Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Not just a latte, could be a pint, a burger, whatever, but does anyone else feel the ambience is kind of...destroyed? I don't know, as I've hardly been out, and most venues are closed until next week. Normally, I'm quite into cafes and pubs, but I find all the protective measures (spacing, glass shields, masks, etc, etc) all a bit depressing. Is it something that one gets used to? Anyone acclimatized to the new normal yet? On top of all the "ambience doubts" I'm still convinced there's a killer virus out there, there's literally a pandemic going on (folks!) and so I question the very idea of going out to social locations. I hate being this paranoid, but....

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

I have no expectation of visiting any such places for the foreseeable future.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

I've visited our favourite famly pizza place - twice int the past two weeks - and the local Keg steakhouse. The pizza place felt markedly different - sparser table set up, hand sanitising stations and servers in faceshields but not masks. Paper (disposable) menu's on request but QR code on the tables that takes you to the online menu. Pizza makers (I know there is a word for that) in masks. Ambiance was different - the visors look a bit wierd, but we know the staff well and they were so transparently delighted to see customers again it made up for it. The Keg was a different experience - Masked greeter at the door, don't arrive more than 5 mins before reservation time, wait outside until called in (which was 25 mins later & thats going to be a problem on a rainy/snowy/cold day). Inside not much felt different - no appreciable change in layout although they were restricting overall capacity, servers in masks, regular menus etc. In both cases condiments brought out in disposable plastic containers. As it was a Keg, the steak was still not cooked properly but thats nothing to do with Covid 19!

I think we'll still go out to eat at times, certainly while there are no Covid cases in the province (24 days with no new cases yesterday). If there is a spike, as there inevitably will be, then I'd think twice. Bars open on Thursday - I don't anticipate racing back to a bar but thats mainly because there are none within walking distance anyway!

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

We never ate out much pre-COVID but certainly wont eat out now at all, just no point. I see some of the hipster places in our neighborhood are busy, but with 50% reduced seating capacity, some only have like 12 people inside at once and a line of 20, so normal times most of that line would have been inside seated.

Bigger chains have big banners outside screaming we are open, come eat, so unsure of how they are doing.

The coffee shops near us that I have seen are not permitting anything but take out, order and leave, no sitting around.

I suspect some of these places will end up closing, can't imagine smaller places can survive long term with the new reality, and while the food in the restaurant in our building is good, and they do take out, I am not going to pay dine in style prices for take out, which seems to be what some places are betting on, but people tend to be more willing to pay higher price for sitting and dining in and such, but when it comes to take out, expect lower pricing.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

So, there are other sane people around ! :thumbup:

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Thanks for this report from the front line AX.

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Yes take-out is a bandaid solution for a full blown cafe or restaurant. If that's the business model all they need is a truck.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

This! SDing, masks, screens, hand sanizer, etc., are desiged to mitigate a risk, and the risk is still there, even though things are "opening up" the risk is still very much there, and indeed in my bailiwick has been steadily increasing since March, so the risk is increasing not decreasing.

The best mitigation for the risk of catching the virus while you're in a coffeeshop, bar, or restaurant, is to not be there at all, and stay home. So that is what we're doing, and will continue to do so for the forseeable future.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Thanks Pulaski. I've been genuinely wondering whether I should go against my better judgement or not.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

The problem that we all face, is that seeing people out and about, at bars and restaurants, is going to create the illusion that "everyone" is getting back to normal, but what you won't see, at least not obviously, is the ones who are more cautious and are staying away/ staying at home. So when you see a moderate crowd in a bar or restaurant, you need to ask yourself, what was it like before the lock down? If previously the place was packed, with a queue outside and a crowd on the terrace, then difference is the people who are still at home, waiting for more information and hopefully, in due course, a vaccine.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

It's my wife's birthday next month so I'm torn between going away for a few days or going out to dinner, or non of the above.
I feel I'm going to do the wrong thing whatever.
On a different note, getting a drivers license renewed is turning into a nightmare. Not an easy thing even at the best of times, added to all this the new Real ID thing. :eek:

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Our local coffee shop opened up for take-out coffee in early April, OH would walk down, buy a coffee for him and a latte for me, decant them into our travel mugs so they would keep warm while he walked back home. We then had some really lovely weather about 2 weeks into the new system, and there is a small neighbourhood park nearby where almost no-one went. So on about 5 days over a 2 week period, OH would take me in the car, he would buy the coffee, drive over to the park and we would sit on one of the benches (5 very well-spaced around a grassed area). Sometimes a close friend would join us, sitting at the far end of the bench from me. We maintained more than a 2m spacing at all times.

Restrictions eased in early May, and the coffee shop opened up for stay-in consumption of coffee and food. But a very different system, with tables well spaced, only 2 chairs per table, and only one window bench area available for seating with 1 chair to be used and next 2 not available ...... that reduced the seating to 3 from 7. Coffee still served in disposable paper cups, food in paper bags. No jugs of water with glasses for freebie water, only bottled for sale. No thermoses of cream and milk or shakers of cinnamon, nutmeg, etc out on a service counter, staff had to do it for you, and only wooden stir sticks, no metal or plastic spoons/forks/knives

About 2 weeks ago, they were allowed to change the arrangement slightly, largely because we were allowed to increase our "bubbles" by 1 or by 2 if they were from the same household ..... furniture rearranged, tables still spaced at more than 2 m distance, but there was now 1 table for 4, 2 tables for 3, and 2 tables for 2. No change to the window bench seating. Plus they are allowed to serve coffees in real cups, because of the super-duper dishwashers such places have to have.

We haven't yet eaten out, but we have been having pick-up from a local Japanese restaurant.

I've been for 2 physio appointments (badly needed!), in a superb safe environment set up by my phsyio. OH has had his hair cut, I'm still growing mine!

I'm currently waiting for my doctor to phone me ....... I need some new prescriptions and they would rather not have patients go into the office unless necessary, so are doing as much as they can by phone or video. It's going to be interesting, especially as it is the doctor on duty, not my own.

So that is BC .................. pubs, restaurants, stores, etc etc open but under very strict regulations, and they can be shut down at a moment's notice if an inspector sees thay are not obeying the rules.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

The others here sometimes want an iced cap from Tim Hortons and the nearest is a small kiosk 5 minutes away in the hospital building and for now nobody goes into the hospital unless it's for an appointment or visiting.

We've usually gone out to restaurants just for birthdays but lately we've aimed to do it more in the winter - to break things up a bit. But accepting we won't be doing that for the time being, we've upped food delivery and take-out, especially me since an Indian restaurant started up.

As far as I can recall, I've been to a bar for a drink only once since I lived in Canada and that was just before a restaurant for a meal anyway.

I can't see the distancing thing working 100% but it might work better if a restaurant had a sort of family night where seating was limited to groups of people from the same household with the tables used some distance apart. Of course policing that might be an issue.

Having said that, the number of times we've been in Cora's for a mid to late morning breakfast you'd think that was the old normal let alone the new one. :lol:

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

If only the province would send some inspectors to big box stores, like Wal-Mart, Home Depot, Super Store to name a couple.


Our doctor has been doing video/phone appointments since mid March, its a much nicer system overall, can book online, see what days appointments are available, and not have to leave the house. If the doctor needs to see patient in person, the doctor books another appointment, so I suppose it could be a bit more costly in the long run to MSP, but its so much nicer, 9/10 appointments I have do not need me to be physically there (almost all my appointments are refills) so I hope this system sticks around, I also find the phone appointments are on-time and the doctor spends more time discussing things, she seems less stressed as well and lots of times now same day appointments are even possible which were never possible under the old system.

Now if only medical records were available online, I like the way my mom's doctor works in California through the online portal she can access everything, lab work (which we can in BC) prescriptions, email the doctor a question, review medical records, and everything under the sun really.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

It's all about the quantum of risk where you are isn't it? If locally (your town/city/state/province) there are multiple daily cases/fatalities, then staying at home is the best move. (& is what we'd do). If there is a low incidence rate - or potentially zero - as it is in Newfoundland, then that's a different proposition. The danger is, of course, that we see on TV, people either going back to some semblance of normal or remaining locked down, without considering the difference in Covid incidence between there and here - wherever there and here is. I think reopening business - when safe to do so, is a positive step in terms of mitigating the economic downsides of total lockdown.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Well, it's not just good sense, I don't really know anyone in Canada so there's little reason to go to a restaurant or bar.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Somewhat, but everywhere was low risk in February, and yet things snoweballed out of control in just a few weeks, with the biggest flaw in your position being that it takes a few days (14 days is what is commonly reported) from a cluster of infections actually happening to the disease manifesting itself and people exhibiting symptoms, then being tested. In other words you may find out today that there was a cluster of new infections that you should have avoided two weeks ago.
That's not unreasonable, but not without the risk of new hotspots. I would be much happier if people keen to get "back to normal", because of valid concerns about the economy, would accept that SD and masks make sense, because at the moment those who seem most kean to get "back to normal" are the ones whose behaviour is most likely to create new hotspots!

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

We might be opening our club to 30% capacity by the end of the month. I don't even know offhand what our license says, but I think 30% is about 100 people for both rooms. I'm optimistic.
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/british...edd4fdba39.jpg

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Info from BC today

"The latest epidemiological modelling by B.C. health officials shows recent contact rates in the province are at 65 per cent of normal — hovering near the threshold for a potential rebound of new cases of COVID-19."

"the modelling shows that so far, strong contact tracing has provided a buffer against a surge in new cases. Henry said 97 to 99 per cent of contacts have been located within 48 hours in B.C."

B.C.'s reproductive number for the virus has dropped to one, from 3 in March, so that is certainly good.

13 new cases today.

B.C. Centre for Disease Control is working on a method to test waste water for COVID-19.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/briti...e-23-1.5624328

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

I work in a fast serve restaurant. We only closed for 2 weeks. We have 50% capacity seating in 1 store and less in another. Everything is served in disposables.some people wear masks and sanitize others don't. Many complain about lack of seating and will use the staff designated toilet. There is a customer designated one. People are also impatient. My co workers and I do not wear masks we do have plexi. It's impossible for us to maintain 2m between us. The owner went to her vacation place in bc.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

From my reading and searching, I understand that all businesses no matter what have to provide WorkSafeBC with an individual plan for re-opening that will protect all their employees and the public, and that plan must meet or exceed the generalised plan that WorkSafe has set up for each industry or type of business ..... set up in concert with the organisations official association. Thus, the Ironworkers, the Business Council, etc etc

I also understand that WorkSafeBC has employed and trained at least a couple of hundred extra inspectors. These inspectors have the right to fine and shut down any business that is not operating to their approved plan. Some have been shut down for a day or couple of days.

I also understand that the inspectors are inspecting much more often than they used to do. However, they do also rely a lot on information being given to them by the public.

I have only ever been in a Walmart once, on Vancouver Island, and didn't buy anything there. I bought some masks online from Walmart but will never use them again.


As for the doctor's .............. I was called by my own doctor in early April to check that I was OK, and asking about any prescriptions I needed.

This time it was a little different in that this was a doctor I had not seen before, and I was asking about other prescriptions, so I had to guess what information he might want from me.

I've never had any worries about getting in to the office, I usually call for an appointment at least a week ahead of time, and they know that if I call emergency, it is ......... that has happened twice in 20 years, I got in the same day once and the next morning on the second after a late afternoon call. I was congratulated both times because I had called it right.

I've actually found them better on starting the appointment than this phone call, but then he probably had a call that took longer.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Did you also see/hear about the new cases in Washington State.The Washington State Department of Health on Tuesday reported 516 new confirmed cases of COVID-19 and eight additional deaths.

Statewide totals have reached 29,386 cases and 1,284 deaths, up from 28,870 cases and 1,276 deaths on Monday.
https://www.thenewstribune.com/news/...243751777.html

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Well if whats happening at Wal-Mart and Super Store is approved, well they better hire some better people at Work Safe because there is no social distancing at these 2 stores, there is no enforcement of any of the rules at either store, both stores let people any without any concern how full the store is, the customers inside the store do no social distance.

I am only going to these 2 stores so much because 90% of the instacart orders are at these 2 stores, and when you go to the same 2 stores multiple times a day you quickly see how little people follow directions. Even the store employees wont social distance, turn around and there is the Wal Mart worker not even 2 feet away trying to get you to sign up for their Mastercard.

I haven't been following the US numbers. I really just follow BC.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

I follow the Washington State numbers because that is where we are likely to get new infections from!

If you are so concerned about Walmart and Super Store, I personally would seriously think about phoning WorkSafe BC to complain about it because they are supposed to be keeping the distancing etc.

They are breaking the law.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

Health authorities never intended to reduce the infection rate to zero, which is impractical even with a vaccine. The message we were told was these measures were required to flatten the infection rate to a level at which the health care system can cope with any hotspots. Currently in BC there are 16 people hospitalized and 7 ICU patients and as Dr. Bonnie Henry said they are tracing majority of contacts within 48-hr.

To me the message from health is therefore saying it is safe to do these activities not because you won’t be infected but because if you are there is capacity to treat you such that you would likely survive. Wether you choose to take the risk is a personal choice based on your own risk profile and tolerance.

You have to remember that at the time of the first wave we were inadequately prepared and know little about the virus. The lockdown was to give the system a chance to catch up, which it has.

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

I think this is exactly right. There is nothing that WalMart has that is unavailable elsewhere (except Aloe Vera oil in 2 gallon jugs). At WalMart you'll encounter the People of WallMart, of course it's not safe, just don't go there.

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Agree with this totally… this is exactly how I see it.

Some are saying why did we lockdown for, its not that bad?? Its not that bad precisely because we locked down! But now as we all know we can’t lock down forever….so now countries are opening up because the health systems are more experienced and have the capacity to treat people if they do become infected….and enough ventilators to go around etc…. as a result people are now taking more of a risk than they first did….but there is a fine line, too much complacency could send figures rocketing worse than the initial outbreak.

I must say reducing social distancing to 1m, and opening pubs fully in UK next week seems to be is a strange decision….. part of me wonders if the UK government are going back to their herd immunity plan, that they aborted in late March, but now in a less obvious manner…

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I think it's more devious. The economy is going to collapse at the end of the year. Rampant infections will muddy the water and make it less obvious that the crash is due to the vanity of the man who would be PM. A high infection rate, especially one which doesn't result in many deaths is to the PM's advantage.

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Never use the masks again or Walmart?

You were lucky to get them. When I ordered, it was all third party sellers (just like masks on Amazon) and it seemed to me there were 50 ads or more and all from the same seller. Only one review. I hoped that was because they were too new to have reviews and took a chance.

I just took another look and it all looks the same now as it did then except there are a few different names for the suppliers and the same total lack of reviews. Presumably the new names are used as the "fake tracking information"; "it's a scam"; "masks never arrived" comments start arriving and a new supplier name means such comments are not attached and more people are conned. Rinse and repeat.

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I’ve just some Starbucks stars to use otherwise they expire.

I’ll use them up but I prefer to make my own coffee, which is what I was doing before COVID.

I’ve got a bunch of gift cards from last year as well but again no motivation to go out and use them as I don’t really need anything.

The only thing I really want to do is go back to my gym (it’s open) but limited classes and the class I want to do is now only on twice a week (previously 7 times a week) and both sessions are when I am working. The at home fitness routine will need to be continued

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Unless of course your going there to earn money. :p

I'd gladly avoid Wal-Mart and Super Store but that is where pretty much all the shops are.

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Yep. Gotta do what you gotta do to earn a quid/dollar. Stay as safe as you can J!

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Ive just been to the dentists office to see the hygienist and apart from some awkwardness getting it it was all fine, felt safe. We have been out for a patio lunch and again felt safe from the dreaded out by.
People are much more lax now and I try to keep a distance, or mask up. I've a horror of being a patient when I wouldn't be able to hear at all and wouldn't see much either so I'm cautious but not avoiding life. .

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

thank you for posting this. My daughter is the first of us to get an appointment post-lockdown and I must admit I hesitated before accepting it. I decided it was probably safer to accept one of the first appointments, before any laxity with the precautions sets in.

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I'd say the staff are at more risk than we are, they care gowned, gloved, masked and visited. They call the day before to screen you, temp, cough etc. At the appointment you wear a mask until you're in the room. Then it's temperatire taking time and a peroxide mouthwash. I never have the water jet cleaning thingy anyway but they aren't allowed to use it. That's it.

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I meant never went into Walmart again.

I was the same as you ......... went onto the Walmart site because it was the only place to get disposable masks. Saw at least 60 types of masks on the site, all from third party sellers, all in China so far as I could see.

I found reviews for more suppliers than you did, and most of them were terrible, including "smelled awful when I opened the bag", "were obviously used and dirty".

Eventually I found one supplier with several reviews that were OK, and took the risk of ordering a pack of 40 .

Took over 6 weeks to arrive, and arrived about 3 days after the estimated date, and yes, all the way from China. Packed in a resealable plastic bag, with no identity as to the manufacture.

Haven't used them yet .............. not sure that I ever will!

But I was not happy with the Walmart online site, and the ordering from 3rd party sellers, one of the reasons I didn't buy from Amazon.

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Yeppers. Going into Wal-Mart or Super Store are not what I enjoy doing, I hate both those stores with a passion, they design their stores the complete opposite of what I like in a store. I like how Target in the US does it, mostly clear main aisles without shelving displays, no overhead announcements, and brighter more airy store.

Where Wal-Mart crams everything they can into the main aisles, is loud from the obnoxious overhead announcements nobody can understand, unpleasant shopping experience all around, Super Store is not much better they throw crap into the main aisles as well.

I guess that is the reason when I live in the US, I basically never go to Wal-Mart, always go to Target.

Canadian Tire is bad too, and some reason when I go into their stores, I feel sick and get a headache, and they all have this odd smell, maybe its all the crap they sell off gassing...lol

Basically if I could order 100% of everything online and never go into a store, I would. lol

Re: Going for a latte in the new normal
 

I thought that too. My son had to have all his wisdom teeth out the first week the dental surgeons got back in gear. I was terrified, however the steps in place were fantastic.

I’m not a bar visitor so I don’t miss that, I miss that I can only visit the library for ten minutes and can’t sit down. I’m very pleased it’s open though. I get a Greek takeaway sometimes, but otherwise the food isn’t good, so we don’t miss restaurants.

I know we have flattened the curve but life has got pretty flat with it...and I’d just as soon stay at home as I feel safer. Downtown Fredericton is like a ghost town mostly. We are bubbling on 3rd July with the other Atlantic Provinces. We aren’t worried about them, we are worried about Quebec and Houlton actress the border.

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Someone mentioned Canadian Tire not long ago (think it was Bristol), but I got a surprise to see you mention it in the context of your post. So I looked it up and now I get it. I thought it was a store that sold tires/tyres :o

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I like Target too. I don't mind shopping in person, but not so keen in the current environment.