Does anyone else find it ironic...
May 3rd 2011, 7:46 pm
#871
Slob
Joined: Sep 2009
Location: Ottineau
Posts: 6,342
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
I didn't realise that nonces had a look. I've locked a fair few up in my time and didn't notice such an attribute. However, I defer to your greater knowledge.
If Harper accepts things he doesn't agree with, doesn't this make him a pragmatist rather than an "authoritarian"? It is not possible for one to separate their personal beliefs from their public position?
If his personal beliefs would have him condemn gays and abortion and he doesn't follow-up in his public position, he is a liar.
Are you suggesting that Mother Theresa should have prevented the poor from having sex?
No. A few condoms might have helped, though.
Have to agree with you on the fatty issue, and I say this being a fatty myself
If Harper accepts things he doesn't agree with, doesn't this make him a pragmatist rather than an "authoritarian"? It is not possible for one to separate their personal beliefs from their public position?
If his personal beliefs would have him condemn gays and abortion and he doesn't follow-up in his public position, he is a liar.
Are you suggesting that Mother Theresa should have prevented the poor from having sex?
No. A few condoms might have helped, though.
Have to agree with you on the fatty issue, and I say this being a fatty myself
May 3rd 2011, 7:52 pm
#872
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 14,227
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
How many nonces do you know/have you met?
Define "devoutly religious"? Is it going to church once a year, once a week, every day, 3 times a day? Let's assume he is devoutly religious, how does that make him a liar?
Was Mother Theresa a "mentalist"? If so, does that diminish the work she did?
I get you don't like religion. I don't either. But, unlike, you, I don't lump all those that do in the "mentalist" category.
I appreciate that this argument has been done lots of times before. But such stereotyping is akin to calling anyone that is overweight a "lazy, unfit, unmotivated, uncaring, slob"
Define "devoutly religious"? Is it going to church once a year, once a week, every day, 3 times a day? Let's assume he is devoutly religious, how does that make him a liar?
Was Mother Theresa a "mentalist"? If so, does that diminish the work she did?
I get you don't like religion. I don't either. But, unlike, you, I don't lump all those that do in the "mentalist" category.
I appreciate that this argument has been done lots of times before. But such stereotyping is akin to calling anyone that is overweight a "lazy, unfit, unmotivated, uncaring, slob"
May 3rd 2011, 8:28 pm
#873
Lost in BE Cyberspace
Joined: Aug 2005
Location: South of Calgary
Posts: 13,378
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
I don't get your point on the personal/public issue at all.
Are you suggesting that Doctors with a religious bent should not be allowed to be Doctors because a patient may want an abortion and they would be conflicted?
How do you believe anyone can be a Judge as, surely, their personal beliefs would get in the way of their professional ones?
What about police officers? Should they have all personal preferences removed before they are allowed on duty just in case they may not assist a gay that is getting the sh*t kicked out of them by a homophobe?
What is wrong with a politician saying, "Personally, I believe this but I accept that others may feel otherwise which is why I am not pursuing a policy that ..."
Are you suggesting that Doctors with a religious bent should not be allowed to be Doctors because a patient may want an abortion and they would be conflicted?
How do you believe anyone can be a Judge as, surely, their personal beliefs would get in the way of their professional ones?
What about police officers? Should they have all personal preferences removed before they are allowed on duty just in case they may not assist a gay that is getting the sh*t kicked out of them by a homophobe?
What is wrong with a politician saying, "Personally, I believe this but I accept that others may feel otherwise which is why I am not pursuing a policy that ..."
May 3rd 2011, 8:29 pm
#874
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Apr 2008
Location: Calgary
Posts: 3,340
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
I think there are plenty of things he can please his supporters with that were in the manifesto eg gun registry, public financing of political parties etc so he doesn't have to contemplate other things that weren't on the manifesto for a while. When it comes to issues such as same sex marriage, in reality it's not that significant, so the pragmatic thing to do would be nothing and leave it there to allow him to refute future claims that he has a secret agenda.
May 3rd 2011, 8:33 pm
#875
BE Forum Addict
Joined: Oct 2009
Location: Toronto, ON
Posts: 1,244
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
Or, maybe, the electorate voted for those they felt best represented their interests; the way a democracy is supposed to work.
Did the "sheeple" vote for the NDP purely on the basis of negative campaigning? It is disappointing to note that, rather than accepting that the election result was "fair", those whose wishes were not reflected by the result, have to find something "sinister" about it.
Much has been said on this forum about the contempt the Tories showed for the parliamentary process, evidently, the electorate were not concerned about it.
Did the "sheeple" vote for the NDP purely on the basis of negative campaigning? It is disappointing to note that, rather than accepting that the election result was "fair", those whose wishes were not reflected by the result, have to find something "sinister" about it.
Much has been said on this forum about the contempt the Tories showed for the parliamentary process, evidently, the electorate were not concerned about it.
Ignatieff ultimately failed to connect with the electorate. I felt this way when I watched the debate - his rhetoric was more "don't vote for this guy because..." rather than "vote for me because ...". No identity and little vision. The Tories just held firm and hung him out to dry on his comment earlier about a possible GST hike. He was a failure, sadly, and did the honourable thing today.
May 3rd 2011, 8:44 pm
#876
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 14,227
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
Personally I wish they'd all ***** right off.
May 3rd 2011, 8:47 pm
#877
Moderαtor Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2003
Location: Upstate South Carolina
Posts: 30,768
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
Let's be clear here. The Tories did not win a majority. The Liberals gave it to them on a plate. One look at the Toronto political map today compared with 2008 tells its own story. The Tories still lost some key cabinet ministers last night.
Ignatieff ultimately failed to connect with the electorate. I felt this way when I watched the debate - his rhetoric was more "don't vote for this guy because..." rather than "vote for me because ...". No identity and little vision. The Tories just held firm and hung him out to dry on his comment earlier about a possible GST hike. He was a failure, sadly, and did the honourable thing today.
Ignatieff ultimately failed to connect with the electorate. I felt this way when I watched the debate - his rhetoric was more "don't vote for this guy because..." rather than "vote for me because ...". No identity and little vision. The Tories just held firm and hung him out to dry on his comment earlier about a possible GST hike. He was a failure, sadly, and did the honourable thing today.
I suspect that the Liberals simply didnt have the funds to go on the offensive at that time.
Other than the Greens I dont think any side distinguished themselves with a "vote for me because..." approach. The tories did what they had to and avoided shooting themselves in the foot while it was inserted in their mouth. They ran a competent campaign. The liberals will have plenty of time for introspection now...
Last edited by iaink; May 3rd 2011 at 8:49 pm.
May 3rd 2011, 8:48 pm
#878
Moderαtor Emeritus
Joined: Sep 2003
Location: Upstate South Carolina
Posts: 30,768
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
Good lord, you are more cynical than me, and most people consider me to be off the scale...
May 3rd 2011, 8:58 pm
#879
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 14,227
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
I actually consider elections and parliament to be a sideshow, sort of like what I imagine "the apprentice" to be if I ever actually watched it. Throw us some wedge issues or demonize some groups to make us feel involved, all whilst everything stays the same and 90% of the population continues to be stolen from.
May 3rd 2011, 9:18 pm
#880
.
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 20,185
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
I actually consider elections and parliament to be a sideshow, sort of like what I imagine "the apprentice" to be if I ever actually watched it. Throw us some wedge issues or demonize some groups to make us feel involved, all whilst everything stays the same and 90% of the population continues to be stolen from.
May 3rd 2011, 9:20 pm
#881
slanderer of the innocent
Joined: Dec 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC
Posts: 6,695
May 3rd 2011, 9:28 pm
#882
Born again atheist
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2005
Location: Europe (to be specified).
Posts: 30,259
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
Aren't we all?
I see there's been some speculation as to my reaction to yesterday's vote.
Briefly, profound depression.
A Harper majority government will, as I've said many a time, be a disaster for Canada and Canadians. I haven't changed my mind. We're now stuck with a bunch of dishonest reactionaries until 2015, fer chrissake.
What will be left of the Canada we know by then? Very, very little.
Profoundly depressed. Thanks for asking.
I see there's been some speculation as to my reaction to yesterday's vote.
Briefly, profound depression.
A Harper majority government will, as I've said many a time, be a disaster for Canada and Canadians. I haven't changed my mind. We're now stuck with a bunch of dishonest reactionaries until 2015, fer chrissake.
What will be left of the Canada we know by then? Very, very little.
Profoundly depressed. Thanks for asking.
May 3rd 2011, 9:35 pm
#883
.
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 20,185
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
Do yo think they'll be passing an enabling act giving H**per plenary authority? Now that would be fun to watch. Watch out all you BC Bud toking beatniks in BC, the party may be coming to an end.
May 3rd 2011, 9:57 pm
#885
Born again atheist
Thread Starter
Joined: Jul 2005
Location: Europe (to be specified).
Posts: 30,259
Re: Does anyone else find it ironic...
In 4 years there will be no public funding of election campaigns.
The CBC will be privatized and sold to Rupert Murdoch at a knock down price.
Unions will have their collective bargaining rights removed or curtailed.
Health care transfers will be decimated and hospitals will be privatized.
Canada will be an international pariah on environmental issues and foreign affairs.
The Canada Pension Plan will be privatized.
I could go on.