ZorroMask

Hi everyone,

I am currently working in Dubai and might be transferred by my company to KSA soon with Dammam or Khobar as possible office locations. I am a single father with 3 very young kids, which would be moving with me.
As they're very young they need 24hr care and can not be left alone.Because of that I have currently the help of a live in maid, who does the all the daily routine of cleaning, shopping, cooking, but for me most importantly having an eye on the kids, e.g.picking up from school, bringing to playdates etc, when I am at work.
Currently I am living in a gated Community in Dubai and it more or less works quite well.

The questions I am having are:

1) I understand as a single man, even with kids, I am not allowed to have a live-in nanny. Are there alternatives around? I need also someone I can trust, which is actually the most important point. If yes, I might be able to bring my current nanny, but I also have to consider hiring one there, as she has family here, and understandably, wouldn't want to move.

2) I would be living in a compound, here I would like to know if there are compounds with schools inside. If the schools are outside, is there a Bus Service from the compound. Is it safe?

3) I understand that in the compounds getting around is no problem and it is safe. Can I keep the kids busy with activities within the compound, e.g. tennis classes, football teams, dancing, ballet etc.?
If outside, I would need a driver, do I need hire one full time? Can I hire one full time and what are the costs? Also in case the activities are outside, can the nanny drive with the driver in one car as they're not related?

4) Can Bahrain considered as an alternative to live in order to avoid all this problems in KSA? In that case I would need to commute, and read/ experienced how long it can take to cross the border. In that case I wouldn't mind getting a VIP Pass if it would really help. I prefer to spent quality time with my kids rather than driving and not seeing them.

My main focus is the safety & comfort of the kids.

So many questions and I would really appreciate all your feedbacks on this topic.

Thx

flares

look for a new company would be my advice

britexpat76

You are going to have way too many obstacles in your path working in the dark ages. Either stay put or as Saudiflares says - New company

gottheTshirt

You have to live on an expat compound and expat compounds provide services such as cars and drivers, maids, nannies, school bus service etc. Officially you cannot have a live in nanny but on a compound you can do whatever the compound management agree you can do. I see no reason why you could not satisfactorily agree the provision of all your requirements, at a price, with the compound management. They are there to provide the service. Certainly the compound we lived on in Riyadh would meet your requirements. As for keeping the children entertained all the children on the compound are in the same boat and organised events, tennis, swimming etc are normal. Young children are usually very resilient to monotony. You have one advantage over couples in that you can take your children to the beach etc. with having to leave your wife in the compound.

dragonladyoz

Given the issues with KSA I would agree with saudiflares and britexpat76 - KSA would be a nightmare for a variety of reasons - Bahrain would certainly be an option but you would have to do the commute and it will take away the time you want to spend with your kids.

To address a couple of your many questions and give you an idea of some logistical things :
1. The compound we were on had maids/nannies that lived on the compound and so could be available for the times you are wanting - but that is not guaranteed for every compound - you would have to check before you went somehow.

2. I don't know of any schools that are located inside a compound, although certainly there are schools that are next to or across the road from compounds. Some compounds do have a school bus - but my experience (from seeing some on the road) was that the students on there were pretty rowdy and did what they liked, with no adult to supervise and a bus driver who doesnt care - given the traffic and driving abilities of most people on the road in Saudi, it would at best be described as very dangerous.

3. Again the compounds vary - some have plenty of activities - other have few - so you would need to choose carefully. It is also often harder to find activities for girls than for boys. Yes you could hire a driver and the maid could travel with the children in the car without any issues, as long as she is seated in a rear seat and not next to him in the front - so with 3 kids that might mean that you need a larger car, unless you have a son who is old/tall enough to sit in the front passenger seat. Don't know going costs in the east but in Jeddah most people pay 2000-2500 a month for drivers that work 7-6.

4. Can't help with commute times etc - sorry


Another thing to consider is the visa process - in KSA it is normal to have to be there several months before your family is allowed to join you on a family visa - what provisions are the company making so that your children can move to KSA at the same time as you do?

gottheTshirt

I do agree that your company wants you there then they need to do a lot of work getting you there. They have to find a good compound with all the services and facilities that you need and these need to be paid for. They need to resolve the visa problem.

As for the other problems I don't share the concerns above. I do not see any difference in your children being looked after by a nanny/maid or a mother. Neither can drive, neither can travel in the front seat with a driver. You have to rely on the school bus the same as all other expat families in KSA have to. But having said that my children were brought up in Nigeria, Ghana and Darfur Sudan. Living on a compound in KSA is a piece of cake in comparison.

ZorroMask

Dear saudiflares, britexpat76, gottheTshirt & dragonladyoz,

Thank you for your valuable comments.
This doesn't sound very promising and many obstacles to be resolved.

Regarding the nanny I would need a longterm solution and someone trustable, rather than different people coming and going. This is my biggest concern, as I want the kids safe for the time I am away.

Drivers seems possible, but do I sponsor them or they are externals. Also here a long term solution is key.

I understand that the right compound would make it easier, but still there is a lot to manage, as there are so many uncertainties.
My "idea" was to have the kids safe in the compound, mainly dropped off by me in the mornings to school, picked up by nanny/driver in the afternoon ( i assume school finishes around 2pm), be home with them at 5/6pm. But this still requires someone I can trust, especially with overnight travel.

Haven't thought about the Visa process was under the assumption that this can be done at the same time. Is it possible with the right approach?

Basically the pillar I am missing is a woman in my life/house :-)...all this responsibilities, e.g. taking kids to school, playdates etc. in KSA are done by the wifes I understand, respect :-)...


Would appreciate all your feedbacks, thx

ZorroMask

Dear gottheTshirt,

Thx for your feedback. I work for a multinational and it would be an internal transfer, so careerwise it is a good move. Luckily, I don't have to worry working for a local set up.
I see the importance of a good compound, containing all the facilities. My oldest takes the school bus already, so I might have to go for it for all kids.
My biggest concern as mentioned is the logistics and being taken care of when I am not around. Here, a mother naturally does the best job, in my case I need a trustable solution, who can have an eye on the kids when I am not around.
As long the kids are sorted out, with a trustable full time live in nanny, school transportation and after school activities in a safe in the compound, it s fine.
Actually, I even would prefer that they do not need to leave the compound at all.
But this is my wish only, the reality of course is always different :-(..

Do you have any ideas of such "good" compounds in Khobar or Dammam? I assume beside price, availability will also be an issue.
Is the visa process doable, or are there any rules applying, e.g. I can't bring my familty before I have lived min. 3 months in KSA etc.

Thx for your valuable feedback.

HOOD_KSA

Zorro - life here is what you make of it. Compounds provide a gated community where your kids can run around and play in addition to useful facilities for the family (sports and leisure wise). Inside a compound is like being in Dubai - so Western ladies find it 'normal'. Outside is obviously more conservative but not as bad as people here make out. For example, it's mentioned that women don't go to the beach - which is not true. Differences in culture expose people's intolerance - which is quite ironic given what expats accuse locals of. Better to take what you like and leave what you don't.

The good thing is the general level of safety is high, which means that you can move around more safely than many portray. For example, personal safety walking around a big city here is much better than large UK cities.

The best city for me is Khobar. It's not too big, easy to get around and just a short drive away from Bahrain if you want something else for the weekend (cinema). Commuting time to the main shopping malls in Bahrain takes about 1 hour - but be prepared for that to take 2-3 hours at the weekends as the causeway bridge gets very busy. VIP passes are no longer available.

As you've said, you could live in Bahrain but I think the daily commute might be tiresome. It depends on how the kids feel though.

Riyadh has the biggest population with endless restaurants and shopping malls - but is regarded as the least friendly. Obviously people living in individual villas behind high walls doesn't help. This is where a compound helps - especially for the kids.

Drivers can be found locally who hire themselves out (with their own visas) for SR2-3000 per month. As an expat you can bring a driver depending on your visa profession and if your company helps arrange it for you. If you bring your own driver then the salary will be between SR1,000 and SR1,500 per month depending on nationality. Finding a dependable, reliable driver and maid is key for you. I'd recommend the maid go with the kids to and from school if you can't make it, just to make sure the driver is doing his job carefully!

If your company is efficient then they can finish your work/residency visa within 1 week. Some companies wait until the 90 day probation period is complete before making the family's visas, but since you are an existing employee then they should start straight away. Given your situation, no mother to take care of the kids, you should ask your office to explain this to the government relations departments in their Saudi office and see if any exception can be done. Worth asking for.

Good luck!

ZorroMask

Dear Hood_KSA,

Thx for your valuable feedback.

As you have correctly pointed out, the maid is key.
My biggest concern is the logistics and the kids being taken care of when I am not around. I might also have to travel overnight and leave the kids alone. As they are very young, oldest is 7 years, they need someone always around, e.g. pick them up from from school, bring to activities etc. Here, a mother naturally does the best job, in my case I need a trustable solution, who can have an eye on the kids when I am not around.

I see the importance of a good compound, containing all the facilities.
I understand some of the compounds are allowing the nanny to stay and live in the compound and in my premises. Do they want a fee for it? Where do nannies usually come from (countries) & what is their legal status, if I do not sponsor them? Who is the sponsor? Last thing what I want is that police (or the Mutawa) shows up and I am in trouble. The preference of being their sponsor would give me a certain security and trust (kids, valuables etc.).
Any idea, where I could find one.

As long the kids are sorted out, with a trustable full time live in nanny, school transportation and after school activities in a safe in the compound, it would be fine.
Actually, I even would prefer that they do not need to leave the compound at all, except with me. As I understand the compounds are very safe.
But this is my wish only, the reality of course is always different :-(..

Thx for your valuable feedback

britexpat76

Let question is, can a batchelor sponsor a maid? If as expected the answer is no are you willing to risk yours and a maids freedom? I just think its asking for trouble having a non family female involved both for you and her. There are hundreds of countries to go to avoid the backwards shithole that's KSA.

HOOD_KSA

Your company should help you with all these points since they are a multi-national and should be used to helping expats settle.

Will be more useful than the bitching given by some. No idea why these people are living in the Middle East.

britexpat76

Explain how a live in maid is allowed in KSA then without the OP breaking the law.

HOOD_KSA

The guy is looking for useful advice.

If people came to the UK or US to work and bitched about it as much as the expats do when they come to the Middle East, those same people would be called intolerant, narrow minded bigots. Funny how people think it's ok the other way round.

britexpat76

Funny, I thought it better to give him advice that was legal and kept him out of prison. What has that got to do with tolerance or bigotry?