CalgaryAMC

Trepidation is something one feels. I am glad that you did not feel a disproportionate amount of trepidation. You assessed the information objectively and responded appropriately, by declaring your information and not - I hope - losing any sleep over it.

Others have, I think, been unduly worried, because going through this process is nervewracking. When they see "traffic violations" and "considered serious and a breach of good moral conduct" in the same sentence, alarm bells start ringing, which are hard to switch off once they've started.

I am glad Rete posted her experiences on traffic tickets. "I am not dismissing them as irrelevant, I am suggesting that there should not be a disproportionate amount of trepidation about it."

Ranjini

To be quite truthful, there need be no disproportionate trepidation about the entire process unless one has a criminal record or a serious medical condition to begin with. Thereafter, just follow the instructions and prepare your paper work carefully and you will have absolutely no problem. I speak from our own personal experience. Just delays and more delays....
If you can keep this sensible approach and a level head on your shoulders I think you should be just fine.
Good luck and my best wishes,
Ranjini

mstracy

I don't have this to worry about for some while but I can't see how anyone who has even visited the UK, let alone lived there could be honest about the question "Have you EVER committed a crime or offense for which you were NOT arrested?" as there are still many laws which have not been repealed and make just existing, technically a crime. For instance, to name but one (which has always been my favorite) within my lifetime, it has been a law that each surf (common man) should practice weekly on the village green with his bow in defense of his lord or sherif. Whilst this was needed in the middle ages, if you were to obey this law in modern times you would have been guilty of using an offensive weapon in a public place; no-win! I think that this law was repealed in the mid 80's but as such I am guilty of breaking that one each week for years during my early adulthood. I'm sure that every country has it's share of such laws. Should these be included? Where is the border between truth and pedantism when it come to swearing that the information on the application is true and correct? There is no room in this for what you understand to be correct or believe to be correct, this is asking you to attest to it being correct: absolute!

Mark

mstracy

I don't have this to worry about for some while but I can't see how anyone who has even visited the UK, let alone lived there could be honest about the question "Have you EVER committed a crime or offense for which you were NOT arrested?" as there are still many laws which have not been repealed and make just existing, technically a crime. For instance, to name but one (which has always been my favorite) within my lifetime, it has been a law that each surf (common man) should practice weekly on the village green with his bow in defense of his lord or sherif. Whilst this was needed in the middle ages, if you were to obey this law in modern times you would have been guilty of using an offensive weapon in a public place; no-win! I think that this law was repealed in the mid 80's but as such I am guilty of breaking that one each week for years during my early adulthood. I'm sure that every country has it's share of such laws. Should these be included? Where is the border between truth and pedantism when it come to swearing that the information on the application is true and correct? There is no room in this for what you understand to be correct or believe to be correct, this is asking you to attest to it being correct: absolute!

Mark

CalgaryAMC

You're right of course. When I showed it to a friend of mine, and told him I was having to dredge up my old speeding tickets, he said to me: "speeding tickets? That's the least of it!" To truly answer the question, of course, would require hundreds upon hundreds of pages. Every time you snuck through that amber light and didn't get caught, every time you went over the speed limit, or jaywalked, or dropped a cigarette butt on the floor...

It is one of those silly questions that I suspect is asked only so that you may be beaten over the head with it should USCIS feel the need to in the future.

mstracy

It's not just the laws you know you've broken, but also in reality asks you to give details of the laws you've broken that you don't even know exist!

I don't mind having to describe anything I know about even if it does go into hundreds of pages, I have great difficulty with being asked to give details of something I don't know about and then swear it's all perfectly correct!

Mark

Mrraveltay

sarina wrote:

    > oh my god... i m almost getting ready to apply for N-400 less than
    > 60days left(with the will of god).. after 3 consultation from three
    > different lawyers..

Why 3 lawyers?

and knowing 3 personal freinds(in the last 2 yrs)
    > who have gotten their citizenships(with tickets whom did not disclose)..
    > i do not plan on disclosing my two traffic violations( given in june03
    > and one in jan04)... I will tell you all how it goes.. I think a big
    > deal is being made of nothing.... everyone that i know has had traffic
    > tickets... now if u had warrant issued or something for not showing up
    > or paying the ticket on time.. that may be a different story.. and why
    > does it not include traffic or moving violation in the "guide to
    > naturalization" when it gives example of morals--

No, but you are required to list if you have been fined on the
application. Reporting of offenses is not restricted to only reporting
those of moral turpitude.

Rete

Your logical is illogical

Rete

Ranjini

What you do or don't do is entirely your concern. I personally think you should pay closer attention to what the adjudicator told Rete's husband at his interview.

Let's see what the N-400 says:

"Have you EVER been arrested, cited, or detained by any law enforcement officer (including INS and Military officers) for any reason?

It does not specifically mention traffic violations. But it is significant that the form just before this revised one did say something like "exlcuding traffic violations" but the current form does not.

It may help that you have decided to take a copy with you. Because the adjudicator does go through the entire form with you. At least ours did.

Also remember what the Natz guide says.
"The “Application for Naturalization� (Form N-400) asks several question about crimes. You should report all crimes committed you have committed including the ones that have been expunged (removed from your record) and ones that happened before your 18th birthday. If you do not tell INS about these crimes and we find out about them, you may be denied naturalization (even if the crime itself was not a crime for which your case could be denied.)"

Personally, I don't see why you are making such a big deal about a couple of speeding tickets. I would save myself the trouble and just include them. But again, what you do is entirely upto you Just my two cents.
Good luck.

Waterpony

Hi Rita,

This would be my great pleasure. Please let me know when you are in the area, I'll be more than happy to have a cup with you...how about Cafe Du Monde?