Jingsamichty

I hope you're not in the Mathematics department!

Novocastrian

Ok. 3.4:1, not counting the jackass who strongly disagreed because her Scottish husband told her to. In which case it would be 3.77 recurring to one.

Jingsamichty

62% agree.
38% don't agree.

That's about, um... 1.8:1?

Novocastrian

Have you been drinking again? 34:10 with 9 abstentions and a joker.

Ach, I'm sick of this.

jimf

While there is demand for the product there will always be pressure to develop the oil sands.

A list of per capita consumption shows Canada and USA way out in front.

Oil Consumption
Barrels per day and per person per year, calculated in October, 2007

United States 20,730,000, 25.13
China 6,534,000, 1.80 (many people)
Japan 5,578,000, 15.98 (big on rail transportation)
Germany 2,650,000, 11.74 (less than half per capita than the U.S.)
Canada 2,294,000, 25.07 (as bad as the Yanks)
Mexico 1,970,000, 6.61 (less affluence and fewer cars)
Italy 1,881,000, 11.81 (as good as the Germans)
Saudi Arabia 1,845.000, 24.40
Britain 1,827,000, 10.98 (less than half per caita than the U.S.)
Iran 1,510,000, 8.43
France 1,197,000, 6.86 (big on nuclear energy)
Sweden 362,400, 14.64 (colder winters?)
Ireland 182,400, 16.23 (what is their excuse?)

(All from link below)

http://www.fsmitha.com/world/zx-energy.htm

If you take the view that the effect on the environment in northern Alberta is too high a price to pay then the choice is either import the oil from the middle east or reduce demand for the oil.

Importing the oil is effectively exporting the pollution to countries with generally less rigerous regimes for protectiing the environment. From what I've been told a lot of conventional oil extraction causes damage to aquifers etc with the risk of damage to water supplies. However, there are no big holes in the ground to see so there is an "out of sight out of mind" aspect to it.

Reducing demand - I think most of oil is used for motor vehicles. USA and Canada are far and away the worst offenders here. Some people claim to have no choice in this but the reality is we all have choice. Type of vehicle and where to live are things where choice may be made easily enough by individuals.

Of course most of Canada is sparsley populated and this is often used as a justification for the car based culture. However, although I don't know any figures, I would imagine most Canadians live within urban areas. From what I've seen of visits to Canada, public transport is in the main pretty poor compared to europe. The likes of Edmonton, Calgary, Toronto seem to have pretty small metro/light rail systems in relation to the sizes of the cities. Vancouver might be an exception to this but I've never been there. I noticed there are no passenger train services between Calgary and Edmonton but there are flights every 1/2 hour. Addressing these sorts of issues is for government rather than individuals. However, if voters aren't prepared to pay for improvements then no government is likely to advocate such improvements.

Oil sands don't seem particularly worse than other forms of resource extraction around the world. It is on a large scale and is highly visible for Greenpeace etc to latch onto so it is always going to be something of a easy target. It is up to the canadian regulators to ensure that the balance is struck between the economic benefits and environmental degradation.

dbd33

Most urbanized country in the world by some measures. The high rate of car usage is a function of the people's love of suburbia, not low population density.

jimf

An extreme case but looks like you have to make a big effort to use the the train in parts of north america

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programme...nt/7659610.stm

JET747

No matter what the opinion - as long as oil makes the revenue in taxes and we all rely on the products it will forever remain. My understanding is that the 300 years left in the sands ensures that this will remain Canada's fat cow and they will keep milking it until the well runs dry.

JET

Almost Canadian

Why, because people don't agree with your opinion.

Are people not allowed to disagree with you? What makes your opinion so correct?

Almost Canadian

Do you always resort to name calling? How very mature

dbd33

Granted. There are hardly any passenger trains in North America, just some commuter systems. However, there are buses and aeroplanes between cities so the primary need for the car is to get around the periphery of cities.

Novocastrian

On this point, the poll at the top of the page. As of the time of posting of course; now it's 34:12. Do you have a different opinion you'd like to express?

Almost Canadian

Not particularly, I have already expressed my opinion. I am just waiting for the name calling to begin

Novocastrian

www.waitallday.com

hwp

I actually clicked on that. I'm such a dork!