Hello all,
newbie here.

I might taking a job teaching english and moving to Parma. I wont to ask anyone how lives in Parma what is the city like? are parma poeple "snobby" i heard they can be?
what are the Parmans like?
what is the average cost of living?
my wage will be 1200/month, is this enough for two people?
can i rent my own apartment?
will i have to share accommodation?
how expensive is it to eat out?

my main concern is that 1200 is not enough to life off.

tnx

Ciao Manalisha, and welcome to the forum. 1200 Euro a month is not a lot to live off in the North; but lots of people have to manage on less.
What are your qualifications for TEFL?
ciao for now,
'o nonno

I do not live in Parma, but can honestly tell you that living on 1,200 euro a month for 2 people is tough if you have to pay rent.
Yes, many people survive on less, but they are Italians with their network of support-live with parents so do not pay rent/mortgage, grandparents helping with grandkids needs, etc.

ononno,
i have a Celta TEFL. I'm in talks with thedawsongroup.it about working as an in-house teacher in Parmalat or Barilla. The contract is a co-co-pro 1200 nett (imps and inail included). My partner is from Pescara and so isn't familiar about living costs in Parma, she has also been living outside italy for 6 years with me.

I'm aware of the real Italian "social security" = the family network. This makes me even more nervous about costs of living. It's a disgrace that a developed economy like Italian abuses it's citizens like this... but that's another thread to discuss.

Average rent seems to be 500-600 in parma, am i right?
after bills it looks like we'll have 100euro a week expendable income between 2. is that the norm?

my partner will have to get a job in parma. she is a graphic/ web designer with experience working in NGO sector and architecture. does anyone know where someone would start to look for this work in parma. Is there this kind of work around in parma area?

another question for all is one of location;
how close are piacenza, modena and bologna?
how easy would it be to live in one of these cities and commute to parma?
can anyone suggest a vibrant city with a good job scene nearby to parma?

(i know good job scene is an oxymoron in the italian lexicon but thought i'd through it out there)

tnx for the replie

You're teaching English?! You can't even spell properly! LOL!
They must be pretty desperate!
Seriously speaking, I received a job offer a few years back to work in Parma at a school called Interlingua. But the costs were prohibitive. If your OH can get work then you could do it but 1.200pm between the 2 of you is too little.

Hi,

Architecture as other sectors in Milan or rest of Italy, struggle,( there's work but you get paid peanuts) I can't imagine in Parma...
You are expected to work, not counting the hours.. you have to open a partita iva, so it looks like you are not fully employed by the practise, as in reality you are,(working in their office 5/7 full-time) ; moreover there's No paid holidays, No sick leave, nothing...In most cases it's like working for the glory ( I'm not able to find better words to describe that)
I got back to Italy a few months ago and I'm telling you that I'm kind of lucky having a family business, otherwise as architect I would have never and ever got back to Italy..
Things in uk haven't been really good lately in uk, but as soon as the crisis is over, I'm sure they will get back to normal..
I hope your girl will be lucky enough to get something better than the average..

tnx ambra_wandsworth,
so the architecture industry is in the doldrums, i kinda knew this. i'm going to have to register as sole trader and work on a co-co-pro (collaborazione continuativo progetto). As you said I'll have a quasi-employee status with all the advantages to the employer.

I suppose I'm kinda asking are there any professional jobs at all in the area Parma, Modena, Piacenza, Bologna etc for a italian graphic designer with fluent enlgish and 3 years experience in ireland.

How much were you earning Duffer? and much do you think we'd need to get by? 2000 total income from the two of us?


ps. The word "But" is a conjunction and should only be used when connecting two grammatical clauses. eg. I know how to spell but I don't bother correcting posts when I'm speedtyping on internet forums.

Can I use this please?? I've noticed that, because I pick up on other people's grammar mistakes, they come down me like a ton of bricks when I make a 'typo'.... I've even got Italian students who seem to feel better when they correct my Italian.... even though they are the ones paying me to correct their mistakes in English...

Haha. Not only can't you spell but you're preaching the use of old fashioned English. So you should know it's been considered acceptable to start a sentence with a conjunction for many years, particularly in informal situations. But-tocks.

Manalishi, Duffer is usually joking/saying things tongue in cheek on the forums-once you get to know him he is harmless.
I get annoyed when people say "should of" or "there house" as for me this shows lack of proper grammar, but spelling mistakes are made by all of us, especially when typing.

Regarding architecture jobs, our architect who has worked for us for over 5 years announced last week that he is moving to Paris with his wife who is a solicitor and fluent in French. When I asked him why he was moving, I expected he would say for more money, but his answer was:" I am completely fed up with the things in this country, it is impossible to work here, we have a clown for a president and I want a better life elsewhere". He is Italian by the way.
I asked why he did not choose London as he understands English, and he said because of 2 things-the climate and the food.

isakat,
I've heard so many stories like that from architects, engineers and other professionals. One theory is that the universities are producing too many graduates for a dwindling labour market and so there is a race to the bottom. Personally I think the "Tempo Indeterminato" contract system protects a few at the cost of a wider fluid labour market. My partner was shocked here in Ireland when, after the crash, architect firms started to let people go without any punitive recourse for the workers. That's because she had only known the Italian system of the hallowed "Tempo Indeterminato" contract. The other factor is the welfare state. The dole acts like a protective floor under wages. In Ireland the income level you drop to on the dole is very low but reasonable for all so there is no race to the bottom.

fingers crossed for parma. I just got my contract now...
16.70e / hr (13e after tax at 20%)
30hrs/wk

I work it out at 1600 a month... that sounds ok?

So I have to take my own IMPS out of that then I presume

Yes I wouldn't harm a fly. But I'll skin a cat alive!

OT In my opinion if you state you are an English teacher, then make spelling or grammatical errors, you're asking for trouble! Like police officers who park on double yellows to pop in a shop to buy a pack of fags, if it were anyone else (apart from traffic wardens - but even they aren't THAT stupid to keep their uniforms on when they're off duty) people wouldn't even bat an eyelid.

I agree about the tempo indeterminato, but I've never heard of it applied to design/architecture jobs at least nowadays..work should be more flexible,but we would need some basic rules to avoid silly form of contracts, although I believe one of the reasons things are generally like that is because the cost of a full employee for a firm is massive in this country.

I don't agree 100% with uk system anyway, in case of redundancy for example, I believe private companies should take some responsabilities, obviously not paying a salary for a year,or so; as it would happen in Italy for a permanent job; but at least for 2/3 of months, to give the time to people to find something else and not leave everything on the Council's back (that provides benefits or allowances paid by the Community).

That's true we do have lots of graduates in general, I believe if it was easier to get jobs like in Uk at younger age, it would be slightly different.
I go nuts when I listen to some people slightly younger than me, talking on political debats about the "posto di lavoro",some have the same mentality as their fathers,thinking that is something due by the government, but they've never got out of this country, never looked for a challenge.

Anyway, the best advice I can give to your girlfriend is to not look strictly at architecture practises, she should check if there are any international big companies around Milan, like consultancies, working on big developments, as they may have a design team as well.

Be careful here. You said your contract is co.co.pro. Tax isn't 20%. You pay 23% up to €15,000 then 28% up to €28,000. Then you have to take off INPS. I think there are some allowances which mean you pay a little less but if the school says you will be getting €1200 net, that's probably about right. Are your 30 hours a week guaranteed? 30 hours are an awful lot for teaching. When are you supposed to do lesson planning? Do you get paid holidays or will August be an income-free month?