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this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Old Nov 21st 2008, 11:23 am
  #31  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by framac67 View Post
friendlys are experimental games. Done nothing since 66 so no use kidding on your good when your not.
jajajaaja was being ironic given the fact that England normally impress in friendlies but often disappoint in major tournaments but to be honest they have had some near misses under Robson, Venables and Eriksson.
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Old Nov 21st 2008, 6:02 pm
  #32  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Until such time that the english youth system introduces smaller pitches up to the latter age groups, we will always have problems, imho.
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Old Nov 22nd 2008, 10:02 am
  #33  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by gazz View Post
Until such time that the english youth system introduces smaller pitches up to the latter age groups, we will always have problems, imho.
And until the English media realise that England will not win anything major, severely lower expectations and get off the back of the manager and let him manage then you may start getting somewhere.
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Old Nov 22nd 2008, 10:30 am
  #34  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

I'm not English so I don't really care,but imo individually the English players are quality. Collectively the English team are shite. Its been this way for a long time.
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Old Nov 22nd 2008, 11:47 am
  #35  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by framac67 View Post
And until the English media realise that England will not win anything major, severely lower expectations and get off the back of the manager and let him manage then you may start getting somewhere.
You hit the nail on the head there, expectations need to be a lower and the pressure removed..............But I can never see this ever happening, especially from a media that loves to slag of the national side.
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Old Nov 22nd 2008, 11:49 am
  #36  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by framac67 View Post
And until the English media realise that England will not win anything major, severely lower expectations and get off the back of the manager and let him manage then you may start getting somewhere.
bit like the jocks did in erm............1900 then?
England have been there and there abouts in too many competitions to rule them out over the next 15 years....semis and quarters count I reckon??
Jocks and Irish - well they are and look like they will remain at another level........Sweaties never got past the first round of a W/C and the Paddys fluked it....... which about sums it up: miserable Jocks who love England to lose and lucky Irish who'll take anyone to wear the jersey.......

As far as coaching goes there is some work afoot over here in NZ with the small sided game ideas spreading, - didn't stop me having to argue for smaller pitches for our year 1/2s (they started as big as our men's 7-a-side ones! for kids 5-v-5 no goalies......sheesh.....) and had to take the size 5 ball out of my bag that came from the club and get as many size 3s as possible for the 5,6 and 7 year olds to train with.

Never got chance to coach in UK so can't say too much......as my young 'un wasn't allowed to join the vilalge club until he turned 8!

As far as style of play goes us over 40s still playing 11-, 5- and 7-a-side have graduated to the route-1 / if its fast then kick it / give the other player a taste of what's to come, school of thought as its the only way to keep the kids of today down.

Also can we have heavier balls please, that would help me at least......
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Old Nov 22nd 2008, 12:02 pm
  #37  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Must add that IMO Wenger has gone off on one - what with having a go at Stoke players for being "cowards" when they are physical - when its him who can't stand up and say "I haven't got enough backbone in me or the squad to play the game in a physical league".

Typical as he seems to blame everyone else for the failings in his dressing room and with his players........suppose this has finished Gallas at Arsenal as well.......so who is going to be his leader on the park now??

Not a fan of his style TBH or the likes of Platini and his "non-contact" ideas for football - even though I was chopped off at the knee last weekend and will be out for 4 to 6 weeks with medial ligament damage, the worst tackle I have been directly involved in during my 35 year competative career, owch......those who live by the sword.....
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Old Nov 22nd 2008, 12:37 pm
  #38  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by lardyl View Post
Must add that IMO Wenger has gone off on one - what with having a go at Stoke players for being "cowards" when they are physical - when its him who can't stand up and say "I haven't got enough backbone in me or the squad to play the game in a physical league".

Typical as he seems to blame everyone else for the failings in his dressing room and with his players........suppose this has finished Gallas at Arsenal as well.......so who is going to be his leader on the park now??

Not a fan of his style TBH or the likes of Platini and his "non-contact" ideas for football - even though I was chopped off at the knee last weekend and will be out for 4 to 6 weeks with medial ligament damage, the worst tackle I have been directly involved in during my 35 year competative career, owch......those who live by the sword.....
Alex Ferguson does his fair share of moaning as well, with silly statements of how certain teams just seem to try harder when playing against Manchester United. Kind of a silly stement really when every club is playing for position.

At times Arsenal and their style of football has much more in common with say a Spanish or French side etc than some of the bland football played by the likes of Stoke etc thus his team draw a whole lot of fails that English refs don`t see as particuarly bad thats why he complains.

Well on the one hand Arsene may blame everybody for his teams failings like most people in his position normally do, but on the other hand you can listen to the same old boring rhetoric put out by managers such as Gareth Southgate, who say the same old thing nearly every week "We got to put our hands up" "We got to try harder" "We were poor at the back" etc then you realize he has been saying this same thing for the last several years

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Old Nov 22nd 2008, 12:46 pm
  #39  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by Jules Europe View Post
.....then you realize he has been saying this same thing for the last several years
yep
and SAF is doing the mind-game thing - it was amusing for a while when he had chelski in his sights. Not so good now but still amusing.....
Not caught any of the others calling the oposition players "cowards" though. Looks like Gallas will be off though and that is not good, and when Wenger employed the likes of Viera to do his teams' dirty work and kept on moaning about dirty players it just seems a bit rich to me.
But then I am old school.........a dinosaur, who admired my old man for soaking a leather ball for a few days before playing against a team that they knew were somewhat "lightweight"......
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Old Nov 22nd 2008, 1:03 pm
  #40  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by lardyl View Post
yep
and SAF is doing the mind-game thing - it was amusing for a while when he had chelski in his sights. Not so good now but still amusing.....
Not caught any of the others calling the oposition players "cowards" though. Looks like Gallas will be off though and that is not good, and when Wenger employed the likes of Viera to do his teams' dirty work and kept on moaning about dirty players it just seems a bit rich to me.
But then I am old school.........a dinosaur, who admired my old man for soaking a leather ball for a few days before playing against a team that they knew were somewhat "lightweight"......
Arsene may advocate passing and attractive football but he is fully aware of the physical side as well and in many ways his archetypal player is powerful, strong and athletic= African or African origin which is why players such as Vieira were so important to him, as they are to most other teams as well. If you look at the French team which won the WC 1998 and EC 2002 this team was actually built around these type of players with highly skilled players such as Zidane and Djorkaeff etc added (I didn`t include Henry here because he never performs well for France, in fact I have always doubted him at the highest level or when it really matters)

I think Arsene has done all he can at Arsenal and should move on, I think he would have been the perfect choice as the English manager far more so than Capello, as he knows the English game inside out but thinks more like a European and would take on the England job with great pride rather than Capello who is just in it for the money.
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Old Nov 23rd 2008, 1:16 am
  #41  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by lardyl View Post
bit like the jocks did in erm............1900 then?
England have been there and there abouts in too many competitions to rule them out over the next 15 years....semis and quarters count I reckon??
Jocks and Irish - well they are and look like they will remain at another level........Sweaties never got past the first round of a W/C and the Paddys fluked it....... which about sums it up: miserable Jocks who love England to lose and lucky Irish who'll take anyone to wear the jersey.......

As far as coaching goes there is some work afoot over here in NZ with the small sided game ideas spreading, - didn't stop me having to argue for smaller pitches for our year 1/2s (they started as big as our men's 7-a-side ones! for kids 5-v-5 no goalies......sheesh.....) and had to take the size 5 ball out of my bag that came from the club and get as many size 3s as possible for the 5,6 and 7 year olds to train with.

Never got chance to coach in UK so can't say too much......as my young 'un wasn't allowed to join the vilalge club until he turned 8!

As far as style of play goes us over 40s still playing 11-, 5- and 7-a-side have graduated to the route-1 / if its fast then kick it / give the other player a taste of what's to come, school of thought as its the only way to keep the kids of today down.

Also can we have heavier balls please, that would help me at least......
We're shite but at least we dont fool ourselves that we're world beaters. 55-60 million population as opposed to Scotland and Irelands 5 and you are gloating. The most money ever put into a league will always attract players from other countries and dilute the choices open to the national manager. You gloat you have the best league in the world then moan when you dont have enough English playing in the starting eleven. Under industrial laws, players can play anywhere in Europe they want and that is the problem. Who wants to watch an average English player when they can watch better, more entertaining overseas players. So accept you are nowhere near the best and no foreign coach is going to make you world beaters then the world will be better with less of your blinkered, we are no 1 in the world, shite. The empire is gone and wont be coming back so LIVE WITH IT.
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Old Nov 23rd 2008, 1:43 am
  #42  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Who's gloating - just setting the record straight - England are underacheivers, as others have said and often chokers, stupid - a la Beckham vs Argentina, Rooney vs. Portugual, etc, etc..., with donkeys leading them.......no doubt about it - but you write them off at your peril.......

And - if last week is anything to go by - at least we don't need to gloat over the "hand of God" and build that up, wearing Argentina shirts to make ourselves feel good.....and slagging off one of our national team's coaches for being man enough to say he can't forgive and forget..... talk about the enemy of my enemy - I was shouting on Scotland in 1978 BTW not cheering for Peru, the Dutch, etc......

Some of my best footballing mates (team-mates that is!) are sweaties and paddys (well Kiwi-paddies at least) and yes they play heart on sleeve, 110% and they can give and take it.......pity not all scots football fans can.........
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Old Nov 23rd 2008, 10:36 am
  #43  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by framac67 View Post
We're shite but at least we dont fool ourselves that we're world beaters. 55-60 million population as opposed to Scotland and Irelands 5 and you are gloating. The most money ever put into a league will always attract players from other countries and dilute the choices open to the national manager. You gloat you have the best league in the world then moan when you dont have enough English playing in the starting eleven. Under industrial laws, players can play anywhere in Europe they want and that is the problem. Who wants to watch an average English player when they can watch better, more entertaining overseas players. So accept you are nowhere near the best and no foreign coach is going to make you world beaters then the world will be better with less of your blinkered, we are no 1 in the world, shite. The empire is gone and wont be coming back so LIVE WITH IT.
This thread more or less sums up the state of the English national side. You look at the major national teams (Brazil, Argentina, Germany, France, Italy and Spain) All major footballing countries with important leagues and tradition BUT all reguarly win things or are there or thereabouts in major tournaments(Spain only this year though) The problem is England will always want to be part of this elite group and will never accept that they aren`t and that is where the problem lies.

Their league at the moment may well be the most important of all the above but their national team falls well short of the above countries. If England were to accept that their national team was a level down from the above national sides then maybe some progress could be made with lesser expectations......................Somehow though I don`t see this happening especially by a country that invented the game.
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Old Nov 23rd 2008, 10:42 am
  #44  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Originally Posted by lardyl View Post
Who's gloating - just setting the record straight - England are underacheivers, as others have said and often chokers, stupid - a la Beckham vs Argentina, Rooney vs. Portugual, etc, etc..., with donkeys leading them.......no doubt about it - but you write them off at your peril.......

And - if last week is anything to go by - at least we don't need to gloat over the "hand of God" and build that up, wearing Argentina shirts to make ourselves feel good.....and slagging off one of our national team's coaches for being man enough to say he can't forgive and forget..... talk about the enemy of my enemy - I was shouting on Scotland in 1978 BTW not cheering for Peru, the Dutch, etc......

Some of my best footballing mates (team-mates that is!) are sweaties and paddys (well Kiwi-paddies at least) and yes they play heart on sleeve, 110% and they can give and take it.......pity not all scots football fans can.........
Over the years I have known a lot of Scots and would go as far to say that I find them the most friendliest of all in the UK BUT when it comes to England..................They don`t hold back:curse:

Several years ago when Beckham was tackled by Duscher in a Euro tie and was injured there was the inmediate threat that he would miss the 2002 World Cup. The following day after this incident a Scottish collegue of mine took me down to the bar to buy me a drink and to celebrate
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Old Nov 23rd 2008, 11:13 am
  #45  
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Default Re: this is why englands football team will be one of the best in 15 years time

Yeah, our sweaties don't mess about on the field but are the salt of the earth. My family are part scots and we ahve had many a great time with that side of the family - my favourite uncle (named me son after him) had a slice of wembley turf in his garden, and he was a hell of a gardener BTW.
But they do get hung up on the rivalry with the English and its the old story of the big guy next door - maybe a little harsh but all the symptoms are there - IN SOME CASES.

As far as England reaching the top flight with the Germans, French, etc. The other night shows that in Berlin England are pretty good and your point regarding Spain is pretty well made - England are more consistent than the Spanish over the past 20 years. England could be up there with the rest of that group with a good manager/coach *at the right time*.

Seems that we've had the wrong one when the players were good enough, and we've had some bad breaks in the competitions, 90, 96, 98, 06 all spring to mind - no excuses and I don't think we deserved much more at those (except 90 and 96 perhaps?) but we would have been pretty good value as finalists in at least one of those tournaments.....IMHO of course.

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