Originally Posted by Tirytory

Just curious, but are you paying their university fees?

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian

All valid points.

I don't advocate that anyone should only rely upon the state pension for a happy retirement.

I am somewhat fortunate in that I get to see the assets, liabilities and incomes of a very wide range of people on a daily basis. From what I see, it doesn't appear to matter whether one has a fantastic income, a middle level income or a minimum wage type of income. The vast majority of people have lots of debt (usually proportionate to their income), have minimal savings but spend huge amounts on vacations and gadgets. That, of course, is entirely a matter for them. But they shouldn't be surprised if, in light of what they have chosen to put their income into, they may struggle in retirement.

It appears to me that you can spend it now, or you can spend it later. Outside of government workers, very few people are able to do both.

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian

If spousal support has been paid for a long time, it is normal for the Court to expect the other spouse to become self-sufficient at some time so if, for example, one party has been paying the other $5,000 for 10 years, the Court will want to know why the other party continues to require spousal support.

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian

Once again, you are the one moving the goalposts, not me..

Originally Posted by dbd33

Because she's a woman, subject to systemic discrimination, and therefore unable to earn as much as a man. Because the "retirement" is just a means of reducing income in order to evade the support payments. I understand that these points are arguable but the cost of having them argued it is, in itself, ruinous. That cost alone would be a barrier to retirement.

The CRA accepts spousal support as a deduction after 30 odd years so I have to think that long term payment is accepted practise. I don't know how long the CRA will allow the deduction, my heirs or successors will have to post on that.

Originally Posted by BristolUK

You said you didn't understand why people today would think they had a worse outlook.
I referred you to a series of articles about people in the sort of jobs currently, you know, today, that in the past would have seen them in good standards of living but not being able to afford heating costs, food, housing and all the rest of it.
And you came back with examples of several people and circumstances way back in the past.

And you say that it's me that moved the goalposts.

You ask about people today, I give you examples of people today and you come back with people of "yesterday".

Do you understand English?

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian

I honestly don't know why a 39 year old primary school teacher wouldn't be able to afford to purchase a property in Reading. The first place I lived when I left home was Reading.

My mother was able to raise 3 children under the age of 9 after my father died, 2 years after purchasing their first house, working minimum wage jobs. I was able to purchase a house in Worcester, earning 10,000 pounds a year while I was attending law classes in the evenings. 2 of our children were born during that time and a third was born a year into my 2 year part time legal practice course (the UK equivalent of North America's bar exam). I say this to point out that we were able to do this before I became a lawyer (as I anticipate that I will be hit with the usual "you are a wealthy lawyer, what do you know?").

We drove shitty cars, panicked when they needed repairs, ate basic foods and wore cheap clothes. We lived within our means and, as our income increased, so did our spending but we never spent more than we earned and we were able to put something away for retirement even then.

I thought we were talking about pensions. Put simply, anyone that takes vacations to foreign lands now, drives a nice car, purchases the latest Iphone at the expense of putting something away for retirement is taking a gamble with not being able to live comfortably in retirement. I genuinely belive that there are very few people that are not able to have a comfortable retirement unless they elect to retire too early. I appreciate that one's finances can take a battering by events that life throws at them (divorce can be particularly devastating).

I accept that it is not easy, but it is not impossible either.

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian

Spousal support is not supposed to equalize earnings, it is supposed to aid one party to get over the initial shock of the financial consequences of the breakdown of the marriage. Once you die, so should your spousal support so your heir or successors have little to worry about.

Sometimes, child support is secured by an insurance policy, or by a first charge against the estate but, as property would have been divided in the divorce, it would be most unusual to have the other spouse "double dip" by getting a share of the property, and then a further share of the property upon the death of the other.

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter

Household income needed to buy in Reading - 60,000 pounds/2-bed flat, average starter home price 270,000, 15% deposit needed.

https://www.getreading.co.uk/news/pr...shire-18556302

Primary school teacher salary in the UK - average 27,579 thousand pounds

https://www.cv-library.co.uk/salary-...ad%20of%20Year.

Reading is the cheap part of Berkshire, btw.

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian

I am familiar with Reading and its surroundings.

Average covers all manner of things and is not particularly useful, IMVHO. She will also receive child support but it has been so long since I practiced in the UK that I have no idea how much that will provide to her. We also don't know what has happened in her past. I would estimate that most 39 year old teachers in Reading have their own houses but I accept that that may not be the case.

Originally Posted by Lion in Winter

I doubt child support will amount to 30,000 pound per year, plus enough to set aside a further 30k as a downpayment?

This is from RightMove:

"Properties in Reading had an overall average price of £388,034 over the last year. The majority of sales in Reading during the last year were semi-detached properties, selling for an average price of £405,037. Terraced properties sold for an average of £317,014, with detached properties fetching £581,612. Overall, sold prices in Reading over the last year were 6% up on the previous year and 7% up on the 2019 peak of £361,258."

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/house-prices/reading.html




It's not looking great for the primary school teacher with children.

The affordable housing shortage in the UK is real. I work with an organisation that deals with some of the fallout from it. It isn't something that is due to people living beyond their means other than individual anecdotes, it's a function of supply going up against inadequate wages.

Originally Posted by Almost Canadian

I appreciate that. Most people as first time buyers, don't buy 4 bedroomed detached properties. They start with something they can afford and work up. As I stated, I suspect that there are other factors at work here.

Are you seriously suggesting that all 39 year old primary school teachers in Reading do not have residences they own? If not, what occupations own the houses in Reading?

Originally Posted by Mordko

On a side note, owning a home isn’t for everyone. In Canada ownership rate is about 70% vs 50% in Germany and 65% in the UK.