Its not just the UK but europe generally that agents fees are far less. Where does the broker add value to the process?

Europe does not operate under the North American system of Co-operation thru shared listings (The Multiple Listing System or MLS).

The Brokers are the Boss, they are the ones who control Organised Real Estate, the ones who own and operate their Company, and where the buck stops legally.

When you sue a Realtor you sue the Broker & the Realtor as Realtors represent the Broker in any transaction.

I don't see MLS as adding value. It's a backwards step compared to the listings sites available in the UK - maybe not from your point of view, but certainly from the view of the consumer.

Edit: I know you say that MLS is more than is available on the web - but that actually makes it worse not better!

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Remember this system has been operating here for over 100 years, before the internet it was a vastly superior system to the UK's.

The internet is changing the way Real Estate works but very very very slowly, the percentage who sell independently has not changed for years, despite the internet "mls", and private sale companies being available for well over 10 years. The system is so ingrained that it's still resistant to change by the consumer taking their business elsewhere.

99.99% of people who are looking for a house to buy start off this process on the internet. You couldn't say this 10 years ago.

For me the problem is this: Why can't I say I'm representing myself so knock 4% off the price please? I've never seen a good explanation.

Edit to add: I know we're never going to agree on this....

Do you mean that you represent yourself as the buyer and so should not have to pay the Buying Agents %?

Yes - pretty much. Conversations I've had on here indicate that I can only do that if I find FSBO properties.

Not that I would do it myself - but the choice would be nice.

You don't need a lawyer for that, although the lender will wish to ensure that the legal niceties are complied with and so will use a lawyer and will likely add that fee to your mortgage. The purchaser doesn't actually need a lawyer (although a purchaser will then have the problem of making payment to the vendor - usually it is done through the imposition of trust conditions upon the lawyers involved, unfortunately, your undertaking to do something is worthless, a lawyer's isn't as they can be sued on it and they will be backed by mandatory insurance).

If I understand what is meant by the "mls" system it is an arrangement that pre dates the internet and defines how realtors and brokerages can operate jointly to sell a property and share the commission that the seller pays the listing brokerage/realtor? The mls website available to the public is simply a display of part of the information available used as a marketing tool to draw in business. That is all okay but it is a dominant virtual monopoly and the lack of price competition makes that self evident.

It's difficult to see how the system is vastly superior to the UKs, certainly as the customer is concerned. Vastly more expensive yes.

As you know full well, the organization behind the brokerage is likely to be a corporation. Good luck with suing one of those. Most realtors also hide behind their corporations, good luck suing those as well

Thats pretty much correct.

When a property is Listed with an agent, and they also sell it, many will discount the seller, not by half as there is still a lot to do that had the buyer been represented the buyers agent would have done.

Qualifying the Buyer.
Writing the Offer.
Attending the House Inspection(s).
Making sure that conditions are satisfied in a correct and timely way.
Conveyancing.
Being legally responsible to the buyer.

I am sure that Canadian cell phone providers have been charging for incoming calls since cell phones were first available. It doesn't make it right though!

Stewart, you have a tough audience here. Kudos for at least having the balls to stand up and argue your corner

They stand and watch do they?

Yes Stewart you are the only one biting today and it is a bit one sided.