USAGypsies

I have copied/pasted this post from 'Moving back to the UK' on advice from 'Jerseygirl'.

Here's my info and mess....
English Family of 4 living in Florida, Me, Husband, 15 year old son, 2 year old daughter and we have been thinking about having another so who knows when that could happen. July 23rd 07 I would have been here 4 years on a greencard as was my Son. My husband will have been here 4 years on his green card as of November 17th 07. Our daughter was born here.
We think we are nearly there with a decision and so far it looks like we will probably be going home. We are just the same as the other people who's stories we have read on here, we've been weighing up the emotional, financial and practical pros and cons, mostly for our children and we've be doing a lot of soul searching and as well as this my Husbands Mother is 74 and sick. My own Mother died a year after we left the UK and I can tell you right now that our departure killed her.
We are not homesick, probably because we know it was our decision to leave in the first place so we are 'numbed' in that area and we feel that we have had a very positive experience living in Florida. We also lived in MA, TX and NY so we've been quite busy these past few years.
We think that our kids would be better off in the UK for a few years... to have the security of family, 'real' friends around them, to give them back a half decent education and also so me and my husband can have a night to ourselves - the first in 4 years!! ha ha (just incase you're wondering, we could never bring ourselves to trust anyone to babysit the little one). Our youngest doesn't even know what family is and it's probably that fact that plays on our mind the most and although we are super active with her and mix her with the community etc... it's not the same and both Hubby and I are becoming more troubled by this thought.
I personally have my own 'isolation' issues and the cherry is that my Husband is not enjoying his work at all. He long's for his London career back, a.s.a.p.

So begins the bit I can not get my head around. We want to get our citizenships. We feel that we have put so much effort, time and money into coming out here in the first place, to walk away now, back to the UK without securing our right to return would be a mistake. We do not know what the future holds and what if we feel as strongly in the future about coming back to the USA as we do today about going back to the UK? We need that option to be available. When we first started talking about going home I said, okay let's wait til next April 24th. I'll file my N-400. We'll get the interview in July and then the Oath ceremony will soon follow, we'll be out of here within the year. I can hear some of you laughing already. The time line is just not that neat and tidy or anywhere as fast from most accounts I have read... I should have known better having already waited over 10 years for the Greencards in the first place.
If we stay and wait it out to the 5 year mark, I would still file in April and Hopefull interview by this time next year. Then we have an unknown wait for the oath ceremony. Once that is done, that will secure me and I can then apply for a US Passport and I have heard different things about the wait time on that. Once I am a citizen I wil then be able to get a US passport for my (then 16 ear old) from my naturalization - right? Again, how long that part would take I have no idea.
Then my husband would have to file his application in August of next year in preperation for his completion of 5 years LPR the following Novermber... and off we go again with all the waiting.
The thought of having to be here for 1 more year is bearable - we can work with that because we have a house to sell in a down-market, cars to get rid of etc... A concern with our son is that currently he hasn't got a girlfriend and we worry that if we are here for much longer and he get's involved with a girl, his willingness to leave may vanish! Also, we do not know how he will finish his education in the UK as depending on when we go back will depend if he is still at high school age, 6th form age or college age. Also I have read that he may be treated as an International student on our return. I have read that there are ways around that too though... that's another thread altogether!
The thought of being here for 18 months makes me wince and pull ugly cringy faces that can only be remedied with botox.
The thought of being here for 2 years brings on a feeling of utter dismay and panic like I have just realised that I had unknowingly sold my soul to the devil that is the USCIS and that 2 years would actually last 10 as I fry in the flames of Florida for what will feel like eternity.
I think hubby would leave much much sooner (within 6 months), if possible.

We definately want to go within a year though and I just don't know how we can co-ordinate it. I was going back and forth with it all last night. We could go within a year and then I could have an immigration attorney file for me here in FL perhaps? Or do you have to file in person? So let's assume I just post the N-400 with $675 to the 'Florida office' where ever that may be, and I wait for an interview date. Can I get the interview date online or must it be in letter form and in that case I would have to have it either sent to the attorneys office or to a friends house here in Florida? Then I would have to fly back to the USA for my interview. Then go home again and wait for the oath ceremony which could be as early as 1 week later to 2 years later - is that right? Fly back to the US for the Oath ceremony, (how expensive is this getting). Then I would get my certificate of naturalization - right then or would it be mailed to me does anyone know?
Then comes US passport time. Do I have to apply in person or can I just mail in the application/photos/fees? Same for my son. Does he need a certificate or they do his from my information? Then if just I got the naturalisation, would it be worth my Husband getting his or if we decide to return in say, 10 years time, could I bring him in with me or would it be better if he got his naturalisation? Are you still with me or have you gone to take some tylenol extra......?

So at least you can see why I didn't sleep last night and I apologise for the sheer length of this post.

If there is any points anyone can make? Any ideas, anything, please let me know. I need all the help I can get to organise this mess in my head into a workable plan.

Ray

If you both get you Citship before you leave perfect ...
If just you get your ...not so perfect but still fairly good ..

Noyou can't slope off pre citizenship

or a possible way is a re-entry permit giving you a max of two years
outside the US .....if you leave plenty of evidence that you have not abandoned you GC status

Have you been back lately ... the grass is not always greener
Well!! actually the grass is ..but little else ..

USAGypsies

So if we did slope off (with permission for up to 2 years), then we could come back and file later down the road. What would be good evidence to show we had not totally abandoned our LPR status? Can you give me some examples?

Another question. Does anyone know if you and your spouse file your N-400's together whether your interview date/oath date would be on the same days?

Jerseygirl

Usually a family application is kept together unless there is a delay with one or more of the applications.

BTW referring to my post in the MBTTUK forum. When my daughter was stopped at the border...she was driving her US car, registered and insured in NJ, had US bank and CC accounts, was still a dependant. Of course if she'd been refused entry we could have appealed but it just goes to show you can't guarantee you'll be able to re-enter.

Bill_S

Before embarking on such a scheme, you need to read the USCIS Guide to Naturalization. Read it carefully. Especially the parts about Physical Presence and Continuous Residence.

USAGypsies

Wow! How stressful and I had always been under the impression that the US/Canadian border was the easier going one. Was she given a hard time because the border could see she had an interview/oath pending?

I keep wondering if we should just say 'stuff it! Let's just go home and stuff the immigration and stuff the green cards they can keep them and let's just force ourselves to stick to the decision we make for ever' and in the short term it would mean we could achieve what we want much quicker but I just can't imagine doing that - how can we turn our back on all these years of effort for the sake of a little longer. Right now though, a little longer looks more like 18mths to 2 years and that is toooooooooooooooooooooooooo long.

USAGypsies

Thank you Bill_S. I will have a good read of that tonight.

Jerseygirl

I explained what had happened in the other thread.

If you want to become USCs IMHO you would be best staying and getting your citizenship before you leave.

Rete

Any stay outside of the US for a year or more will restart your time clock for naturalization, with or without the re-entry permit.

You and your husband will be eligible to apply for naturalization 90 days before the 5th anniversary of your residency status. It is currently taking 6 months or less for naturalization. What it will be a year from now is anyone's guess.

If you and you alone became a USC and then left to return to the UK, if the decision to return to the US arises in the future, you would be able to petition for your husband's new residency status (after he has lost the old one due to abandonment) at the US Consulate in London.

A lot to think over for the two of you and I can hear the frustration and urgency in your post to go home. Weigh the pros and cons and make your decision. Your husband will be eligible to apply approximately August, 2008 giving him a naturalization date of around February, 2009. Do you want to wait that long?

USAGypsies

Hello Rete
Thank you for your reply. We are wondering exactly that. Can we wait until Feb 2009? Our immediate answer is NO WAY, that's too long, but given the trouble we would save ourselves in the long run, we are feeling very confused and are not ready to commit either way. We need to think some more.
Would you mind answering a few specific questions for me?

If my husband gets naturalized in February 2009, would you say we should add another 1 or 2 months for him to get his US passport? That would take up to Spring of 2009 - yikes!

Does the Interview and the Oath ceremony 'usually' occur close together (days or weeks apart)?

I understand that Children become automatic USC's when a parent naturalizes. Do I need to fill out forms/pay a fee etc... to get a certificate to show our son is a USC via me, (he will be 16 when I naturalize) so that we can apply for his US passport?


The final part I am confused about....

If we got only my naturalization done and my son and I both had our US passports and let's take a wild guess that we were all set and ready to go back to the UK in September of 2008. If my husband filed his N-400 in the previous August, (the month before we left) and we had his interview letter sent to us, could he not fly back to do his interview and oath ceremony, get his US passport and then leave for the UK again? Is that just impossible?
I also assume that a naturalization interview and Oath ceremony is always done in the USA and never at the US embassy in the UK? Even if we had permission of leave due to a sick dying relative?

One more senario Rete, sorry... if we got only my naturalization done and my husband abandoned his LPR, what is the official way to 'abandon' LPR? Is there a right way to do it and a wrong way to do it?
Would abandoning his LPR reflect badly on his case if we filed for a fresh green card for him again in the future? What is the average wait for a GC for a spouse - a year?


I really appreciate your patience with all of my questions and assistance to help us figure out which direction we are heading.

Jerseygirl

You normally get several weeks notice for the interview/oath ceremony...therefore you would have plenty of time to fly back. We had 3 days notice for the bio's to be taken...I have read similar timelines from others posting on here. Notification is by mail and if you can't make it you have to reply by mail before the appointment date...making it near to impossible if you are not living in the US. Whether the interview/oath ceremony is on the same day depends what state you live in...in NJ it's the same day.

Bill_S

You really need to be asking a lawyer these questions, because you will be playing with fire if you try something like this. As a GC holder, your husband will be required to notify the immigration service of his change of address, and they likely will not be amused to find that he has moved to the UK. The question of his current address also will be asked at the interview, and I doubt the officer will be happy to hear that the address is in the UK. You are also forgetting about the fingerprinting step. At some point during the process he will need to be fingerprinted in the USA, which would mean another trip back to the USA on short notice. I'm not a lawyer, so I can't answer whether or not your plan is "impossible". It certainly sounds unlikely, though. The absolute worst thing that could happen is your husband being untruthful to the USCIS at some point about his address. If he's caught out pretending to live in the USA while really living in the UK then he will have big problems.

Rete

Most definitely he needs a US Passport before he leaves. He leaves the US as a USC and enters the UK as a British citizen.


Yes and No. Depends on the district office. Some, at least a relatively few of them, do it the same day. That said, all do it at least once a month.

As long as he is under 18, he is a USC as well when you or his father naturalize. All the children needs are US Passports. They can order theirs at the same time as the naturalized parent. In the future, if they wanted they could file form N-600 for a naturalization certificate.

That would depend on the amount of time he has already been outside of the US. This determines whether the chain of continual living presence in the US is valid for naturalization. Also he will need, if asked, to show that he is still a resident of the US at the time of the interview. If he is living and working in the UK, then he cannot do that. An immigration attorney is the best answer for this question.

He can return it to the USCIS DO with a letter stating that he is returning to the UK to live and work; or he could do nothing and just let it lapse; or he can return it to the US Consulate in London.

At present direct consular filing (DCF) take appropriately 3 to 6 months from start to finish.

unicorndreams

Hi,

Just take your time to think it through every which way. Like you say you dont want to get back to UK and then realise down the line you would like to come back to US but may have burned your bridges.

I did Naturalization. Filed in Nov 05. Think the fingerprints were Feb 06 and then the test/Interview was may 11th 06. Oath ceremony was not till June 30th 06.

Take care.
Hope it all works out for you in the end.