venkimani

hi all
I did the k3 visa interview on may 19 th ....i did the marriage both in the hindu way as well as the christian way ......my wife is a divorcee and for me its the first marriage.....she was aged 35 and me 29 at the time of marriage ....we did the marriage on 15/june 2002.....we had the marriage certificate based on the christian way.....(marriage certificate was based on sec 4 of 1872 act) where it specify that the minister can administer marriage if one or both the parties are christian ) since my wife is a christian i did n't get convert as i can do a marriage this way .....and it is valid as per indian laws . the marriage certificate was issued by the pasture .....(we had a copy which i gave it to my wife for filing) based on the pasture's marriage certificate i registered the marriage in the Inspector-general office and also got a marriage caertificate (3copies) .......2 copy i gave to my wife and i kept one ......at the time of interview i submitted this one copy which i had and did n't submit the pasture's marriage certificate .....
at the time of interview they asked for my conversion certificate since i had a christian marriage ....i said i have not bben converted and showed the marriage photo album which depics both marriage ........then the officer drilled me in the interview like asking if i married the girl for getting a green card ....how much did i paid my wife to get married etc ......but i answered calmly that i did n't pay any money nor i have married for the sake of green card ....i showed all our earlier photos emails letters etc .....then the officer gave me a 221(g) requesting ....
court certified divorce decree and special marriage act registration.....
after a 10 day i got the court certified divorce decree as well the marriage certificate issued by the pasture which was with my wife and i duly submitted the same
the officer looked at the photo album and gave it back to me .....then asked me to seat then called up again and asked me if i did a christian marriage .....i said yes and asked me to show the photo's which i did ...then asked me the demand draft to mail the visa which i did n't have at that juncture ....in the due course of our conversation he asked if i have been denied a visa earlier and to that i said yes on sep 2001 a visit visa ....which was after her visit to me in india ...then he asked for the photocopy of my wife's passport ....so for the above i got a 221(g) again ....i asked my wife to fax the entry pages of her passport ....... and went with the demand draft and the fax pages today.....the guy again asked for the photo album today .....but i did n't have that ......then he collected my DD .....then a lady came and asked abt 10 questions .....and they called my wife at US and asked the same 10 questions .......and finally said they are sending back my file to ins for reconsideration since both of our answers didn't match ..........
so i guess thats the end of my dream to get united with my wife at US ......is there a way out
warm regards
venki

Caro

They probably put you on administrative review... That has happened to a lot of people at Mumbai in Indian/Non-Indian marriages ("amys" comes to mind!). Apparently, it took time, but they finally got their visa.

Which 10 questions did they ask you? Were they questions where the answers could not differ (like what is her birthday, how many children does she have) or questions where the answers could easily differ (like what is her favorite dish)?

Good luck!
Caroline

amys

[QUOTE]Originally posted by venkimani
hi

I feel very bad for both of you. I know exactly the treatment you went through.

To tell you the truth, you will be waiting a long time for BCIS to respond. Returned petitions will be last priority for them.

I recomend getting a lawyer now to see what your options are. I have used a lawyer from NYC. He is very helpful and informative. he deals with difficult consulates eg as Mumbai. If you want his number and name, email me.

Believe me, we went through hell and back with mumbai.

amy

tara

Hello Venki,
Are you sure that your file is being sent back for "reconsideration"?

What papers were you given after the last visit?

i ask this because the "221(g)", "administrative review", "consular opinion" and "returning file for reconsideration" are all different animals.
Do you know the name of your Consular Officer? If not give us the physical description.

Best wishes

venkimani

hi tara ,
i do not know the consular officer 's name.....on 19 th may i met a guy who is abt 5.5' feet long small eyes,little hair .....for 221(g) i met another guy who is abt 5 feet well built aged around 40 with lil belly ...........they have send my file back to ins for reconsideration .................

venkimani

hi amy ...
kindly give me the lawyers contact address and phone number .....i will ask my wife to contact the lawyer ....my wife is also in search of a lawyer ....to deal with it

tara

Hello Venki,

i am truly sorry to hear this. In all the dealings with Mumbai that have passed by discussion boards, i have remember only one case sent back for reconsideration. It involved a couple where the Indian man had applied for some sort of quick divorce and the consulate did not accept it. This was close to 2 years ago and the couple quit posting, so the outcome is unkown.

On to what i do know about "reconsiderations". The Consulates are advised that this step should not be taken merely because the officer is suspicious of the marriage, but should be reserved for cases where the facts conclusively support a finding of fraud and the INS approved or reaffirmed the petition in contravention of the facts. Meaning that the CO feels that the petition should not have been approved in the first place.

There was a DOS memo directing consulates how and when to do this. You can read about that memo at:
http://www.vkblaw.com/news/sixhundredtwo.htm
http://travel.state.gov/state121801.html

Another memo concerning revocation and reconsideration:
http://www.imminfo.com/Resources/DOS...NewKinst1.html

Here is the framework that the AILA goes by in reconsideration cases:
http://www.aila.org/contentViewer.as...econsideration

i agree that it is time for an attorney. i do hope that one of the attorneys that frequent here will post something about your predicament.

To help others who may face what you are facing, please tell us what the 10 questions were, and how your and your wife's answers varied.

Best wishes,

ScarlettHill

So sorry to hear of the difficulties you are going through. Please don't give up hope. You're going to need the patience of a saint but in the end it will come right. Amys' case looked hopeless at one point but it eventually got sorted out. I suggest your wife contact her congressperson's immigration liaison officer as well as a lawyer.

Keep on keeping on!

Regards
-=-
Scarlett

venkimani

hi tara,
in my mood now i am not able to recollect all the 10 questions .....
i will try to as much as i can .....in my case my wife came down in june 25 ....then we came down to chennai and got married on july 15 .....i had taken a house at mumbai and we lived there after the marriage ....until she went back to US ....here goes the questions ....
what restaurent do i last took my wife ....
i said sadhna at mumbai
my wife gave a wrong answer saying chennai ....and did n't know the place
where we engaged before ....
we both said no as it is a love marriage
how the marriage took place
i said the gospel as my marriage certificate is based on that
my wife said hindu as well as at the gospel
how many people where present
i told 40
she said she did n't have the count but all my relatives and neighbours where present and mentioned around 30
when she came down to india to meet me first .....
i said may 29 2001 as thats the exact date she arrived
she was here in 2001 until june 24 2001
my wife told june 2001
where we went to honeymoon
i said at mumbai we looked at place around ....as i thought my wife would say abt our stay at mumbai
we where together at mumbai and i was working there and living with my wife and when time permits we went around ....but its not actual honey moon .....i had earlier mentioned to my wife to take her to goa but did n't
my wife said we did n't have a honeymoon .....we planed for goa but didn't
then they asked my dad 's name ,mom's name her dad's name and mom 's name....
which i gave correctly
my wife had probs in recollecting my mom's name
the rest she did ok
the next question was who was the eldest in youngest in both the families ....
i said my elder sis name vedanayaki alise shanthi
and i am the youngest
my wife said shanthi is eldest
and i am the last
i had problems in recollecting her eldest brother and her youngest brother name
i can recollect only these many questions at this juncture
i guess we just messed it up not knowing they will cross verify .........to have 100% correct answer
and in the tension we did spelt some wrong
hope people don't make such mistakes in the near future

George31

Dear God (whosoever), I hope not. They ask the 10 questions (or so) to
prove you are really intimately married. You do not share whether you were
together, where, to what degree (nor should you here), but that is I think
your stumbling block. They are looking to see if you really are married,
and by their contexts, that means, "did you live together?".

Did you (don't tell us)? Were you really married (by their measures)? Bear
in mind they are trying to prevent fraud.

"venkimani" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
    > hi all
    > I did the k3 visa interview on may 19 th ....i did the marriage both in
    > the hindu way as well as the christian way ......my wife is a divorcee
    > and for me its the first marriage.....she was aged 35 and me 29 at the
    > time of marriage ....we did the marriage on 15/june 2002.....we had the
    > marriage certificate based on the christian way.....(marriage
    > certificate was based on sec 4 of 1872 act) where it specify that the
    > minister can administer marriage if one or both the parties are
    > christian ) since my wife is a christian i did n't get convert as i can
    > do a marriage this way .....and it is valid as per indian laws . the
    > marriage certificate was issued by the pasture .....(we had a copy
    > which i gave it to my wife for filing) based on the pasture's marriage
    > certificate i registered the marriage in the Inspector-general office
    > and also got a marriage caertificate (3copies) .......2 copy i gave to
    > my wife and i kept one ......at the time of interview i submitted this
    > one copy which i had and did n't submit the pasture's marriage
    > certificate .....
    > at the time of interview they asked for my conversion certificate since
    > i had a christian marriage ....i said i have not bben converted and
    > showed the marriage photo album which depics both marriage
    > .......then the officer drilled me in the interview like asking if i
    > married the girl for getting a green card ....how much did i paid my
    > wife to get married etc ......but i answered calmly that i did n't pay
    > any money nor i have married for the sake of green card ....i showed all
    > our earlier photos emails letters etc .....then the officer gave me a
    > 221(g) requesting ....
    > court certified divorce decree and special marriage act
    > registration.....
    > after a 10 day i got the court certified divorce decree as well the
    > marriage certificate issued by the pasture which was with my wife
    > and i duly submitted the same
    > the officer looked at the photo album and gave it back to me .....then
    > asked me to seat then called up again and asked me if i did a christian
    > marriage .....i said yes and asked me to show the photo's which i
    > did ...then asked me the demand draft to mail the visa which i did n't
    > have at that juncture ....in the due course of our conversation he
    > asked if i have been denied a visa earlier and to that i said yes on sep
    > 2001 a visit visa ....which was after her visit to me in india ...then
    > he asked for the photocopy of my wife's passport ....so for the above
    > i got a 221(g) again ....i asked my wife to fax the entry pages of her
    > passport ....... and went with the demand draft and the fax pages
    > today.....the guy again asked for the photo album today .....but i did
    > n't have that ......then he collected my DD .....then a lady came and
    > asked abt 10 questions .....and they called my wife at US and asked
    > the same 10 questions .......and finally said they are sending back
    > my file to ins for reconsideration since both of our answers didn't
    > match ..........
    > so i guess thats the end of my dream to get united with my wife at US
    > .....is there a way out
    > warm regards
    > venki
    > --
    > Posted via http://britishexpats.com

venkimani

hi george
u need to understand .....me and my wife altogether have been together for less than 90 days from 2001 .....we met online and fall in love and did marry .....she knows nothing abt the places in india ....she was with me she comes along with me .....some place do stick in mind some do not ....same way i have never been to US .....in our chat life she did have mention abt her brothers ....but i did n't get their name and its a lot of tension every day when i step in to the consulate ......we have not transacted any money nor we have intension to fraud ....we are married and she would be my wife for ever .....please don't hurt feelings by u r words like
Did you (don't tell us)? Were you really married (by their measures)? Bear
in mind they are trying to prevent fraud.
......we would be united in some part of this globe and i belive in my love

ScarlettHill

I don't think George was suggesting fraud on your part, he was trying to show you where the consulate people were coming from and therefore the reasons they are doing what they are doing.

Personally I think it stinks. If they'd had long conversations with you and your wife it probably would have all unravelled and explained itself to them. Instead they fire 10 questions like some sick version of that awful Mr and Mrs gameshow - and bear in mind in that show many people can't answer simple things about someone they've lived with for years.

I think you're being discriminated against because you're from where you're from. At my interview I was asked only one question of this type - what was my fiance's birth date. And you know what? I was so stressed it went out of my head entirely even though we'd only recently celebrated it. After a while I remembered correctly the day and month and the guy didn't seem bothered that it took me so long - he was a reasonable human being and realised what a stressful day it was.

I'm so sorry you're going through this. I understand the arguments for security. But I think it's time the discrimination that flourishes rampantly in the name of that security stopped. I'd like to see everyone going through the same process, regardless of where they're from. Mumbai consulate is a disgrace from everything I've heard and humiliates people unnecessarily just because it can.

I'm so sorry.....

Regards
-=-
Scarlett

Caro

And also, it was your native language... Having a fiance visa interview in english, can make it so much more stressful when it is not your native language!

Caroline

Khadija

I agree with Scarlett. It's not personal although it's almost impossible to not to take it that way. In theory, their job is to week out those idividuals who wantingly and knowingly get engaged to or married to USCs for the sake of a green card.

One only has to read the postings about fraud on this NG to know this occurs all too frequently. Or, at least frequently enough, to make consular officers suspicious. Also in the "sad but true" category if the fact the probably most of the fraud occurs with citizens from developing countries looking to escape the poverty and misery in their lives by marrying out it and going to the States.

I, too, am fearful my husband will be grilled. He's from Egypt and has been unemployed since 9/11 when tourism to his country plummeted. He as a bachelor's degree in history - hardly a ticket to employment in a country with unemployment in double digits - plus he's only now seriously studying English. He comes from a good family, we've been married a year and a half, have our own flat, share a bank account, and I've been to Egypt almost a half dozen times. Still, I'm well-employed, 13 years older than him, don't speak fluent Arabic, we're from different cultures and, until I converted last year, different religions - all "red flags" for a consular officer who's already geared to think the worst. I fear, under pressure, my husband could easily forget my mother's name (her legal name is Mildred but her nickname is Pat), or the year of my father's death, what I do for a living (I work for a not-for-profit association managing their standards development activities and I have friends here who still can't get it), or some other picayune detail. Just as I, if they decided to call me in the middle of the night, might give an answer which wouldn't "match" his - like whether it is his mother or father who hails from a family of 9!

Scarlett is absolutely right that this process should be blind. Just because the instances of fraud are probably greater from developing doesn't mean those from developed countries are immune! There is a built in bias that, just because one if from Europe one doesn't "need" to live in the States so it must be a marriage made in heaven! Crooks and bad people come from everywhere, not just poor countries. You, nor my husband shouldn't be subjected to anything better or worse than the next beneficiary simply because you are from India and he is from Egypt.

Good luck and, in time, the Consulate will realize your marriage is real. Hopefully, your I-130 will be processed in the near future but with enough time between so you can gather more proof for these folks at the Consulate - "kill 'em with kindness" and evidence. You'll eventually prevail.

Patty Khadijah

salooni110

hang in there venkimani,
we are also on admin review, but they did not give us a reason. they just said it was routine and not to worry about it. they also took all his original documents and gave a time of 45 days.
lets see what happens next.