Bermudashorts

Certainly your wife is not entitled to citizenship on account of being married to an Australian. If that were the case, there would be no need for visas or ministerial rulings. So there needs to be something else, a stronger tie than that. An Australian company temporary posting, might provide such a tie.

Anyway, these conversations have been ongoing for more than 18 months, maybe just wait and see what happens. Good luck.

astera

I see what you mean, but are they really going to grill my wife about the specifics of my job and the company itself, its business structure, shareholder structure, etc.?

It is not possible to reside in Singapore unless the company is a local entity. The same applies to most countries. Of course it can be owned by a foreign entity (even a subsidiary is nothing more than a local company owned by overseas investors) as that plays no difference in terms of local law, but ultimately everything is always done on a local level. Regardless of whether we're looking at Singapore, Australia or elsewhere.

I am in a position where I am not allowed to resign by law unless there is a replacement that can take over straight away. Also, even if I could just resign and move to Australia from day one of her becoming PR, am I expected to do so on an 'unemployed basis', without securing a job in Australia beforehand?

This is just stating the obvious - of course nobody is entitled to anything. Here the focus is strictly on racking up the days spent in Australia as all other criteria for becoming an Australian citizen have been met.

As mentioned, you cannot live in Singapore (or most countries in the world) unless you are employed by a local company. Also, all such jobs are always temporary... there is no such thing as a permanent job if you do not even have the right to work or even reside in a country indefinitely.

Bermudashorts

No need to be rude. You have been banging on about this for 18 months now and certainly seem to have a sense of entitlement about you. Will leave you to it.

Pollyana

Where did I say thst? All I am saying is that uf the reason you are abroad is because your job is with the Aus Govt or an Aus company, that will aid your wife's claim for citizenship to be granted without the residency requirement. They won't be interested in Singapore's position, but if you, as her partner, had been working 'for Australia' it would have helped.

BritInParis

If your wife becomes a PR by entering Australia on a subclass 100 visa and then returns to Singapore to live then she won't be able to become an Australian citizen in four years' time unless you can show a continuing and close association to Australia, i.e. a posting abroad by an Australian company or the Australian government.

There's obviously some back story here I'm not aware of but if your intention is to reside together in Singapore it begs the question as to why your wife applied for a family migrant visa for Australia.

JAJ

No. You're the one who is going to have to convince a case officer, not the other way around. Have you read the Citizenship Instructions? Based on the Instructions, it is highly unlikely that citizenship will be granted unless the 1 year physical presence requirement is met. If it is, then the applicant still need to make the case for a "close and continuing association".

It is unfortunate that was intended as a facility to deal with special circumstances relating overseas-resident spouses of Australian citizens has come to be viewed as some kind of entitlement to citizenship by marriage.


Not allowed to resign? Really?


Singapore does offer Permanent Resident status, although this may carry a National Service obligation.

Pollyana

Missed this bit earlier, but felt I had to come back and say that in fact that's what most migrants do

astera

By the time the application is made I would say that the majority of the 4 yrs would have been spent in Australia. So I'm not looking at some sort of total exception from living in Australia - we would actually be resident for over 2+ years by the time the forms are sent in. Basically just looking to fill the gaps so to speak...

Not sure whether the discretion was primarily intended for special circumstances as time spent outside of Australia with one's other half would usually be for job-related reasons. I would say this is the most common of circumstances, but then maybe the discretion wasn't aimed at this when it was introduced?

A company director cannot resign unless there is someone new to take over seamlessly. Emergency situations aside, it is not legally possible to leave a company without a (resident) director.

Singapore PR is one of those semi-permanent schemes that has been stripped down over the years. It is quite popular though, especially among those who never intend to become citizens.

astera

Could well be, but this is a tricky one. Certainly those who try to make it via the 'sea route' don't have any jobs lined up for them upon arrival.

On a serious note a lot of movement is still due to job offers overseas (even within the EU) and sometimes people decide to make the move permanent/long-term. Migration to Singapore is also mainly focused on this approach - people coming over for employment reasons, and then applying to stay longer or make the move permanent.

But as you mentioned some people (maybe most as you say) just take the plunge and hope everything works out on the spot (probably why the gov't wants you to demonstrate financial sustainability... just in case).

In my case I am the Australian with an overseas job and she is stuck here with me due to my work. And that is the only factor that has delayed our move. We are moving in March/April though, so things are finally in motion...

msmyrtle

I really hope that this doesn't mean what I think you are implying

Dorothy

So what are they going to do? If you're leaving Singapore then you resign and leave the same day. Do you really think the company is going to have you arrested and extradited to Singapore because you resigned without having someone to take the job over? Seriously?

astera

Is that how you would do it? Seriously?

You cannot resign until there is another director in place. So you would just leg it without resigning? The company also needs to do tax clearance for you before you leave, and you need to inform the Ministry of Manpower that you will no longer be employed.

There are a number of steps to take and I intend to leave in an orderly way without burning bridges behind me. Everything is all set anyway, just counting down the days now to be honest.

JAJ

The discretion was never intended to allow citizenship by entitlement based simply on marriage to an Australian citizen. Hence there is a policy which requires, in general, at least 1 years presence in Australia in order for the discretion to be considered. The Australian Citizenship and Other Legislation Amendment Bill 2014 will put this 1 year requirement into the law. Extract from the Parliamentary Secretary's speech in the House of Representatives, on Second Reading.

"The bill also clarifies the scope of the ministerial discretion to allow overseas absences to count towards the residence requirement for spouses and de facto partners of Australian citizens. It was a guiding principle in the new Citizenship Act in 2007 that partners should qualify for citizenship in their own right, not just as the partner of a citizen. The bill therefore entrenches the policy position that the discretion should only be considered if the applicant has spent at least 365 days in Australia in the four years immediately before application. It is important that applicants spend a sufficient amount of time here to understand what being Australian means. Indeed, they must have a connection to Australia, not just to an Australian. The bill also inserts definitions of spouse and de facto partner, aligning them with the definitions in the Migration Act."

This revised law would still be a generous concession to the spouses of Australian citizens. Effectively, it still requires 4 years of permanent residence, but allows much of this time to be spent outside Australia. A lot more than would be the case for those not married to an Australian.

gdoubleu

When considering the ministerial discretion in the context of obtaining the citizenship, how important is it that the Australian partner is physically with you when overseas?

I am asking since I am about the reach the 4-year mark, all boxes are checked except for the 90-day rule on Australian soil within 12 months prior to the application. In fact, my job is such that I routinely spend 90+ days overseas (but less than 120) overseas on any given year.

JAJ

Read section 5.18 of the Australian Citizenship Instructions.
http://www.citizenship.gov.au/_pdf/acis-july-2014.pdf

I do not see any requirement in either the Act, or the Instructions, that the Australian spouse/partner be physically accompanying you. However, you should be prepared to present strong evidence that the relationship is genuine and continuing, and that your home is in Australia.

If you meet the residence requirement of 365 days (including at least 90 days as a permanent resident) then you should probably consider applying, if you want to take advantage of the s22(9) discretion. However, there are no guarantees.

Also read section 10.6.2 of the Instructions concerning overseas police checks.