Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
Apr 3rd 2009, 7:52 am
#16
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Posts: 2
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
Hi:
The sentence in bold does not hang together with your OP in this thread. The I-601 is essentially a cover sheet for the application.
I'm not even sure if you need a waiver application in the first place. And if you do, it is the supporting documentation that is the key.
As you correctly point out, attorneys are not allowed to accompany you to the interview. In my opinion, that is even more reason to consult an attorney before the interview in order to be properly prepared.
And if you do need a waiver, the equivalent of a $3000 fee in the US does not strike me as unreasonable. And "in country" legal fees for the UK generally are higher. You need not hire an "in country" lawyer is that is your desire.
The sentence in bold does not hang together with your OP in this thread. The I-601 is essentially a cover sheet for the application.
I'm not even sure if you need a waiver application in the first place. And if you do, it is the supporting documentation that is the key.
As you correctly point out, attorneys are not allowed to accompany you to the interview. In my opinion, that is even more reason to consult an attorney before the interview in order to be properly prepared.
And if you do need a waiver, the equivalent of a $3000 fee in the US does not strike me as unreasonable. And "in country" legal fees for the UK generally are higher. You need not hire an "in country" lawyer is that is your desire.
The second entry complicates matters I am sure. How much I have no idea.
Apr 3rd 2009, 10:18 am
#17
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Posts: 16,266
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
I figured that out. If so, then why is she talking about "one form"? Also, her interview will have been in June 2008 -- there are other issues involved.
And her question about the intervening VWP visit is a good one -- I think I know the answer, but I am not sure. And no attorney should not give advice if they are not sure, or at least they can say I'm not sure.
Whether she hires a lawyer or not, that is her decision in any case.
Apr 3rd 2009, 10:33 am
#18
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 35,082
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
Hi:
I figured that out. If so, then why is she talking about "one form"? Also, her interview will have been in June 2008 -- there are other issues involved.
And her question about the intervening VWP visit is a good one -- I think I know the answer, but I am not sure. And no attorney should not give advice if they are not sure, or at least they can say I'm not sure.
Whether she hires a lawyer or not, that is her decision in any case.
I figured that out. If so, then why is she talking about "one form"? Also, her interview will have been in June 2008 -- there are other issues involved.
And her question about the intervening VWP visit is a good one -- I think I know the answer, but I am not sure. And no attorney should not give advice if they are not sure, or at least they can say I'm not sure.
Whether she hires a lawyer or not, that is her decision in any case.
After the ban finishes.
3 yr ban to be lifted July, husband here not in US as stated on visa form
It's a little hard to put it all together.
Apr 3rd 2009, 7:51 pm
#19
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Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 71
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
Yes that is correct I am waiting out the ban, I know we would need a lawyer if we did the hardship waiver but we aren't doing that. DS-230-1 is the form I have to complete, which I have already done for the last application.
Apr 3rd 2009, 11:00 pm
#20
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 16,266
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
One big thing I simply don't understand -- you say the ConOff said you were subject to the 3 year ban. But your post suggests strongly that you were not. However, you do not give a time line of your dealing with immigration on the 2006 sojourn in the US.
Don't assume the ConOff was right -- they make mistakes too.
Apr 3rd 2009, 11:10 pm
#21
American Expat
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 7,598
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
Just to recap. You overstayed the VWP by 6 months and a week prior to departing the US sometime in July of 2006? So hypothetically, the 3 year bar would elapse sometime in July of 2009? You had a failed adjustment of status, and the travelled without incident on the VWP twice before learning from the consulate about the 3 year bar? Now you're in the process of seeking an immigrant visa, but will wait until the 3 years has elapsed?
Did I leave anything out?
Some firm dates on the VWP entry, and from what happened with the AOS application could be helpful.
The pending AOS application may have discounted some of the 6+ months of unlawful presence. I think that's what Mr. F. is getting at.
Did I leave anything out?
Some firm dates on the VWP entry, and from what happened with the AOS application could be helpful.
The pending AOS application may have discounted some of the 6+ months of unlawful presence. I think that's what Mr. F. is getting at.
Last edited by crg; Apr 3rd 2009 at 11:19 pm.
Apr 3rd 2009, 11:30 pm
#22
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 16,266
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
Just to recap. You overstayed the VWP by 6 months and a week prior to departing the US sometime in July of 2006? So hypothetically, the 3 year bar would elapse sometime in July of 2009? You had a failed adjustment of status, and the travelled without incident on the VWP twice before learning from the consulate about the 3 year bar? Now you're in the process of seeking an immigrant visa, but will wait until the 3 years has elapsed?
Did I leave anything out?
Some firm dates on the VWP entry, and from what happened with the AOS application could be helpful.
The pending AOS application may have discounted some of the 6+ months of unlawful presence. I think that's what Mr. F. is getting at.
Did I leave anything out?
Some firm dates on the VWP entry, and from what happened with the AOS application could be helpful.
The pending AOS application may have discounted some of the 6+ months of unlawful presence. I think that's what Mr. F. is getting at.
Not bad.
To be honest, I'm still amazed that people trust what government officials tell them.
Apr 3rd 2009, 11:45 pm
#23
American Expat
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 7,598
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
I was looking into the airline baggage allowances for an international flight. My wife told me to just call the airline and ask. I didn't want to get to the ticket counter, be charged extra, and try the "But Sally on the phone said I can get a free bag for this international lap child."
I printed their policy off the web site. The lady at the ticket counter (both ways) tried to disallow the baby's one free bag and charge me for it. "The baby doesn't get a bag" she said. I handed her the written policy with the highlighted section. She, without reading it, repeated what she said before.
I told her that the written material from her corporate web site was quite informative, but in order to benefit from it, she actually had to angle the paper towards her face, and point her eyes at the paper.
I got the free bag I was entitled to. If I had relied on what they told me, it would have cost me.
Apr 4th 2009, 3:02 am
#24
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Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 71
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
Just to recap. You overstayed the VWP by 6 months and a week prior to departing the US sometime in July of 2006? So hypothetically, the 3 year bar would elapse sometime in July of 2009? You had a failed adjustment of status, and the travelled without incident on the VWP twice before learning from the consulate about the 3 year bar? Now you're in the process of seeking an immigrant visa, but will wait until the 3 years has elapsed?
Did I leave anything out?
Some firm dates on the VWP entry, and from what happened with the AOS application could be helpful.
The pending AOS application may have discounted some of the 6+ months of unlawful presence. I think that's what Mr. F. is getting at.
Did I leave anything out?
Some firm dates on the VWP entry, and from what happened with the AOS application could be helpful.
The pending AOS application may have discounted some of the 6+ months of unlawful presence. I think that's what Mr. F. is getting at.
June 23 05 flew to US on VWP to meet up with my future husband, he was only a friend then, married him in US on 5th Aug 05, left US within 3 month VWP allowance in Aug 05 for S Korea to teach.
We did not enjoy it and left Oct 1st 05. Flew to US in Oct 05 with a 2week ticket to leave,which I cancelled and stayed on. Within my 3 months VWP I went to Sacramento to ask if I could adjust status and if it took longer than my 3 months visa would it be a problem, the officer said as long as I had started the progress it was OK. So I started about Nov 05.
In April 06 I had a visa interview. Realised my husband couldn't sponsor me, he did not have property, or a 5 year's worth of income, he had retrained mid career to become a teacher, and so had student year's income or lack of up till when we married, he was by now employed in a school and had a contract for the next year but that was not good enough, we could not get a co-sponsor and like I said couldn't manage to get back to UK, sell my property all within the 90 days I was given.
So I left with him (yes we now know he should have stayed and we would be there now) on July 6th 2006 within the 90 day time scale.
Retrained in UK to become a teacher. My husband taught here in UK.
In Mar 07 I reapplied for another visa to live in US, having written to the visa authority people in CA to say I was abandoning the case.
In Aug 07 my husband started working in Nevada. He visited UK at Christmas/New Year. We decided I could go and visit him in Jan 08 (I had heard nothing yet about ban or interview in London) I had finished my training and had no job, sold my flat, living with my mother, my father having recently died. So I flew to Toronto, Canada. My cousin who lives in Buffalo, collected me in her car. I had a 3 week ticket.
I stayed about a week, then bought a ticket to Nevada, stayed with my husband, till Apr 08, within my 90 days visa, left US.
June 08 had my visa interview in London. Told I may have overstayed in 05/06, I mean I knew I had overstayed of course more than the 3 months, but I did not know it was a problem as I had left when I was told to, well I know now, but didn't then. She just said she could see I had entered the country in Jan 08, I said I had, she asked if I had any problems, I said no and then she told me they would contact me again.
I went back for a further interview in Aug 08,where they told me I had a 3 year ban due to the overstay, I had two options, to apply for a hardship waiver or to wait out the ban, if I was waiting it out, I was to write and tell them. This I have done.
They said I can resubmit the DS 230 in April, get a new medical (have done that) and get a new police report (am waiting on it coming back). That is my story.
Last edited by meauxna; Apr 4th 2009 at 3:58 am. Reason: to add some paragraph breaks
Apr 4th 2009, 4:06 am
#25
American Expat
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 7,598
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
OK let me tell you in more detail. June 23 05 flew to US on VWP to meet up with my future husband, he was only a friend then, married him in US on 5th Aug 05, left US within 3 month VWP allowance in Aug 05 for S Korea to teach. We did not enjoy it and left Oct 1st 05. Flew to US in Oct 05 with a 2week ticket to leave,which I cancelled and stayed on. Within my 3 months VWP I went to Sacramento to ask if I could adjust status and if it took longer than my 3 months visa would it be a problem, the officer said as long as I had started the progress it was OK. So I started about Nov 05. In April 06 I had a visa interview. Realised my husband couldn't sponsor me, he did not have property, or a 5 year's worth of income, he had retrained mid career to become a teacher, and so had student year's income or lack of up till when we married, he was by now employed in a school and had a contract for the next year but that was not good enough, we could not get a co-sponsor and like I said couldn't manage to get back to UK, sell my property all within the 90 days I was given. So I left with him (yes we now know he should have stayed and we would be there now) on July 6th 2006 within the 90 day time scale. Retrained in UK to become a teacher. My husband taught here in UK. In Mar 07 I reapplied for another visa to live in US, having written to the visa authority people in CA to say I was abandoning the case. In Aug 07 my husband started working in Nevada. He visited UK at Christmas/New Year. We decided I could go and visit him in Jan 08 (I had heard nothing yet about ban or interview in London) I had finished my training and had no job, sold my flat, living with my mother, my father having recently died. So I flew to Toronto, Canada. My cousin who lives in Buffalo, collected me in her car. I had a 3 week ticket. I stayed about a week, then bought a ticket to Nevada, stayed with my husband, till Apr 08, within my 90 days visa, left US. June 08 had my visa interview in London. Told I may have overstayed in 05/06, I mean I knew I had overstayed of course more than the 3 months, but I did not know it was a problem as I had left when I was told to, well I know now, but didn't then. She just said she could see I had entered the country in Jan 08, I said I had, she asked if I had any problems, I said no and then she told me they would contact me again. I went back for a further interview in Aug 08,where they told me I had a 3 year ban due to the overstay, I had two options, to apply for a hardship waiver or to wait out the ban, if I was waiting it out, I was to write and tell them. This I have done. They said I can resubmit the DS 230 in April, get a new medical (have done that) and get a new police report (am waiting on it coming back). That is my story.
Entered on VWP October 2005.
Submitted paperwork November 2005.
January 2006 VWP admission would have expired.
Had an interview in April 2006.
Departed the US July of 2006.
Did you submit the I-485 and the I-130 on or about 11/2005 or just the I-130?
Apr 4th 2009, 4:12 am
#26
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Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 71
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
yes , just checked my I-797C notice of Action pages and I have one for a I130 received Oct 05 and for I 485 Dec 05.
Apr 4th 2009, 4:18 am
#27
American Expat
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 7,598
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
A timely filed, nonfrivoulous pending I-485 should have insulated you from unlawful presence.
From the Foreign Affairs Manual:
b. DHS has interpreted "period of stay authorized by the Secretary of Homeland Security" (DHS) to include:
........
(5) For aliens who have properly filed an application for adjustment of status to that of a lawful permanent resident, the entire period of the pendency of the application, even if the application is subsequently denied or abandoned, provided the alien did not file for adjustment "defensively" (i.e., after deportation proceedings had already been initiated)
Apr 4th 2009, 4:27 am
#28
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 71
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
As Mr. F. had suspected, it appears that you didn't have six months of unlawful presence because the time the I-485 was pending didn't count against you. If you didn't show the information about the I-485 to the embassy, they would likely assume that a 3 year bar was in effect.
A timely filed, nonfrivoulous pending I-485 should have insulated you from unlawful presence.
From the Foreign Affairs Manual:
b. DHS has interpreted "period of stay authorized by the Secretary of Homeland Security" (DHS) to include:
........
(5) For aliens who have properly filed an application for adjustment of status to that of a lawful permanent resident, the entire period of the pendency of the application, even if the application is subsequently denied or abandoned, provided the alien did not file for adjustment "defensively" (i.e., after deportation proceedings had already been initiated)
A timely filed, nonfrivoulous pending I-485 should have insulated you from unlawful presence.
From the Foreign Affairs Manual:
b. DHS has interpreted "period of stay authorized by the Secretary of Homeland Security" (DHS) to include:
........
(5) For aliens who have properly filed an application for adjustment of status to that of a lawful permanent resident, the entire period of the pendency of the application, even if the application is subsequently denied or abandoned, provided the alien did not file for adjustment "defensively" (i.e., after deportation proceedings had already been initiated)
Well that is why I was so shocked when I was told I was banned for 3 years. She said I was OK as long as I was in US, but as soon as I left it became a problem. I can't exactly argue with her can I? I mean it would only irritate her and make her even more likely to impose said ban. So I am waiting to hear from London about where I have to send my stuff exactly, as normally you get a covering page with a bar code to send in any forms, this time I don't have that as I am waiting on the ban being lifted. I have queried the date as well, they said in an email it was set at July 23rd 2009, I have asked how they came up with that date as I left US on July 6th 2006. Just had acknowledgment to email no answer yet.
Apr 4th 2009, 11:15 am
#29
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Thread Starter
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 71
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
As Mr. F. had suspected, it appears that you didn't have six months of unlawful presence because the time the I-485 was pending didn't count against you. If you didn't show the information about the I-485 to the embassy, they would likely assume that a 3 year bar was in effect.
A timely filed, nonfrivoulous pending I-485 should have insulated you from unlawful presence.
From the Foreign Affairs Manual:
b. DHS has interpreted "period of stay authorized by the Secretary of Homeland Security" (DHS) to include:
........
(5) For aliens who have properly filed an application for adjustment of status to that of a lawful permanent resident, the entire period of the pendency of the application, even if the application is subsequently denied or abandoned, provided the alien did not file for adjustment "defensively" (i.e., after deportation proceedings had already been initiated)
A timely filed, nonfrivoulous pending I-485 should have insulated you from unlawful presence.
From the Foreign Affairs Manual:
b. DHS has interpreted "period of stay authorized by the Secretary of Homeland Security" (DHS) to include:
........
(5) For aliens who have properly filed an application for adjustment of status to that of a lawful permanent resident, the entire period of the pendency of the application, even if the application is subsequently denied or abandoned, provided the alien did not file for adjustment "defensively" (i.e., after deportation proceedings had already been initiated)
Apr 4th 2009, 12:57 pm
#30
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 16,266
Re: Calculate ban? Inadmissibility?
Not exactly. But lawyers skilled in consular practice have to develop the skill of kissing ass while making inquiries and striking every single WTF or similar language from our inquiries. [I'm working on one of these now]
ConOff's are human too and make mistakes.
