natalija

Hi, everybody!
I came to the US on K-1 visa. Then we got married in the US. Then we applied for AOS and were told that I would need Medical exam performed by civi surgeon appointed by government. Then opn the other board I was told that when K-1 apply for AOS, they do need medical exam, becuase they had an exam before they got to the US in their own country. But they will need some vaccinations, signed by this Civil surgeon.
I called to the clinic of this Civil Surgeon to ask about it. They said, that I do need the medical exam anyway. I passed this exam, paid them 165 $. And I also have to make vaccinations, which will cost us 100$ more.
Then I saw on the Government site, that really K-1 holders do NOT need this exam because they had one in their country, and it is valid for 1 year.
But the Civil surgeon stuff was not informed about it at all, and they gave me wrong information.
Is there any way for me to get my money back for the medical exam?
Has anybody got some real knowlege about this? Or personal experience?
Any help would be appreciated.
Natalija

207lonsdale

I don't really have any advice for you, other than to suggest that you could write to the civil surgeon concerned, explaining the circumstances of your situation, etc. You might prefer to visit him/her in person to discuss the same, I just prefer to deal with certain situations in writing which would then ensure that there could not be any confusion as to what was or was not said!

I just wonder whether the civil surgeons really do not know that a K1 visa holder only needs the vaccination supplement, unless more than one year has passed since the original medical exam? Or is it simply a case of them being able to increase their profit margins with easy work? As I understand it, you have to go to a civil surgeon specifically approved by the USCIS, this being the case then I think it reasonable to expect that they must be aware of the correct requirements?

Just Jenney

The USCIS itself isn't even consistent on this issue, so it's pretty hopeless to expect the civil surgeons to know USCIS regulations and requirements.

Here's what we've encountered so far, and are trying to get sorted out now before our interview in June:

1) The USCIS website says that a K1 recipient does NOT need a medical exam for AOS, as long as they apply for AOS within one year of the medical exam completed for their original K1 visa. It does NOT say the AOS interview has to take place within one year of the K1 visa medical exam, just that AOS must be APPLIED FOR within one year of the K1 visa medical exam.

You can read it directly on the USCIS website here (see #2): http://uscis.gov/graphics/i-693faq.htm#exam

2) The cover letter from the Norfolk USCIS office included in our original I-485 application packet states, "If you entered the United States as a K1 fiance(e), no medical examination is required." Doesn't get much clearer than that, right? Well, keep reading...

3) On the checklist of items REQUIRED for our AOS interview sent to us by Norfolk, it lists, "Medical Exam results, Form I-693. Appear even if not completed." As you can see, this completely contradicts the cover letter sent to us by the SAME OFFICE (Norfolk) with our AOS application packet.

So we have two documents saying NO, it's not required, and one document (perhaps the most important: our AOS interview notice) saying YES, it is required. To add to our confusion, neither document from Norfolk makes any mention of the vaccination supplement.

We're sending a letter (today, in fact) to Norfolk asking for clarification. We're including copies of each document and highlighting the areas so they see the contradiction right away. Hopefully we'll get a response within a few weeks. If we don't hear anything, then we're going to take copies with us to Mark's fingerprinting appointment in April and ask them in person.

My advice to the original poster is: Check with your USCIS office directly about the requirements. Do not rely on the civil surgeons for this clarification. Ultimately it is your USCIS office that has the final say, not the civil surgeon. And I hate to say it, but I think you can pretty much kiss that money goodbye. The civil surgeon DID provide the exam and vaccinations, regardless of whether you actually needed both.

~ Jenney

Bluegrass Lass

Hey J&M, form I-693 is the form that the foreign fiance gets from the dr on the day of the medical. I believe it's basically the Vaccination Supplement form stating which vaccinations have been done.

So if none had been done, you would need to get the vacs done here and get the civil surgeon to fill out that form as proof. My fiance rec'd one with the brown envelope & visa the day of interview. If vacs were done before the medical, it would be stated on there, and would not require you to have more done, you would just send USCIS that supplement form.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

Cheers,
Jamie

207lonsdale

From reading the initial post I got the impression that Natalija thought that she did not need another medical, but that the designated civil surgeon advised her that she did need to have one and so accepted his advice as accurate.

She has paid out $165 for a medical, which according to the USCIS website was not needed if she filed for AOS within one year of the original medical.

Sorry Jenney, but I would not simply *kiss that money goodbye*, and would most certainly make an issue of it with the civil surgeon concerned. If the civil surgeon was incorrect in the advice he gave to Natalija, he just might feel that she is entitled to some form of redress, if not a complete refund. Regardless, IMHO I think that we should be able to expect that all designated civil surgeons do in fact know what the requirements are!

Whether or not Natalija obtains any form of redress, her enquiries may result in that particular civil surgeon taking steps to ensure that he/she is better informed, if as you suggest, it may just be a case of him/her not knowing the requirements.

katesuiter1

Aaaaaaaahh, Jenney.......you don't reeeeaaaallly expect them to pick up on something so obvious, do ya? Hehehehe!!

I'll be looking out for your response from them about this, if you'd be so kind as to post it when you hear? I'm sure this question has been asked a million times before. Many thanks!!

Kate. xxxx

Just Jenney

Mark did not receive anything from the doctor after completing his K1 medical exam. He simply did the medical, then went directly to the London consulate for his visa interview. At the end of the interview he was handed the brown envelope, and only then did he get back his chest x-rays. He was given no form, I-693 or otherwise. Others on the NG who came from the UK on K1 visas have had this same experience.

Before his K1 visa medical exam, Mark had all his vaccinations updated. If my memory serves me, I don't think he needed any additional vaccinations at the actual exam itself, because they were all completed beforehand. The only required vaccination Mark has not had is Varicella (chicken pox), but only because it is unavailable in the UK; that is simple enough to get done.

We don't really have a problem with getting a civil surgeon to fill out a form confirming that Mark's vaccinations are already up-to-date. But we don't see the point in him having an entire medical exam done all over again unnecessarily, especially when it involves an extra expense that we'd rather avoid.

~ Jenney

Bluegrass Lass

Ok, then I guess we were very lucky that my fiance did get the I-693 day of interview. I totally understand why you don't want to pay for something that you may not need! If they tell us that he needs anything in addition to the I-693, we in trouble, cuz the nearest surgeon to me is 300+ miles away.

Is there any other way to prove one has had chicken pox already, either by immunization or actually having it? Without having to pay for the varicella shot? Esp since we'd have to travel so far just for a damn shot. This portion of the process is really starting to piss me off.

207lonsdale

You can have a blood test to check immunity. Apparently, 70% to 90% of adults who do not remember having chickenpox actually have protection in their blood when tested!

Just Jenney

I certainly did not mean to imply that the OP should not try to get her money back. If she wants to try to get her money back, more power to her. I'm just saying she shouldn't be too optimistic.

I disagree. The fact is that civil surgeons are NOT employees of the USCIS, they are NOT immigration officials, and thus cannot be expected to know or enforce immigration regulations. That's the job of, among other people, the officials who work at the USCIS district offices who process AOS applications.

All the civil surgeons do is look at Form I-693 and, based on medical records and/or discussion with the applicant, determine whether the applicant meets all the requirements listed on the form. If the civil surgeon cannot check off all the required boxes on the form, then they perform a medical exam and/or vaccinations in order to do so.

Using my previous post as an example - with all the conflicting information we're getting from our own USCIS office (Norfolk) - it is unrealistic to hold civil surgeons responsible for knowing immigration procedures and requirements when the immigration officials don't even seem to have a clue themselves.

It is truly unfortunate that the civil surgeon in the OP's case did not advise her to contact her USCIS office to confirm what was actually required - just the vaccination supplement or a complete medical exam. But that doesn't negate the fact that they still provided a service at the OP's request (misinformed as it was), and based on that I would be very surprised if they issue a refund.

~ Jenney

207lonsdale

They may not be employees of the USCIS and they may not be immigration officials, however, they do receive training and as such I still believe that they should be aware of the requirements in respect of the medical/vaccinations.

Furthermore, I would quote the following taken from the USCIS website:-

***Medical examinations are given by licensed and experienced doctors, called Civil Surgeons (in the U.S.A.) and Panel Physicians (outside of the U.S.A.). Doctors who qualify as Civil Surgeons or Panel Physicians receive special and on-going immigration oriented medical training and policy updates. Note: A medical exam performed by a doctor NOT approved by USCIS will not be recognized. ***

Based on the above information, I can see no reason why anyone should not expect a designated civil surgeon to know what the requirements are.

Just Jenney

Well, I suppose we can just agree to disagree. I've learned not to take anything USCIS says at face value - which includes these "immigration oriented medical training and policy updates". That training and those updates are only as good as the organization providing them to the civil surgeons. And often that organization - the USCIS - can't seem to tell its right hand from its left.

~ Jenney

207lonsdale

Did the civil surgeon provide a service at the OP's request or did the civil surgeon advise the OP that she needed that service?

I agree Jenney, if the service was provided at the OP's direct request then I do not see any valid basis for a refund being requested. However, my understanding was that the civil surgeon advised the OP that she needed another medical at a cost of $165. If this was the case then I cannot see any reason why the OP should not be entitled to redress.

I realise that it would be very difficult for the OP to prove what actually took place between herself and the civil surgeon, but that should not deter her from at least making enquiries. If nothing else, perhaps the civil surgeon concerned will ensure that any future advice he gives is in fact correct.

katesuiter1

Although I agree that the doctors should know what's required and what isn't, I also agree that if the USCIS can't even lay down consistant rules, how is anyone, whether it be an immigrant or a panel physician, supposed to know what to do?

Kate. xxxx

207lonsdale

Jenney

Believe me when I say that I also do not take anything the USCIS says at face value either! We are all involved in a process, which is to say the least, somewhat flawed.

However, when it comes to certain issues, I will refer to the USCIS website. Thus, lets say I was charged $165 for a service I did not need and the civil surgeon claimed he was unaware of the requirements, then I would most certainly point out certain references to him.

I was not suggesting that *all civil surgeons know what the requirements are*. Rather, I was suggesting that we should be able to expect that all civil surgeons know what is required.

Julie.