http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...s-chants-spurs

WTF? We are the Yids.

Yid Army.

It's an interesting thought that anyone would try to get them to stop it? I have been to lots of Spurs matches (don't understand a thing, but went out with someone who did, and then our Company got a box at Spurs) and was amazed at some of the chants, they were so fast and funny...and not so politically correct! Most 'old' teams for anything, be it ice hockey or football (cricket?) would have started with some form of religious affiliation wouldn't they?

I don't know about most but I don't think it's uncommon. Celtic and Rangers are obvious examples.

David Badiel had this to say on it:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...race-hate-word

No idea personally. It is true that within some groups (homosexuals and blacks, for example) the in-group are able to use former-derogatory terms in an ironic-proud way that the out-group is unable to use. It seems slightly hypocritical, but I suppose there is a logic somewhere.

A tricky debate.

When Spurs fans use it it is non offensive. It does however bring the worst out of other fans who try to taunt on the jewish connection. This does not bother Tottenham fans but it does bother David Badiel when the person sitting next to him is taunting jews because he is one.

All that being said they are trying to dumb down football crowds to the mundane atmosphere of a North American sports arena. I hope it does not get that far.

If he doesn't want to be a crowd that enjoys racist taunts, he should stop supporting Chelski.

The few American sports matches I've been to, most people seem more interested in their cheesy nachos and hot dogs than they do with what's going on the pitch.

It is a bit tricky isn't it... It feels as though words like "nigger" and "queer" have now acquired a far greater impact due to the sort of linguistic prohibition that's been applied to them in recent times. I now wince when hearing these terms used in almost any context, whereas growing up in the 70s these words and others were so ubiquitous as to be virtually meaningless (to a white, heterosexual anyway).

I don't wish to use the terms myself, but sometimes wonder, if by making these words sacred, as we seem to have done, have we just made them all the more powerful?

Undoubtedly those words were not meaningless to those whom the words described, and that has led to the quasi-prohibition. Having said that, listen to any rap or hip-hop and you do wonder what all the fuss is about!

"Queer" has nowhere near the derogatory impact it used to have, as evidenced for instance by the TV program "Queer Eye for the Straight Guy" and indeed the word "gay" has for all intents been divorced from its original meaning.

Yid is not being reclaimed in the manner of nigger or queer. Yid has evolved and no longer means only "Jew" but also "Tottenham supporter, probably Jewish", Jermaine Defoe, for example, is a yiddo but he's not Jewish. If one wanted to refer to the fact of someone being Jewish in a mildly derogatory fashion one might use "binnie" of "fourbe".

This piece amused me, especially the description of Brian May:

http://www.thejc.com/comment-and-deb...otic-bandwagon

Oh dear, Brian May, and he was doing do well, guitar legend of the rock world, completed his PhD in astronomy from Imperial, and then he decides to apply all that talent to a relative non-issue like badgers.

No idea about Yids or Yiddery or football for that matter. Football chanting is an issue only slightly above badgers in importance IMO.

In retrospect maybe I should have written "certain words or phrases" instead of choosing two actual terms off the top of my head, as I suppose everyone has their own particular hierarchy of offensiveness and taste when it comes to such things.

Is "ginge" an offensive term or simply a statement of fact?

As ever, it is not the words that are used that are offensive, it is the intention behind them.

Making monkey noises at black players is definitely not on. However, during a derby game calling Millwall fans knuckle draggers, Brighton fans gayboys, Palace fans stripey nigels, Spurs fans yids or Man U fans w*nk*rs is pretty much OK in my view. It is just banter, nobody believes it is true (OK, maybe not the case for Man U), it is just to wind the other fans up. It is also largely consensual. You know what you are going to get at a football match. In some games I have been to the banter between fans was much more entertaining that the football.