Go Back  British Expats > Living & Moving Abroad > Moving back or to the UK
Reload this Page >

Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Old Jan 17th 2011, 7:24 pm
  #1  
Ping-ponger
Thread Starter
 
dunroving's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Dreich Alba
Posts: 11,964
dunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond repute
Default Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Anyone following the news about the government's plans to decentralise control of the NHS? I just can't see GP's wanting to take care of budgets, spending, etc. I know that under Labour, most of the additional NHS spending went on creating additional layers of complex bureacracy, and that definitely needed to be sorted. But from what I read, most doctors feel completely unqualified and unprepared to take on the task.

Also, part of the plan is that individual practices/doctors can contract out services to "private companies" - that seems a recipe for disaster, to me.
dunroving is offline  
Old Jan 17th 2011, 7:53 pm
  #2  
BE Forum Addict
 
Joined: Jul 2008
Location: My happy place
Posts: 3,043
Tr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond reputeTr1boy has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

When it does go down the tubes you can bet the drivers will be on strike
Tr1boy is offline  
Old Jan 17th 2011, 8:29 pm
  #3  
BE Enthusiast
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 378
beachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by dunroving View Post
Anyone following the news about the government's plans to decentralise control of the NHS? I just can't see GP's wanting to take care of budgets, spending, etc. I know that under Labour, most of the additional NHS spending went on creating additional layers of complex bureacracy, and that definitely needed to be sorted. But from what I read, most doctors feel completely unqualified and unprepared to take on the task.

Also, part of the plan is that individual practices/doctors can contract out services to "private companies" - that seems a recipe for disaster, to me.
Oh dear, this isn't good news and I certainly hope it doesn't happen. I agree that cut backs need to be made to the countries spending in an effort to pay down the national debt, but HANDS OFF OUR NHS.

Sort out the Benefits System, stop wasting money on wars that we've no business being involved in and quit spending millions on foreign aid.

When I go back to the UK I'm going to run to be Prime Minister .... I take it I can count on all of your votes
beachgal21 is offline  
Old Jan 17th 2011, 8:34 pm
  #4  
Lost in BE Cyberspace
 
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 41,518
Sally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by beachgal21 View Post
Oh dear, this isn't good news and I certainly hope it doesn't happen. I agree that cut backs need to be made to the countries spending in an effort to pay down the national debt, but HANDS OFF OUR NHS.

Sort out the Benefits System, stop wasting money on wars that we've no business being involved in and quit spending millions on foreign aid.

When I go back to the UK I'm going to run to be Prime Minister .... I take it I can count on all of your votes
You forgot bankers' bonuses and foreign tax havens.

The Conservative Party tried to dismantle the NHS once before, they will definitely try it again.
Sally Redux is offline  
Old Jan 17th 2011, 10:06 pm
  #5  
The Kwisatz Haderach
 
Mummy in the foothills's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: North Wales
Posts: 8,067
Mummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

I've been reading about it on the BBC, I don't think it'll go down the tubes, but there'll be a lot of moaning. I think they should look at culling the management side and getting consultant overtime/bonuses under control first.
Mummy in the foothills is offline  
Old Jan 17th 2011, 10:29 pm
  #6  
Forum Regular
 
Joined: Jul 2009
Location: Toronto
Posts: 220
reeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud ofreeni has much to be proud of
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

It won't happen. The management part of the "change" will cost millions of pounds. GP's do not have the working practices or the man-power to manage this.

But - I can see it being given over to the PCT's with the GP's working with in that operation on a more senior and powerful level.

I worked for one of the First Acute Trusts to get Foundation status - it has always been a "what if?" with the control and power switching to the PCT or GP's

Most of the Acute trusts have foundation status now and are taking private patients anyways - they have for years. The better the Acute Trust is the more GP's will refer to them. It is called Choose and Book - this is for both NHS patients and Private patients. I was part of the initial project group in our trust to implement it.

There is a lot of consultancy used in the NHS especially in IT and Projects - money is being wasted there for sure.

Our trust has been accepting private patients since 2004. These private patients supplement the NHS funds needed to run the hospital and build better services. As a trust we were able to pilot many newer tech services. This small percent of private patients made it possible.

Foundation Trusts was the first small step in decentralizing - it gave acute trusts the ability to make their own plan of growth and change.

It will be interesting to see what happens ... the NHS is too big to remove - and too much of it's own "force" to change drastically.

Reeni
reeni is offline  
Old Jan 17th 2011, 10:36 pm
  #7  
Ping-ponger
Thread Starter
 
dunroving's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Dreich Alba
Posts: 11,964
dunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by reeni View Post
It won't happen. The management part of the "change" will cost millions of pounds. GP's do not have the working practices or the man-power to manage this.

But - I can see it being given over to the PCT's with the GP's working with in that operation on a more senior and powerful level.

I worked for one of the First Acute Trusts to get Foundation status - it has always been a "what if?" with the control and power switching to the PCT or GP's

Most of the Acute trusts have foundation status now and are taking private patients anyways - they have for years. The better the Acute Trust is the more GP's will refer to them. It is called Choose and Book - this is for both NHS patients and Private patients. I was part of the initial project group in our trust to implement it.

There is a lot of consultancy used in the NHS especially in IT and Projects - money is being wasted there for sure.

Our trust has been accepting private patients since 2004. These private patients supplement the NHS funds needed to run the hospital and build better services. As a trust we were able to pilot many newer tech services. This small percent of private patients made it possible.

Foundation Trusts was the first small step in decentralizing - it gave acute trusts the ability to make their own plan of growth and change.

It will be interesting to see what happens ... the NHS is too big to remove - and too much of it's own "force" to change drastically.

Reeni
I agree with your first statement, but the government sounds scarily hell-bent on doing exactly this (putting it directly in the hands of GP's in individual practices). It's been the same mantra in every news program and interview for the past several weeks.

I don't think the NHS is going to disappear/be removed, but I think it could be mightily cocked-up if they insist on carrying out this harebrained plan.

Why are politicians so completely out of touch with people at the coal face?
dunroving is offline  
Old Jan 17th 2011, 11:00 pm
  #8  
The Kwisatz Haderach
 
Mummy in the foothills's Avatar
 
Joined: Aug 2008
Location: North Wales
Posts: 8,067
Mummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond reputeMummy in the foothills has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by dunroving View Post
I agree with your first statement, but the government sounds scarily hell-bent on doing exactly this (putting it directly in the hands of GP's in individual practices). It's been the same mantra in every news program and interview for the past several weeks.

I don't think the NHS is going to disappear/be removed, but I think it could be mightily cocked-up if they insist on carrying out this harebrained plan.

Why are politicians so completely out of touch with people at the coal face?
Cause they all have BUPA so they don't see whats really going on. Same everywhere really.
Mummy in the foothills is offline  
Old Jan 18th 2011, 12:51 am
  #9  
Finally Home!
 
sallysimmons's Avatar
 
Joined: Mar 2010
Location: Used to be New York, now North Yorkshire
Posts: 3,610
sallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond reputesallysimmons has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by Sally Redux View Post
The Conservative Party tried to dismantle the NHS once before, they will definitely try it again.
Yup, this is what people get for electing the conservatives. Or at least, a third of the people did and everyone else got sold down the river by the Lib Dems.

Seriously, why is it a surprise that the Tories are out of touch with the average working person? I thought that was in their job description.

I don't know what Labour did or didn't do, but I do know that my family has needed the NHS a lot in the last few years and the care they've all received has been nothing short of wonderful. I know it doesn't make a good Daly Mail headline, but it's what I experienced.
sallysimmons is offline  
Old Jan 18th 2011, 1:08 am
  #10  
Lost in BE Cyberspace
 
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 41,518
Sally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by sallysimmons View Post
Yup, this is what people get for electing the conservatives. Or at least, a third of the people did and everyone else got sold down the river by the Lib Dems.

Seriously, why is it a surprise that the Tories are out of touch with the average working person? I thought that was in their job description.

I don't know what Labour did or didn't do, but I do know that my family has needed the NHS a lot in the last few years and the care they've all received has been nothing short of wonderful. I know it doesn't make a good Daly Mail headline, but it's what I experienced.
Being cynical, I think the NHS in its current format doesn't offer enough opportunity for profit as far as Tories are concerned. Think about the railways and the profits shareholders are now reaping while still taking government subsidies.

My family over there have also used the NHS a lot lately and the service has also been amazingly good.
Sally Redux is offline  
Old Jan 18th 2011, 1:52 am
  #11  
BE Enthusiast
 
Joined: Jun 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 378
beachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond reputebeachgal21 has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by Sally Redux View Post
Being cynical, I think the NHS in its current format doesn't offer enough opportunity for profit as far as Tories are concerned. Think about the railways and the profits shareholders are now reaping while still taking government subsidies.

My family over there have also used the NHS a lot lately and the service has also been amazingly good.
The NHS is amazingly good, thats why it's lasted as long as it has. In the 40 years that I lived in the UK I never heard any bad reports from my friends, family or anyone else I knew. I know there have been people that have had bad experiences with the NHS, but they are far out numbered by the people that haven't.
beachgal21 is offline  
Old Jan 18th 2011, 9:57 am
  #12  
Ping-ponger
Thread Starter
 
dunroving's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Dreich Alba
Posts: 11,964
dunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Looks like ths scale and speed of reforms is coming in for some flak:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-12208322

On Radio 4 this morning, several observers seemed to be of the opinion that the wasteful, complicated management system really does need an overhaul but that the current plans are too drastic, scheduled to be implemented too fast, and many GP practices do not feel qualified to do some of the things that would be expected of them. One person (sorry, I listen to the radio while waking up so sometimes can't remember the "Who", but it was a government MP, I think) described the response from NHS professionals as a "world-weary sigh at yet another round of restructuring".
dunroving is offline  
Old Jan 18th 2011, 5:14 pm
  #13  
Lost in BE Cyberspace
 
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 41,518
Sally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond reputeSally Redux has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by beachgal21 View Post
The NHS is amazingly good, thats why it's lasted as long as it has. In the 40 years that I lived in the UK I never heard any bad reports from my friends, family or anyone else I knew. I know there have been people that have had bad experiences with the NHS, but they are far out numbered by the people that haven't.
Obviously there will be errors made by individual doctors and hospitals, as there are all over the world, these are not the fault of 'the NHS' as far as I can see. It is an extremely efficient system, has many truly outstanding staff, and provides wonderful all-round care including people like health visitors and care assistants.
Sally Redux is offline  
Old Jan 18th 2011, 11:43 pm
  #14  
Forum Regular
 
Joined: Feb 2010
Location: Coming up for air
Posts: 98
moonsurfer has a brilliant futuremoonsurfer has a brilliant futuremoonsurfer has a brilliant futuremoonsurfer has a brilliant futuremoonsurfer has a brilliant futuremoonsurfer has a brilliant futuremoonsurfer has a brilliant futuremoonsurfer has a brilliant future
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by dunroving View Post
Also, part of the plan is that individual practices/doctors can contract out services to "private companies" - that seems a recipe for disaster, to me.
Interesting - did this say what sort of services will be contracted out? Or is the definition left open? Could mean anything from reception to actual medical services - certainly if the private sector gets involved call time on the NHS right now.
moonsurfer is offline  
Old Jan 19th 2011, 10:12 am
  #15  
Ping-ponger
Thread Starter
 
dunroving's Avatar
 
Joined: Jul 2002
Location: Dreich Alba
Posts: 11,964
dunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond reputedunroving has a reputation beyond repute
Default Re: Will the NHS go down the tubes?

Originally Posted by moonsurfer View Post
Interesting - did this say what sort of services will be contracted out? Or is the definition left open? Could mean anything from reception to actual medical services - certainly if the private sector gets involved call time on the NHS right now.
No specifics discussed yet, at least nothing I have heard on the news - but reading between the lines I THINK it could lead to doctors finding a way to charge private rates to the NHS ... they also haven't thought through what will be done if a GP practice fouls it all up and ends up running out of money ...
dunroving is offline  

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.