cheques, do they expire
 

I've just found a cheque that we haven't paid in but its over 6/12 old. I know that in the UK that makes it passed it's death date but does the same apply in Canada?

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

What does 6/12 old mean? :blink: I found a cheque from January 2010 back in June 2010 (ahh does 6/12 mean 6 months old?) and paid it in no problemo.

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I believe it does , I know when i needed to get our business office to cancel a cheque that had been made out to the wrong payee ( the company couldn't cash it). There was a comment along the lines of " well its close to its dead date" or somethign along those lines in their reply

doubtless people with more knowledge will correct if I am wrong

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

6 months, yep, 1/7 is one day and 1/52 is one week. Tis Medispeak.

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probably out of luck and I doubt the company will reissue but will try.

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Six months? I'd pay it in and see. I dont think thats unreasonable.

http://financefreelancelife.com/2009...really-expire/

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thanks for the link but it didnt work. It's more than 6 months, almost a year really. I have no idea where the time goes.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

odd, its dead now, but was Ok before.

Anyway, heres a link to googles cached version if it helps, it basically says what Zoe said, but i dont see the harm it trying to pay it in.
http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...really-expire/

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

I was advised by NatWest that in the UK there is no 'stale date' on cheques anymore, however in Canada it is 6 months. CDN banks won't accept any cheques over 6 months old, at least our bank would not.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

Aviator is correct according to this website. But there do appear to be possible exceptions.

http://www.cdnpay.ca/faqs/cheques.asp

When is a cheque considered stale-dated, and is it no longer valid after that point?

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

IMO, the best way to deal with the cheque in question is to deposit it through an ATM machine. While each bank is different in how such deposits are processed there's a good chance that it's done centrally and dates on cheques wouldn't normally be checked. At one time all cheques were sent to paying branch for filing, checking dates, body and figures and signatures but, for the most part, that's all been abandoned as a cost efficient measure.
I think there's a 75/25% chance the stale-dated issue will not be noticed if deposited via machine.

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You can only do this with CDN$ cheques, FX cheques have to be done in branch.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

Ive placed FX cheques in a machine with no problem at all, the FX is taken care of at the time its cleared, so for say a 100GBP cheque, you just enter the deposited amount as 100$, and then a few days later the balance appears at whatever the rate was. Of course, with internet / phone banking I have little choice, but thats what the people at PC financial told me to do and it worked...

Im assuming in Fleds case its a CDN cheque anyway. I must confess I assumed it was to be deposited in a bank machine rather than checked by a human.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

We tried this with RBC and got a really crappy rate. The FX had changed between when we dropped it in and when they processed it. Guess it could have gone either way.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

A crappy rate at a bank? Say it aint so!

I believe in my case that they use whatever the bank rate is at the time its deposited. The bigger issue with depositing FX cheques is (in my case) the extraordinarily long hold periods they apply. I couldn't access the money until long after it cleared the UK bank.

For a small sum though the crap FX rate and hold period are outweighed by the convenience. Not really relevant to this discussion anyway as it probably doesnt apply for the OP anyway.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

Thats what I always did with RBC, foreign checks always went into the ATM, take it into the branch and the tellers would always place a 30 business day hold on it , put it into an ATM and it was cleared right away, full funds available.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

I checked with a human at the bank and they said no. In true Canadian style with a smile and a reluctance to do anything else. ie just put it through and see what happens with the other bank.

In the end I rang the people who wrote the cheque and they will send another one. phew

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

I suspect that RBC counter staff make up the rules for cheques as they go along. Whenever I try to pay cheques into our account I never cease to be amazed at the rigmarole I have to go through

Combinations of actions required/ information demanded/ general refusals include

You have to sign the back
Your husband has to sign the back
The counter staff have to sign the back
You can't pay this in to this account
Is this your account?
Is this a payroll cheque?
I can only release $100

I wouldn't mind but there are only two kinds of cheques I deal with , they are regular transactions but every time I have to go through a different procedure and anticipate what obstacles they are going to place this time

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

ah, but then you get third party cheques. yep, it really is possible to just sign over a cheque made out to you (by that famous 'endorsement' of a squiggle on the back), and then any random bloke on the street can pay it into his bank account. a cheque not even made out to them. truly bizarre.

(lol at zoe's list though. all are correct in slightly different (but top secret ;))circumstances :p)

no, i don't work for rbc... :D

<whispers> sometimes i 'forget' service charges though...

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

I know my rant was a bit tongue in cheek but seriously thesecare the circumstances

We rent our parking space out for $xxx a month, paid by cheque made out to Ben

We have a joint account and I regularly encounter the top three. I admit I don't understand this whole endorsement thing but surely I don't need to sign the back , the cheque is made out to a name on the account.

They get shirty when I question it . Paying in Bens expense cheques from work has lead to all of the above.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

We had a rubber stamp made up locally that states "For Deposit only to Account# xxxxxxxxxxx" never have any problems.

Mind we've been banking at the same branch for 36 years. :o

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

My mum signed Dad's name for years. He was very annoyed when the bank refused a cheque he signed in front of them

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

Same at the TD. I get paid by cheque from company X, signed by me, payable to company Y. I deposit the cheque into the account of company Y and then use a cheque drawn on that account, signed by me, to move the money into my personal account. I've done this every month for, I dunno, fifteen years. Every month it's like the first month, "we'll have to hold the cheque", "you didn't last month", "it's our policy", "no, it isn't" yadda, yadda. On top of that, changes in the GST/HST rate cause great consternation "this isn't the same transaction as last month", "yes, it is, but there's now more tax".

The concept of branch banking is that the bank as a whole doesn't know a person, individuals at a specific branch know a person, so there can't be a bank wide approach to handling an individual account. This fails because the staff at the branch don't seem to last a month, it's always a new set of staff. The bank may as well keep notes about a customer in a central facility, perhaps using a computer, and offer that customer the same service at every branch, that'd save me driving for a couple of hours to get to "my" branch only to find that they don't know me from Adam anyway.

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That about sums it up. It also irritates the hell out of me that I have to wait in line for 20 minutes to get the usual runaround.

No wonder they call a bunch of bankers a "wunch" !

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The TD used to have a gimmick whereby if you stood in line for longer than some number of minutes they'd give you $5. Only once during the promotion did I fail to get the $5. Strangest promotion ever, it was like a reverse bank charge, every time you dealt with the bank you had a little bit more money than you'd expected.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

Sums it up perfectly. Once I managed to get round this when they tried to refuse my cheque ny asking to withdraw $40k from my account.

They asked me , why. I just asked if they would let me theorerically.
When they said they would I pointed out the stupidity that would allow me to withdraw vast amouns of money but not deposit 100 bucks

Is it me or did banks in the UK not care about money being paid in. They'd take it from anyone , its just when you tried to withdraw they might ask q's?

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Hides under desk, and thinks it may have been a bad idea to ever mention I was going to work for a bank :o

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

No not at all , if you can explain to me the reasoning behind the seemingly random encounters i have at the bank i will be extremely grateful :)

For example , please give me " the definitive answer to this question

I have a cheque for $160 made out to Benjamin Bell. I go into the bank and attempt to pay it into an account in both of our names

Do I need to sign the back ( if so , why?)
Does ben need to sign the back ( if so, why)

Should I be getting this much hassle for a simple transaction?

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The problems aren't with the people it's the bloody pisspoor IT systems. Now if only some smart immigrant could get them sorted. Oh.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

It does seem bizarre. I will fill you in if I ever get let into the secret of the annoying randomness! I'm used to the lovely lady at HSBC in Halifax addressing me by my first name, and doing whatever to get the job done, so I will probably have a bit of culture shock as I 'have' to be a customer of my new employer.

;)

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

It's much simpler to deposit the cheque via the ATM and never have to interact with the counter staff I find. Although to be fair, I've had mostly positive experiences with Scotiabank in NL.

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Oh and is it true that you HAVE to sign Government cheques ( such as tax rebates) on the back ( even if they are made out to you)?

Got told this last time I questioned the bank. They seemed a little startled when they handed me the cheque back with a pen ( I just looked at them), Then they said " can you sign the back please" to which I reponded " why?'

They spluttered for a bit and said " because it's a GOVERNMENT cheque"

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

I've never been asked to sign the back of a govt. issued cheque when making a deposit.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

you see, I suspected as much.
So where can i get definitive , printable, verification that the avergae counter monkey in RBC is talking crap?o that next time I can wave a code of practices or summink in their faces .

I'm actually really wary of signing the back of cheques , surely thats a less secure thing to do as it means i'm effectively signing the cheque over to a person rather than into my account?

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

A couple of things.

1) The law about cheques is virtually the same in Canada as it is in England (more to the point, Canada adopted English common law).

2) Signing the back of a cheque that you are cashing or depositing to your account is about fraud prevention. If you sign it in the presence of the bank staff it proves you are present for the transaction.

3) As Atlantic Expat says, if it is a problem use an ATM.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

I don`t understand this. :confused:What does it matter who paid it in? If it does, why are cheques allowed to be deposited via ATM where no such signing is necessary?

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

My thoughts exactly
where is the need for fraud prevention for a cheque made out to that person being paid into their account

they know it's me because I have to swipe my client card and input my pin

if they really think it isn't me they should call the police as obviously I'm using a client card that isn't mine

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

In the UK if you take your personal cheque to be cashed, even if you have signed it properly on the front, the bank staff will make you sign it on the back in their presence to confirm your identity.

Although the bank teller can confirm your identity by your bank card, the signature creates an audit trail.

A true story. A client was being audited. The auditor was having trouble reconciling the client's payroll with the wages expense in the financial statements.

Procedure 1) reconcile the canceled cheques with the payroll ledger. All matched.

Procedure 2) reconcile the payroll ledger with the time clock. All matched.

Procedure 3) reconcile the time clock with HR files. Ah, Joe Bloggs, John Smith and Doris McPherson had time cards, but according to HR they were no monger employed by the company.

Procedure 4) Find the canceled pay cheques of Joe Bloggs, John Smith and Doris McPherson. All were signed on the back.

Procedure 5) compare the handwriting of the signatures on the back of these cheques to other canceled payroll cheques. It turned out that the handwriting look remarkably like the signature on the back of the payroll supervisor's pay cheque.

The Police were called and the lady in question prosecuted.

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

There have been the same 2 ladies working on the counter at our bank since we moved. One manages to do virtually all transactions easily, and without charging us a cent. The other seems to do everything in a roundabout way and normally involves a charge at some point - as you can imagine I try to avoid her as much as possible even though she's a very nice lady!

Re: cheques, do they expire
 

I have NEVER been asked to sign a cheque on the back in the UK even when paying a cheque made out to my parents into their account.