passport with an explanation, and would have produced the passport as required when requested. I understand this to be an acceptable alternative.

It wasn't just the rejection of the application though. The instruction to leave the UK was also clearly wrong.

Correct, not every member of the EU is a Schengen area member, but a an EU member state Residence Card is valid to enter all EU and EEA member states, not just Schengen ones.

This includes using a Portuguese RC to enter the UK.

EMR

If the person in question is still a citizen of South Africa with a South African passport , UK immigration rules would still be applied..

Naaling

Ok then explain this.
She is an EU citizen who has been living in England for 24 years. She is married to a British citizen and has 2 British children. There is no way, short of committing a major crime, that she can ever be required to leave Britain. (even after Brexit - if it ever happens!). So why was she told to make arragements to leave?
Are we to believe that the public servants in The Home Office are that ignorant of the Laws that they employed to administer? There is no excuse for it! Either they have total disregard for the law, or they are incompetant.
If you really believe that this is an honest mistake that has now been corrected, then I can only assume that you haven't had to deal with the immigration section of the Home Office recently, like I have.

mfesharne

I'm not sure if that's correct or not however one would expect any reasonable applicant to check the facts before setting off.......... but without meaning to be disrespectful to UKRam, his track record on that front isn't exactly stellar.......... I seem to remember he even bought his tickets to fly from RSA to PT before he checked the visa requirements for his wife & almost had to cancel his flights because of it.

No matter where you go, what you do or who you are, it's imperative to do your research thoroughly & to ensure you have all the paperwork correct before taking action.

In the case of the Dutch lady had she supplied the correct documents she wouldn't have had a problem & the reason she did have the problems is because she stuffed up.

Therefore she only has herself to blame

DaveLovesDee

It depends on whether the Portuguese RC was issued as an Article 10 RC.

If the South African was residing in Portugal with an EU national, and had a Portuguese Article 10 Residence Card (which is valid to enter any other EU country for up to 90 days under the McCarthy ruling), then they should have been allowed entry.