Mustard

I'm a member of the Spanish forum but I would be really grateful if somebody could translate this short letter that I have received from INPS. I worked in Italy for 4 years about 30 years ago and it seems to be related to my pension claim.

ATTENZIONE: questa copia viene inviata por conoscenza
Gentili Signori,
in riferimento alla Vostra lettera del 01/11/2019 Vi inviamo quanto segue:
IL MODELLO E205 RELATIVO AL LAVATORE IN OGGETTO
Restando a disposizione por ogni ulteriore comunicazione, porgiamo distinti saluti.



Thank you in advance for any help.

philat98

It says you have to fill in the E205 form and send it back to the INPS.

Mustard

That's good.
Thank you very much

Geordieborn

Your INPS should be used to calculate any EU pension you have entitlement to by virtue of working in any particular EU country. If the E205 (which is an insurance record) has an option to fill in all your work no matter what country, then you should. I suspect the Italians are looking at your Italy claim. Any claim, made in any EU country should trigger off a claim in all others if you have told them you worked in such.

GeorgeYoung

Sorry to gainsay you Phil but does it not say that a copy of the E205 form has been sent to an organisation?

I would translate it as follows:

NOTE: this copy is for information
Dear Sir/Madam,
In reply to your letter of 01/11/2019, please find attached the following:
THE E205 FORM FOR THE WORKER IN QUESTION
We remain at your disposal for any further comunications, kind regards.

philat98

The OP has missed out some information. The E205 might be completed or empty. Also INPS has taken 1 year to reply. Slow even by Italian standards.

GeorgeYoung

Would this be a form that the authorities from another country would have requested to provide proof of contributions in a different EU state? That was my assumption. Like you say, a very long response time!

Geordieborn

It's an EU wide insurance record which is indeed passed between insurance authorities (DWP overseas in the UK). My task in another life was to make calculations based on these forms. For a pension claim (they are also used for other benefit claims) made in the likes of the UK, typically the national form would asked if you have every worked abroad (UK also has agreements with other non-EU countries), they would then ask, in the case of an EU country, for an E205 by the issue of an E202 (accepted by all EU countries as a pension claim form) to the countries involved. This is routine, but often takes an age, and yes, Italy in particular was the worst responding. The further south the worse it would be, we would issue an E202 to Italy, then put the papers away for 6 months.....

Serrano

For what it's worth, I have a claim in with INPS for which they needed my contribution records from the UK; time taken for the UK to respond to INPS - 19 months

ononno

Lucky you. Way back INPS claimed they had been waiting 5 years for my details from Newcastle.

Geordieborn

I wonder. I seem to recall a story many years back coming out of the Palermo INPS office that a guy at the airport had been arrested for selling bags of post to a waste paper company and this was the reason for long delays. There were certainly delays in the UK when I worked there as overtime was constant due to the backlog. However, as bad as it was I doubt any case took more than 2 monts to deal with. Ononno could it be you were claiming that long ago that the Italian age for retirement was 60 (it used to be an awfully low age)? If so, I would suggest INPS did not bother until the UK started action on your UK RP and sent the E205(UK) to them… These days I would be most surprised if the UK took 1 month let alone 19 as it should all be done automatically by computer.

GeorgeYoung

19 months is probably less time than the average hold time when ringing HMRC!

Mustard

That seems to make more sense.

My pension claim is a bit complicated as I had worked in UK, Italy and Spain and I made a bit of a horlicks of the application due to, amongst other things, the fact I had lost all documentation of my Italian work history so I had more or less written it off.

Then there was the lockdown and the fact that the Spanish Social Security system is working in a limited way. To resolve a problem you have to book an appointment online but of course there are no appointments available.

calman014

Tip for anyone running into this kind of problem: If you visit the EU website and look for information on pensions, you will see that pension applications normally have to be done in your country of residence.
If you have a history of working in different EU countries, the Social Security authorities of your country of residence are supposed to take care of this for you once you have supplied relevant info such as insurance ID numbers etc. They can then call up details of your working history from the relevant member states.
If you had short periods of work in one country where you didn't qualify for the local pension scheme, your local organisation will piece it all together and build a combination of the pensions. I was a bit sceptical of this ruling at first, but it does seem to work. (I am in NL).

nicktonight

This thread comforted me a bit as I am (almost) becoming a last-minute brexiter because of two giant administrative problems I am having with France and Italy: with France and Italy about my pension and with Italy for making it so difficult for me to do my job. Perhaps then the UK is just as bad in some areas??. Concerning pensions, as clearly pointed out by Calman014, pension applications must be made in the country of residence. I first made my application for the French part of my pension in France. My application was refused at first as they told me it should not be made until 3 months before the retirement date and when they finally read my application they informed me that it had to be made in Italy i.e. INPS. Like all things with INPS this was very complicated to do but with the help of a Patronato I successfully submitted my application in October 2019, on the exact date I reached my pension age. The official date that INPS sent this document to France was 10 January 2020. The official date of reception of my application by the French Pension office was 28 April 2020. Since then I have rung the French office several times, but now 13 months after reaching my pension age not only have I no pension but I have also been unable to make my Italian pension application without official confirmation of the years I have worked in France. I should add that there are absolutely no hidden problems in my French pension contribution history and every year since coming to Italy I have received the same summary document about the years I have worked and the amount of my future pension.