Originally Posted by Souvenir

Yes. I can see him expressing that opinion but the abusive remark is not the hallmark of someone behaving rationally.

Originally Posted by dbd33

"wankers" is abusive now? In the context of a British site I'd think "fools" more harsh.

Originally Posted by Souvenir

Consider who the remark was aimed at.

Originally Posted by dbd33

Us, for agreeing with Iain's rather maudlin post. I assume a chiding rather than abusive tone.

Originally Posted by dbd33

Us, for agreeing with Iain's rather maudlin post. I assume a chiding rather than abusive tone.

Originally Posted by fledermaus

You think it was more a "get a grip chaps" post??

I think Iain was right to post though, to correct the idea that Remembrance Day is a celebration of military might rather than of suffering.

Originally Posted by CaptainHook

According to Wikipedia, Remembrance Day is a statutory Provincial holiday in every Province and Territory except Ontario and Quebec. The banks here in Ontario will however be closed for the day.

Originally Posted by iaink

Kind of out of character for you Novo? You are either trolling, or totally missing the point. One thing Ive found talking to the old soldiers at the rememberance parades is that they dont hold a grudge against those they were fighting, they were just following orders too. There is almost a sort of camaraderie among all those caught up in the whole bloody mess.

Rememberance day remembers all those who fought. Granted, the funds from poppy sales go to the legion here, but for me and many others its not about the money.

Originally Posted by Oakvillian

thank you for that insightful commentary. I would have thought someone of your obvious intellect would understand the purpose of remembrance - not only to recollect, primarily for the benefit of the surviving comrades and relatives, the dead on all sides in past conflict; but also to try to remind our current crop of politicians that war is a hideous thing and should not be entered into lightly.

It's a shame that particular message doesn't seem to have gotten through to the current US administration, and that other Western governments are too lily-livered to stand in defiance of US foreign policy, but political positioning is absolutely not, and never has been the point of Armistice Day, just as much as jingoistic nationalism is not the point either.

As George Santayana said (and the full quote is rather better than the oft-misquoted abbreviations):
"Progress, far from consisting in change, depends on retentiveness. When change is absolute there remains no being to improve and no direction is set for possible improvement: and when experience is not retained, as among savages, infancy is perpetual. Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

Originally Posted by Souvenir

Given that he posted at nearly midnight, it's a fair bet that insight and intellect had gone out of the window.

Originally Posted by Souvenir

You left out MB, NS and NWT.

Bloody confusing, this bank holiday business.

Originally Posted by Novocastrian

Ok, I was a bit over the top. Apologies if I seemed abusive. Nonetheless, this whole concept of "our" troops sticks in the craw (if that's English).

Someone up-thread said remembrance day shouldn't be political, but it is inherently political. Exercise of power by nation states is political. It's fatuous to sugar coat it with the fund raising for the veterans stuff.

I don't suppose there's anybody on here who didn't lose a relative WW1, but I don't suppose there are many at all who ever knew that relative. It was 90 years ago. Time to move on.

Originally Posted by Souvenir

I've got the Congo pencilled for next Tuesday, weather permitting.

Originally Posted by Novocastrian

Exactly. Could you fit in Somalia, Rwanda and perhaps Angola on Wednesday?

Originally Posted by Souvenir

I'll take issue with a couple of your points.

It's not about "our" troops but about all the poor bastards on all sides that died in wars they didn't start .... Several generations have no idea of what man can do to man for no worthwhile purpose. I think Remembrance Day and all that comes with it has a very real use; to remind and educate people about what can happen, if it is allowed to.

I've got the Congo pencilled for next Tuesday, weather permitting.

Originally Posted by Novocastrian

What purpose does glorification of unspeakable horror serve in your opinion?