username 34

weird don't you think??

why is it that Oz - in our brains - is the PERFECT place to go and live and yet reading the forums here seems to be the one most peolpe flee from so quickly.

I'm an expat - although not in Oz, in the West Indies, with OH and 2 kids and we will not be returning to the UK......EVER!

I've never been to Oz - but can it really be that bad?? I just cant get my brain around the fact that it can be sooooo bad in some ways it makes you want to come back to the UK. I mean, I miss my family too, I miss all my friends hugely, but I just get on with things - I keep busy and concentrate on life here.

Why does Oz seem to be the diappointment it is in terms of relocation ......?

arkon

I find it’s because it's like an exaggeration of all the bad things about the UK Only much worse because of the denial. The self deluding attitude that it’s great when it’s not is the major force for returning in my opinion. You come here to the land of milk and honey really thinking that it can’t be as bad as the UK, and then you discover it has all the same problems but worse. Even if some of the problems aren’t worse the fact that they exist is almost not recognized. Add to this the feeling of being a round peg trying to fit into a square hole and you have a recipe for disaster.

I also think the fact it is so similar to the UK gives it a disadvantage, familiar but not quite right. If you were to live in a totally different culture I can image it being less of a problem as you have less expectations in the first place.

Tonight for a laugh the misus and I added to the 5 reasons to go home thread to see how many negative things we could think up about Oz in 5 minutes, Then re reading the list we thought OK lets do the same thing for the positives. Boy did we struggle. In the end we had a list of 5 things after about an hour and I’m not even convinced they are that positive.

The wife cheerfully added that the weather and temperature is absolutely perfect for 6 months of the year and being a glasses half full person I pointed out that is was unbearable for the other half. At least in the UK regardless of the weather you can go out, you just dress accordingly. Here by contrast you would need an aircon suit which unless Nasa can somehow reduce the price of theirs, we won’t be having any time soon.

To sum up the answer as I see it to your question….Disillusionment, The chasing of a dream that doesn’t fulfill expectations for a sizable percentage of migrants.

dunroving

I don't think everyone is leaving Oz because it is an awful place (although grant you, recently there have been several posts on here from people leaving Oz). I think some of the vitriol you see on this forum is a reaction to (apparently) persecution on the Oz forum for speaking a single word of criticism about Oz. Also, Oz is so much further from the UK that probably the #1 reason for leaving any expat posting (distance from relatives, especially if you have kids) is far greater there.

Do you mind me asking approximately how old are you and your kids, and how long you've been in the Grenadines? Where are your parents (i.e., your kids' grandparents)? You sound so certain about not going back, and maybe you won't, but my initial response is "wait and see", or "search for old threads". You will see this site littered with people who over a 5-10, or 15-year period went from heaven on earth to homesickness hell on earth. They too were so certain in their first 5 years that they had "arrived" and weren't ever going back!

Sometimes it's just a case of getting bored or sick of what has now become the familar (BBQ's every week sounded like such fun when you lived in rainy Birmingham!), but often it's ailing relatives, children who are growing up into non-Brits, or your own advancing years making it clear that health care costs (in the US, for example) are going to be horrendous when you have more than just a cold to deal with.

So, no, Oz isn't terrible as I'm sure you'll see when you visit the Oz forum. I think everyone on there will tell you it's great.

username 34

well me - we've been out of the UK 4 years now. the kids are 3 and 1 and to be honest I dont want them growing up as a Brit - but I have a reason....

my parents are both non-Brit and relocated to the UK when I was 12 so the UK has always been my "adopted home" , even though I was born there my heart was never there. I dont want to be British and I think thats the key as to why we wont return. OH wouldnt care if he never saw the place again and is happy wherever he has a great job!

Its just an observation... people have to do what they are happy with, I am just suprised to see so many returnees from Oz. From the ozzies I've known in the UK they seemed such a friendly bunch and yet from the forum it seems it can be a very lonely place.

all I can advise - come to the Caribbean! Its the place you never want to leave!

arkon

Do you have Mozzies? Killer spiders and snakes? Oh and whats the customer service like?

dunroving

Well, I can see now why you'd be so sure you're not going back.

But isn't permanent residency difficult generally in the Caribbean? I tend to think of it as the year-to-year work permit place where immigration officials can change their minds whenever they want.

I was in the Bahamas for 7 years and besides the nice beaches there wasn't much else going for it (I stayed that long mostly becaseu of lack of teaching jobs back in the UK, and it was a "fun" place for someone my age). But my house was burgled in the night several times, my car was broken into dozens of times, I was threatened with a gun, attacked by a bunch of brick-yielding yobs, and had a brick thrown through my windscreen. So I left. (Plus immigration were getting to the point where visa renewals were becoming a crapshoot).

username 34

yes
no
yes - but not biters
non-existent!!

i should enlighten you - I dont live on one of the "commercial" caribbean islands, I live on a rock, home to 1500 people, 1 resort and a sailing hub.

we have no supermarkets, tourist shops, newspapers, internet cafe. We fly to the pther islands if we need shopping, food is delivered by boat twice a week. Sounds weird but is paradise I can assure you! the expat scene is very busy as we all work together and know we have to play together just to maintain sanity.

we have to leave (well me and the kids, hubby will commute by air) and move to St Lucia next year as there is no adequate schooling here. It'll be a shock living on a "big" island but I'm ready, kinda.......

sassenach

yes but what is wrong with the uk ,i believe there is nothing wrong with it just as there is nothing wrong with oz its just personal experiences that make us form a reason to live in one or the other ,just as the place you live in may be paradise to you but to others it may be a prison

username 34

ahh - well the Bahamas we dont catagorize as the Caribbean! Its the US really, as is Aruba, and USVI.

I have a Trinidad passport so I can reside all over the Caricom - so can OH and kids too with me. But was actually OH job that brought us here and now we have residency (paid for by the company) which means we're permenant as long as he's in work with whoever.

we've had no trouble here at all - the only place I've ever felt nervous is my island Trinidad. I wouldnt go back there if you said my life depended on it! Kidnappings, murders, drug problems - that island has no tourism for a reason.

All the other islands out here - as long as you dont run round the place flashing a rolex or expensive camera you'll be fine. Remember they're poor and tourists are easy pickings. Just be sensible and it works cool!

username 34

Oh yeh - I imagine a load of people couldnt live like me, I'm a total beach bum and we live without many "creature comforts" here.

but the UK...where do I start!

crap wages (OH earns 3 times more here and is tax free!!)

house prices (we still own our UK properties - they are our pension banker!)

weather - sorry I just cant take it anymore

no spare cash - limits your fun time, we just worked and went home to watch telly. Our once a year holiday wasnt enough, it really wasnt

Lifestyle - I think thats what it all boiled down to for us, we just couldnt do what we wanted, couldnt go where we wanted, couldnt give our kids what we wanted. The salaries were going up £500 a year and living over £2k a year. There just seemed no way out and we worked to live. Here we do things, we go places, we have financial freedom and nice things to spend it on. Our life is one BIG holiday now - thats the reality.

Judy in Calgary

I'm in my mid fifties. I moved to Canada from Southern Africa in the latter part of the 1970s, when I was in my mid twenties.

Canada has been good to us. We have friends here. Our kids (now in their early - mid twenties) were born here.

But some things have been tough, and I'm more conscious of them now that I'm middle aged than I was when I was younger. When my kids were little, they kept me busy, and I concentrated on life here -- as you said.

Over the years, however, I've been more conscious of the fact that our kids have only the most tenuous of relationships with their grandparents and they barely know the meaning of the word cousin. Their upbringing was so different from mine. I had regular contact with grandparents, aunts, uncles and cousins when I was a kid.

Times that my husband and I found tough were our fathers' deaths in 1996 and 2003 respectively. In recent years my husband also has heard about the deaths of school friends who had been very close to him in the past.

Each bereavement reminds us of the decades we've spent away from someone who means a lot to us.

At the moment my great niece (early twenties) is dying of brain cancer in South Africa. My sister and brother-in-law are beside themselves. They are devoted grandparents. When their grandchildren were young, they attended every school play and sports event. I hear that my BIL cries every day. My great niece has an eight-month old baby. When her surgery failed to "get" all of the malignant tumour, and when she heard what an aggressive tumour it was, she started assembling a scrapbook of her poems and photos so that, after her death, her little son would have some idea of who she had been.

I want to give them all a great big hug, but we're saving up to visit our South African family for my mother-in-law's eightieth birthday next year, and we can't afford to go now.

Back when our kids were in school, trips to South Africa were complicated by the fact that our summer school holidays were out of synch with those of our South African nieces and nephews. That is a logistical challenge that Britons in Australia experience as well.

I have no intention of moving back to my country of birth, Swaziland, or to nearby South Africa where most of my family members now live. That idea is a non-starter as far as I'm concerned. And, yes, I have a good life in Canada. But that doesn't stop me from remembering the latest e-mail update I've received about my great niece and holding back tears at the most unexpected moments -- when I'm stopped at traffic lights or pouring myself a cup of tea at the office or whatever.

So, while I have no intention of moving back to my country of origin, I can understand why some people do it.

You've stated that your heart was never in the UK. That may make it difficult for you to appreciate the position of someone whose heart is in the UK.

kiwichild

This post really sums up the importance of life and love and family. How easily we can forget what really matters as we go about our daily lives.

I really don't know what to say Judy, I just hope you all find strength, solace, comfort, hope and peace. Life can be cruel and unfair at times it seems but at the same time it offers us all the chance to learn about and value ourselves, those we love and care for, those we don't and to look for what beauty there is in the world and those who inhabit it.

Best wishes to you and all your family at this difficult time

username 34

we too have a health issue in the UK - my hubbys mother is terminally ill with a rare form of dementia. Shes in a home and when we decided to leave it was hard for his family to accept it....

but - it took 7 years for us to be able to leave and we didnt know if the opportunity would arise again. we had to prioritise our family - as in us and our children - over his mother. In all fairness she doesnt know that when he visits her for a week a year that he hasnt been there for the past 51 weeks, she thinks he was there last night.

It is hard but having parents who are "immigrants" or "expats" in the UK made it much easier on my side. they left Trinidad for the same reasons we left the UK e.g. better life for the kids, better education, better job, safer community.

If anyone is ill family wise (which happened last year) we do at least have the financial means to just jump on a plane to go see them.

My heart indeed is not in the UK - but it is with my family.... I just have to give my kids priority over them.

Craftybanshee

Judy, having followed this thread I would also like to say my thoughts are with you and your family at this difficult time.

dbd33

I work with a woman who daughter was, until recently, working in Saint Kitts, which I believe to be a small island such as you've described. She and her husband were there for a while, two or three years anyway, but decided to move back to Canada when she became pregnant. Their reasons seem to be the converse of yours, they thought an island paradise was great for adults, especially retired adults, but limiting for small children. Isn't there going to be problem as your children grow in that they'll have to leave for university and perhaps even for high school ?