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PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

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Old Dec 16th 2015, 3:12 pm
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Default PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

I saw this and thought it might be of interest to those contemplating buying property in Canada and the incomes required.

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/3787312/original.jpg
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 3:55 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

It seems from the chart that the price of houses is about seven times the needed income.

How does that work; are houses usually purchased by working threesomes each of whom generates the "needed income"?
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 3:58 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by plasticcanuck
I saw this and thought it might be of interest to those contemplating buying property in Canada and the incomes required.

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/3787312/original.jpg
Interesting, I was shocked at the average price for the Hamilton area although the market did see the biggest gain in Canada (16%); I know it's the 'average' but I know of many houses for sale here under $250k.

Average Hamilton house price jumps 16.4% in past year - Latest Hamilton news - CBC Hamilton

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Old Dec 16th 2015, 4:02 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

when it comes down to what you can afford, your down payment, the LTV etc, the lowest 5 year term variable rate at present (google is your friend) through a broker is 1.99%. So, for every $100,000 of mortgage it'll cost $212/mth in mortgage payments.

Go from there

Compare Canadian mortgage rates and credit cards - Find the best rates and cards in Canada - RateHub.ca
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 4:42 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

It doesn't really reflect what TD mortgage affordability calculator comes up with. An income of $55,000 with 10% down payment only nets you a mortgage of about $250,000 max.

We'll probably move next year. Current house doesn't really suit our needs and we have a couple who want to buy it privately. Trying to figure out what the next move will be tricky- far trickier than back home!

Last edited by Tirytory; Dec 16th 2015 at 5:14 pm.
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 5:07 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by Siouxie
Interesting, I was shocked at the average price for the Hamilton area although the market did see the biggest gain in Canada (16%); I know it's the 'average' but I know of many houses for sale here under $250k.
I am so glad you posted that. I had the following drafted after many edits and then I looked to see if anyone else had commented.

I know the term 'average' means some will be more and some less but it does sort of put people off even looking.

I was just looking at assessed values the other day in my neighbourhood.

I know it's not the same as market value but the differences are a guide and I do know the asking price for houses in the area when we were house hunting. There were two just across from us that we looked at.

My house is actually the highest assessed value in the street and one of the highest in the surrounding streets.

We live in a very nice neighbourhood, close to shops, schools, hospital and minutes away from a major road with transit.

We're about $25k below that average figure and I know there are perfectly decent houses in good areas for much less. Playing around with the price range I can see twice as many houses up to $175k as over.


Occasionally I look at other areas of Canada to see what might be affordable for us (using capital additional to the equity in the current home) and there's a whole bunch of options either side of Toronto. From this graphic, Hamilton is listed as an astonishing average of $448k.

Now, I have no idea what the areas are like but an MLS search comes up with over 100 homes for under $200k and nearly half are detached houses.

Maybe Siouxie will confirm whether they're all in horrible areas or about to fall down or both.

Depending on where you draw the boundary lines a bit more than half of the houses in my town are under the average cost while about two-thirds of Hamilton's houses are under it's average.

Looking at the up-scale properties it seems that Hamilton's average is distorted by many houses for a few million or more.

In central Moncton less than 10% of houses for sale are over $300k.

This is perhaps one of those cases where average doesn't really represent the average person.
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 6:39 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by BristolUK


Occasionally I look at other areas of Canada to see what might be affordable for us (using capital additional to the equity in the current home) and there's a whole bunch of options either side of Toronto. From this graphic, Hamilton is listed as an astonishing average of $448k.

Now, I have no idea what the areas are like but an MLS search comes up with over 100 homes for under $200k and nearly half are detached houses.

Maybe Siouxie will confirm whether they're all in horrible areas or about to fall down or both.

In central Moncton less than 10% of houses for sale are over $300k.

This is perhaps one of those cases where average doesn't really represent the average person.[/I]
The average price doesn't really work. Take for instance in my neck of the woods

http://www.durhamrealestate.org/uploads/marketwatch.pdf

I picked Oshawa, which from the looks of listings is similar to Moncton?

First one 3 bedroom for $239,900

https://www.realtor.ca/Residential/S...1J1K2-Lakeview

Second one at $235,000 with a basement apartment

https://www.realtor.ca/Residential/S...L1H5B2-Central
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 7:06 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

The chart for at least 1 area of BC is a little misleading by including Mission and Abbotsford, Mission's lower prices water down the averages, and if you exclude Mission, my guess is the average in Abby will be higher then is listed.

Originally Posted by Tirytory
It doesn't really reflect what TD mortgage affordability calculator comes up with. An income of $55,000 with 10% down payment only nets you a mortgage of about $250,000 max.

We'll probably move next year. Current house doesn't really suit our needs and we have a couple who want to buy it privately. Trying to figure out what the next move will be tricky- far trickier than back home!
I don't know if it makes a difference to what TD calculator says, but the chart is based on a 20% down payment.



Appears that only Atlantic Canada, & Windsor, ON are within our buying zone... But then again our income in those places would be lower and we wouldn't have access to a low income mortgage, so probably still couldn't afford to buy......
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 8:16 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by Jsmth321
The chart for at least 1 area of BC is a little misleading by including Mission and Abbotsford, Mission's lower prices water down the averages, and if you exclude Mission, my guess is the average in Abby will be higher then is listed.



I don't know if it makes a difference to what TD calculator says, but the chart is based on a 20% down payment.



Appears that only Atlantic Canada, & Windsor, ON are within our buying zone... But then again our income in those places would be lower and we wouldn't have access to a low income mortgage, so probably still couldn't afford to buy......
Regardless of what the chart shows, there are houses and townhouses that you could afford in the Brantford>Hamilton>St. Catherines triangle (and some of the surrounding areas) - there's a reasonable amount of work available too.

I fancy this one even if it is a fixer upper http://www.loriv.com/MLS-Listing-699...-JONES-ST.aspx


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Old Dec 16th 2015, 8:20 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by dbd33
It seems from the chart that the price of houses is about seven times the needed income.

How does that work; are houses usually purchased by working threesomes each of whom generates the "needed income"?
You buy what you can afford then over time you pay down the mortgage, the property increases in value, and your income rises, so you can sell your home realise a larger deposit than you started with, and borrow a little more to "move up the property ladder".
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 8:31 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by Pulaski
You buy what you can afford then over time you pay down the mortgage, the property increases in value, and your income rises, so you can sell your home realise a larger deposit than you started with, and borrow a little more to "move up the property ladder".
But when you have city's where a fixer upper requires an income of double the average or more, you may find that there is nothing you can afford if your not an above average 6 figure income household.

This is the lowest price house in Vancouver listed on the MLS... 938,000 and it's a fixer upper/tear down.

https://www.realtor.ca/Residential/S...olumbia-V5L1L3

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Old Dec 16th 2015, 8:38 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by Pulaski
You buy what you can afford then over time you pay down the mortgage, the property increases in value, and your income rises, so you can sell your home realise a larger deposit than you started with, and borrow a little more to "move up the property ladder".
That doesn't work in Canada though. We've been overpaying our mortgage but if we used a realtor to sell them all we've done by overpaying the mortgage is pay their 5% + HST fee. It would leave us cost neutral and with the same deposit we started with..
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 8:40 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by Jsmth321
But when you have city's where a fixer upper requires an income of double the average or more, you may find that there is nothing you can afford if your not an above average 6 figure income household.

This is the lowest price house in Vancouver listed on the MLS... 938,000 and it's a fixer upper/tear down.

https://www.realtor.ca/Residential/S...olumbia-V5L1L3
That is awful!!
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 9:05 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by Tirytory
That doesn't work in Canada though. We've been overpaying our mortgage but if we used a realtor to sell them all we've done by overpaying the mortgage is pay their 5% + HST fee. It would leave us cost neutral and with the same deposit we started with. .....
Well it's not my fault you moved to Canada. ..... It's the same in the US.
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Old Dec 16th 2015, 9:23 pm
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Default Re: PROPERTY VALUES AND INCOMES REQUIRED.

Originally Posted by Pulaski
Well it's not my fault you moved to Canada. ..... It's the same in the US.
Well I know that

It does make it very difficult to actually acquire any more deposit. You really need to get it right first time. I'm wondering whether we should build
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