theguitardoctor

Hi there, just a few thoughts....

I'd love to get back to the UK asap, which means somewhere around April by the way things are going (shame its not sooner). NZ is really not the place for people used to choice....whatever you name here, there's a limited choice (unless it's cars).....food, clothing, footwear, things to do, places to go....etc. The taxation is a joke...every dollar is taxed, there's no tax relief at all. Holidays are only 15 days per year, and most companies dictate when you can take them. Housing is shoddy and heating is non existent in most homes, whereas damp thrives and woodlice are a constant companion.

At least in the UK we had retail choice beyond our dreams, choice of leisure activities ... Motorcycle shows, Motorcycle races, outdoor activities, theme parks, beaches (not as handy I admit), choice of TV channels (this would be nice in NZ as it rains a heck of a lot!!).Sure petrol is cheaper here, but then everything is 3 times the distance away it is in the UK....
At least in the UK taxation is lower too, so although petrol is expensive, everything is fairly close and I don't spend anywhere near £4000 in transport costs. Housing is robust and well heated, so you're actually getting something for your £100,000 equivalent.
As a bonus, our friends and family are close too.

For NZ, I had a dream of cheaper living (it's not), a beautiful view (yup, but a view is just a view and you get used to it so much as it's not there anymore) and leisure time to explore the beauty of the country....with only 15 days that's limited. In the UK, with 25 days, I could go abroad cheaply and visit Scotland for the beautiful scenery in the same year.

I know, it sounds like I'm bitching about NZ, but the expectations far outweighed the reality, and it's worth the odd person considering these points as emigration is not always a positive thing.

Rich.

Pollyana

Hi Rich,
I've been following your story on the Oz/NZ forums, and I'm really sorry things haven't worked out for you.
Just to wish you luck for the future, and one question really - do you regret the move (leaving the finances aside)? Do you wish you'd never gone, or do you see it as a learning/exploring experience?

Pollyana

theguitardoctor

Hi Pollyanna,

Thanks for the support...in answer, I honestly wish we'd never come, as our once rock solid relationship is virtually at break point. The finance thing is a big problem for me as I have never had a great deal of security in my life having has a somewhat distant relationship from my father (I now have a different surname from them...so you get the picture). All my security was self earned, and it was to go on to a new chapter here in NZ. A catalog of events has aggravated things as you know, but my wife's attitude to trying again now that we are here, and bad decisions (got job, insisted on flashy sports car and best furniture etc depsite my wanting to remain in furnished flat city centre to play things safe) have aggravated the whole thing as I just feel that we have literally flushed thousands of pounds away now. I now have a distaste for NZ as you can probably tell from my posts, although I do believe it has a lot of shortcomings...scenery is not everything. I honestly have no desire to see any of NZ now as the same kind of spectacular sights are prevalent in Wales and Scotland anyway....I really would just like to turn back the clock 6 months...maybe I'd still have a strong relationship and security...here I have neither.

all the best, Rich.

Pollyana

I feel so sorry for you Rich, and I really hope that when you get back to the UK that things pick up - on all fronts.
Takes some guts to admit (especially as publicly as this) that it really didn't work out at all - its hard to make the move, I know that, must be even harder admitting defeat and going back.
Maybe at some point in the future you can look back on it and use the experience for something worthwhile - hard to see what at present, but being a great believer in fate I'm sure you were destined to do it for some reason in the great scheme of things.

Like you, I've always searched for and needed that security around me, thats what scared me about moving, and part of the reason I still feel unsettled is that my security in the form of possessions still isn't here, so I feel rootless. Our relationship has taken a battering too, just through the simple fact of getting used to living together, while I'm getting used to being in a new country at the same time, but w'ell make it. I hope you and your wife manage to make it as well.

I wish you all the luck you need;
Pollyana

Jirrupin

Mr. GD -

It seems that your rollercoaster just keeps rolling.

Perhaps now that you have decided to move back to the UK, you will begin to feel in much more control of your life. I do hope that your relationship with your wife improves, Chris and I know that migration can certainly put a great deal of pressure on a relationship.

It may be that you consider that moving to NZ was a bad decision and it seems you are feeling frustrated and angry at the moment.
Things may indeed look brighter in the future.

It sounds as though you have had to be self sufficient, and the trials you have already survived will have given you the skills to cope with your current difficulties.

NZ might not be for you, but try to enjoy the good weather and the scenery whilst you do have the opportunity and enjoy the extended holiday, because you may have to work twice as hard when you get home to make up some of the financial shortfall.

Jirrupin

I have said it before and I will say it again, I do admire your courage Pollyana. You are having to get used to so many new things at once, but I know you are up to the challenge

paddythepilot

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Rich,

I have also been following your story with interest and I am very sorry to hear about all the stress that has followed along with your Immigration saga.

I have also been to New Zealand, and I came up with the conclusion that its a nice place, very clean & tidy, with a wonderful environment but with very little economic opportunity!

Mainly, we toured the North Island and felt it was very similar to Ireland.........with the exception of the volcanoes of course!

In fact it was so similar, I felt why bother going through all that trouble immigrating to NZ when Ireland has just as much to offer,(and more in some ways), but its so much closer to all the action in Europe.

Despite all the fuss made about NZ being 'Paradise on Earth' I can understand what you are saying about its limitations and the isolation from just about everywhere.

Sounds like you have decided to move back to the UK, fair enough! At least you gave it a good go...... and you have gained much from the experience.

I wouldn't worry too much about how much the whole experience has you cost in monetary terms, you can always go back and re-build your savings.

I guess the benefit of the whole affair is that, when you do finally get back to the UK you will feel a whole lot more 'settled' and you can then concentrate on getting on with life without thinking the grass is always greener.

Good luck and wishing you all the best for the future!

theguitardoctor

Thanks for all the support from everyone...time will tell what the outcome will be. I agree with you about Ireland Paddy..NZ is not that far removed.

all the best, Rich.

DaisyNZ

They talk about new jobs, moving house, new babies etc as being the most stressful situations we can go through. That is of course until you have moved yourself and your partner to the other side of the world!!! It is a huge stress on a relationship and it is only something other immigrants can understand. I wanted to say that I understand totally what you feel about not wanting to see any more of NZ etc, I have gone through times where I have felt exactly like that. I can't even go into more detail because I don't know how to describe it, but reading your post I knew I had been in a place like that. It's been so up and down for me since coming here, the feelings are complicated and I don't like to share it much on here coz I feel trashed when other people tell me I can't possibly feel like that. For me the option of going back has never been easy because I have a kiwi hubby, but we are going back to give it a go (extended working holiday) in 2 years time. I hope my hubby's experience will be easier there than yours has been over here. I'm really sorry it's been so difficult, but there's no doubt that if we'd both been English we'd have gone back within a short time. I feel different now I've been here 11 years and have had 2 kids here, but it's been a slow process which I wouldn't have chosen to have processed!!!! Strangely though, I now feel very kiwi and wonder how I'll get on back home, but it's only been my circumstances that have led to that.

Good luck with your plans, I hope you and your wife can make it work, but leave NZ knowing that there are some of us out here who know how hard it all can be. All the best.

muppetking

There isn't a word of a lie in any of this Rich but you didn't mention the appalling driving, the Kiwi obsession with everything being 'world class', the general downer on anything that isn't Kiwi in origin. Personally I am heartily sick of watching an interview expecting intelligent comment and then hearing the question "So how did you find London? Cold? Smelly? Dirty?" This simply encapsulates the deep insecurities Kiwis have and particularly with regard to England. Media comment here is trite and 2 dimensional.
We have done quite well here in the last 3 and a half years but we are really looking forward to going home. We have several friends who feel the same and in some cases with far more vitriol; than I could muster. The people on their way out here had better be sure that what they are leaving behind is THAT bad! A land of opportunity it is NOT. Far better that it should market itself as NZ LTD!

theguitardoctor

Hi Muppetking,

I couldn't agree more...everything you hear is "New Zealands own....Sam Neil stars in..." or "New Zealands finest such and such"...It's something we never hear in the UK. It's always just the person, or the product name. I don't know if it's insecurity or otherwise, but it certainly smacks of a deep need for self promotion. And yes, the drivers are possibly the worst I've ever experienced....I was planning to buy a motorcycle if we stayed, but that would be like leaving a suicide note each time I went out...it's not great in the UK, but it's not this bad.

We've actually brought the date closer to return as I no longer have any desire to see NZ..the place is not so unusual. I'll just be happy to get back to Blighty...aah civilisation again.

I agree with you that people in the UK really do need to have it very badly before coming to NZ. What I would give to go back 3 months and abandon the whole thing.

Hmm NZ Ltd...it could catch on.

all the best for your plans...regards, Rich.

wilko_1984

Hi G.D,

I know exactly how you're feeling. I moved to Perth, WA, with my parents and younger brothers 3 months ago and to tell you the truth, have regretted it since Heathrow airport!

I never really wanted to come, im 19 and had the choice, but didnt really weigh up the pros and cons, should have thought it through. But it's hard when you constantly have to listen to your whole family going on about "a new life", so in the end, i just decided to give in and go with the flow.

I, too, have been following your messages and although you are older than me, i think we're both from the same school of thought, that the dream isn't the reality. Only with the benefit of hindsight do we see what we have given up and how good life actually was. My feelings in the months leading up to the move, were that of optimism and hope, i believed that the grass was greener! Coming from such an affulent part of England, the south east, coming here has hit me hard. I had everything i could have ever wished for, was earning good money (as a waiter, while doing my A levels) and the best group of mates a young lad could wish for.

Maybe it sounds silly to you, maybe you think that im young enough to make a go of it, that's what everyone else thinks. But every person is different and i dont think anyone can judge us for "giving up and going home". I know there are many people in the same boat, but these are the people you never hear about because they get constant abuse from others for "slagging off such a great country". The only people who understand, are the people who are living the same nightmare.

Guitar doctor, you are now saying that you are bring the date forward of your return to England, i can truly understand that, i myself am doing exactly the same. I know your'e in NZ and im in Oz, but at the end of the day; different countries, same s**t.

I wont go on much longer, only to say, that im planning to return to England asap, at the moment, i have just got myself a little job to get the money together, to show my parents i am "responsible". Like you, GD, i have lost all apetite for seeing Australia; the bush, sydney, ayre's rock, etc. On the positive side, i really do count myself lucky to call England my home, it's been good to me, and that's where i belong.

It really is each to their own, if you love Oz or NZ, then i hope you are very happy here and wish you all the best. I dont begrudge anyone their right to decide. But i do ask you all to understand the feelings of others. There is nothing more irritating than a person who tries to force their opinions on to you.

All the best, GD. I really hope all works out for you. Keep us updated.

Wilko

iaink

Hi Wilco,

I cant help thinking that three months is not long enough to make an informed decision, I would wait at least a year to get a real feel for a place and make sure it is not just short term culture shock or homesickness which are very common at first, until you get your bearings a bit.
I know from experience how difficult it is to leave behind friends and familliar places, and it takes time to build new bonds, especially if you were not fired up to go in the first place. At your age a year probably seems like an eternity, but in the great scheme of things it is not, and it may make all the difference.

If you came back now would it be just you, or your whole family? from your post it sounded like just you.

If its you on your own, what would it cost you to get a place to live, perhaps get a car, and have money left to enjoy yourself? I doubt if the money you got as a waiter would seem so good if you had to support yourself in the SE of England. Although it seems like a lot when you are doing your A levels, when you are supporting yourself it will not go nearly as far. Talk to your old friends, have they got their own places, what does it really cost them every month if they dont live at home? Do they really have such a great life as you remember, or is that the "grass being greener"?

If you left Oz now would it stand against you if you wanted later to move back to be near your family again? I dont know the rules but I suspect that if you have given up your resident status it would be very hard to get it back again.

I guess all I am saying is don't rush into a decision, check out the financial and emotional cost of setting up on your own back in the UK, being away from your family, check out the possible consequences of giving up your residency, and weigh them agains the benefits of being back on familiar ground.

Good luck either way

Iain

DaisyNZ

I don't agree, you can also look at it his way and say why should he wait a year to 'see if he likes it' just coz his parents want to live there. A year is a long time at that age, I found the 4 months I was in NZ at the same age with my kiwi fiance an eternity and I counted the days down until I went home to my friends and social life. I don't blame you Wilko for wanting to go home, make the most of your youth with the life that you choose, you'll never have the time again, you can always join your parents later on once you've decided what you want to do etc. If life was good before, why put yourself through misery just to see if Oz gets better, I don't understand why people think that way.

dunroving

I think there are practical considerations also, though. Waiting things out a while is more reasonable if there was a lot of money invested in moving in the first place, and/or you have kids who are now in school, and/or you'd be jobless if you just upped and went back, etc. In Wilco's case it doesn't seem like these kinds of issues are relevant, but as far as understanding "why people think that way", practicalities can often drive the decision to wait things out.

I know I was miserable for the first 4-6 months after I went back to the U.K. But in the next 6 months, I absolutely loved it, found a good group of friends, nice place to live. Of course, in the meantime I'd accepted a job offer back in the States (doh!). Luckily things worked out and I'm loving my new job, but if it hadn't I'd be kicking myself for jumping the gun before I'd given things a chance. Oh, and the two TransAtlantic moves cost me over $20,000 (including all the intangibles), so I think that's reason enough to consider whether I was too impetuous.