Expat Kiwi

I'm not saying kids suffer, I'm saying they benefit from a feeling of connectedness and one shouldn't underestimate the importance of that.

Kids adapt yes, but would your kids adapt better if they felt part of the community? only you know the answer to that.

waikatoguy

Perhaps if you lived in NZ you would appreciate how much the British kids are mingling and feeling part of the community. You see and hear Brit kids (and expats of other nationalities as well) on the TV all the time joining in community stuff (or am I just imagining it?). I know there are Brit kids around here who have as much pride in their school and town as NZ born kids.
I do understand where the original poster is coming from though. If you're a close family it much surely be a big factor. Good luck on your move back.

Expat Kiwi

I just wanted to clarify what I meant by community and sense of connectedness: having whanau, that's very important in New Zealand and great store is placed on the extended family unit in the upbringing of a child, it is the web that holds the community together and prevents youngsters from drifting.

simonsi

What you suggest is doubtless "very important" to some parts of the population, it isn't something that just starts at the airport arrivals gate though and is probably much less prevalent (by definition), amongst expats who arrive without extended familes. Equally those expats without extended families here will find they have much in common with those already here without extended families as expats make up such a large proportion of the population.

Equally if certain parts of the population are outside that "thing" then they are outside it, irrespective of country of residence/origin I suspect.

Expat Kiwi

But people born outside of New Zealand only make up 23% of the population so they're not exactly in the majority in most of the country, although in some areas that are very popular with expats they may outnumber the locals.

Of course one of the great things about being part of an expat community is getting to know people from cultures very different to your own. Under 30% of expats are from Britain, 15% from the Pacific Islands and 15% from NE Asia, I think it's good for children to be exposed to that ethnic mix from an early age as it teaches them tolerance and an understanding that the world is bigger than the town in which they live.

hazeandsteve

The first bike I had put the brakes on when I backpedalled. Then it stopped.

Bo-Jangles

Sure kids do adapt or go with the flow if they don't know any differently. I grew up without extended family nearby and when the world was a much bigger place and people didn't travel so much. It hardly ever affected me as a kid, except hugely aware at Easter and Christmas I didn't have as many things as all my friends who had Aunties and Grannies to provide.

I talk to my own Mum about this a lot as it's now much later in life, I feel it. I missed out on a great deal of family stuff and it saddens me greatly that I never 'knew' my Grandparents save for an annual visit. I never had those connections with Aunties, Uncles and Cousins and I know so little of the family history and old family stories.

There is no accounting for the long-term impressions and life experiences that kids pick up on. I have some Cousins that came every year to stay with us for summer holidays and at the time to me it was no big deal but for my Cuzzies it was the greatest adventure ever. They wax lyrical and remember every minute detail of the fun and thoroughly exciting times they had away from their own parents. I love that we helped to create those lovely memories for them.

If I could choose to rearrange some bits of my life and make some corrections it certainly would include a much closer relationship with my Grandparents.

Bo-Jangles

I also feel that I now miss out now on seeing my own mother in a different phase of her life, being the Granny to my Nephews and Nieces.

simonsi

TBH outside the extended Maori community I see "having whanau" as no more or less important than elsewhere in the world, I don't see it as a NZ or NZ-wide "thing" especially.

Absolutely!

Expat Kiwi

Well of course you would say that since you are living in a predominantly expat community, where the kids benefit from mixing with a multi-ethnic peer group but miss out on having extended family around them.

If, for instance, you were living somewhere else in New Zealand where expats weren't congregated together in such a high density you'd probably get what I mean about whanau and know how highly that interconnectedness features in New Zealand society.

It's a bit like those old British villages where you have to have 3 generations of family in the local graveyard before you're no longer considered to be a newcomer

simonsi

They miss out on extended family because we are half-way around the world from said family by choice, not because I life in a highly expat area.

...and all life is a compromise, benefit in one area, miss out in another, you must have found that in your move(s) - unless your whanau all moved with you?

phyns

Expat Kiwi, you need to accept that some thrive with extended family around them, others want to get as far away as possible and the rest in between.

Doesn't make any right or wrong. We are all different.

PS I can only assume you are lucky enough to have your extended family near you in OZ.

Expat Kiwi

Freudian slip there phyns?

I'm not passing judgement here, I'm supporting the OP and agreeing with her when she says that family support is important. It's as good a reason as any for moving back and one that isn't going to change just because she gets NZ citizenship.

It's also one of the most frequently cited reasons for returning that one sees on this forum, which makes me wonder if people underestimate the pull of family when they emigrate: it's a big chunk of your life to give up.

phyns

Opps. "Thrive"

Fair reply.

Bellasmum

Each to their own of course but is one year such a big chunk of ones life, or does it mean giving your children options in their adulthood ? No one else can decide that for others.

I have lived in five countries outside of NZ and I saw that time as experiences that some people are not lucky enough to have.

I also understand and experienced the pull of family.

I also know a lot of people who have in hindsight had huge and costly regrets about their reaction to that tug. Just today I had an email from someone who reacted to that pull at a time of emotional distress who is living in limbo with significant regrets.

OP I am sure you will make the right decision for your family and I wish you the best wherever that decision takes you.

But wait there is more ...

The concept of Whanau for Maori is far broader than family and although it is a strong tie it is a different connection to European family.

The huge thing in the Maori world is the huge connection to the land, sea and sky.